tstage ...So, what's going to happen to the old layout room once you vacate it for the loft? I got dibs. Tom
...So, what's going to happen to the old layout room once you vacate it for the loft? I got dibs.
Tom
Tom, my wife gets that corner of the basement back. The overhead track lighting would be great for her quilting and sewing. After I harvest from it what I can, and take apart the modules and cart them out, I have to prime and repaint the walls higher up where the backdrop shows, and also replace a length of baseboard that swelled when I had a perimeter drainage problem six years ago and the basement leaked in that corner. Personally, having the train room just inches away from a very hot wood stove, plus the hot GU-10 lighting...it was just too much during the very months when running trains seemed like a good idea....but rarely was.
Crandell
Crandell, hope your OK, I feel your pain, have peeled the skin off my palm once when rushing to change bits w/ a Milwalkee holeshooter. I must have be an idiot to think I was going to unchuck that bit in reverse. Dah, I used the chuck key to put it in...
At least today w/ all the wonderful cordless drills and impacts along w/ the quick change bits it doesn't happen as much.
Work safe, and watch out for that chop saw too.
Modeling B&O- Chessie Bob K. www.ssmrc.org
Now that is dedication - building benchwork by flashlight because the power is off!
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Boy! You're moving right along, Crandell. Always nice to have another pair of hands to lighten the load and speed up the work.
So, what's going to happen to the old layout room once you vacate it for the loft? I got dibs.
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
My son-in-law asked if I would like some help over the weekend, so while the two ladies went shopping, he and I went at the work. We got a lot done. We built the helix frame and legs, and all the other top-frames for the rest of the layout. My job over the next week is to place legs on all the appropriate places, invert the modules, and then fix them in place and against each other via carriage bolts. I will work on the helix first since it is the diciest item for me. Once it is in place as a helix, I can continue to lay track all around and do the wiring.
It has been howling in the Pacific NW for days, so we had to work indoors...by flashlight since we use cordless tools and the power was off for three hours. The floor is littered with shavings and sawdust...another chore ere long.
This is what it looked like the next morning, Monday 23 January.
That's precisely what I went to get about an hour ago, Randy, and for all those reasons. For one thing, it really slows down production having to change between the drill bit and the Robertson screw-head bit all the time. Also, it gets a bit dangerous because we tend to put our minds to other matters upcoming, or thinking back to what we did not long ago as a second guess, and not on what we are doing. So, I now have a Makita twin-pack with 18 volt cordless drill/driver and an impact driver.
Except that now I can't get the duplicate Duplex from BLI that should be brought to the market in a few weeks. It all went into the Makita drivers.
Nobody said you can have it all.
That's why you're not supposed to hold the chuck and power on the drill to tighten or loosen bits. Of course, it's what we all do, at least with battery power tools.
One lesson I learned - next time I'm getting a second power drill, changing bits from drill to driver and back constantly is a pain. It was ok until I broke the 3/32 quick change one I had. Too late now, with just one 2x8 section to build. But when I start that dream layout - 2 is a MUST.
I have had two accidents so far, one kinda not so bad, and the other not so good. First the not so good: removing the 3/32 drill bits from the chuck (I pre-drill all holes in milled lumber), I broke two by spinning them and not holding the chuck firmly. One of those times, it jabbed into my thumb and broke the skin in a couple of places. It could have been worse. I am more careful the last two days.
Second error was goofing on the heights of the legs. I kept in mind the height of the 1X4 framing on the perimeters of the frames, but for some reason I subtracted them instead of adding that height. So, the yard module, now complete minus bracing the 1X2 legs, now stubs, sits almost 4" lower than I had wanted. Thinking a bit, I realized that this was not so bad because it will give me more clearance for the back corner of the roundhouse against the batter of the inner wall of the loft. In fact, that one item is kind of important as a reference point. So, I will install the TT and 'house from my current layout, since they are salvagable, and see how tightly I can push the two joined modules against the wall. Means a lower layout, but still high enough for all the Christmas totes (we must have 68 of them at last count ).
Anyway, no biggie, no great loss, probably best for flexibility at this point, and I have my yard module erected.
Here is a photo showing the top frame of the next one on which the TT and 'house will be located. Note that the joists are just for vertical support to prevent the surface 1/2" ply from sagging, and NOT for bracing as such. Hence the butt joint midway along the one joist. This is 1X4, plenty strong.
Doughless selector: In fact, I'll probably have to squat and work on my knees much of the time. When actually running it later, I could sit on a wheeled dolly of some kind on that smooth floor to ease my viewing height and my back. Crandell, It looks like you'll have a nice layout. I'm interested to follow how the 29" height will work out. Personally, I think it will be an advantage to operate the layout while sitting on a wheeled dolly rather than having to stand. I have a layout that is slight larger than what you're planning, and at 48 inches high, it requires me to stand most of the time when working on the surface features and while operating, which can get tiring. I assume your previous layout was at standing height, so it will be interesting to hear the pluses and minuses with the lower height and which one you prefer overall.
selector: In fact, I'll probably have to squat and work on my knees much of the time. When actually running it later, I could sit on a wheeled dolly of some kind on that smooth floor to ease my viewing height and my back.
In fact, I'll probably have to squat and work on my knees much of the time. When actually running it later, I could sit on a wheeled dolly of some kind on that smooth floor to ease my viewing height and my back.
Crandell,
It looks like you'll have a nice layout. I'm interested to follow how the 29" height will work out. Personally, I think it will be an advantage to operate the layout while sitting on a wheeled dolly rather than having to stand.
I have a layout that is slight larger than what you're planning, and at 48 inches high, it requires me to stand most of the time when working on the surface features and while operating, which can get tiring.
I assume your previous layout was at standing height, so it will be interesting to hear the pluses and minuses with the lower height and which one you prefer overall.
28-30" is a common height for desks these days. In fact, mine at which I am now sitting is 28-1/2" high. You don't need a dolly but an inexpensive secretarial chair with casters and the usual adjustable seat height. Not a bad height for working (perhaps raise the seat to improve reach) and a good height for operating (lower the seat).
Dante
selector It would be best in the Layouts forum, and I have felt that for the past couple of days. Unless Mark objects, as the OP, I would be happy to see it moved. Crandell
It would be best in the Layouts forum, and I have felt that for the past couple of days. Unless Mark objects, as the OP, I would be happy to see it moved.
So be it, Alll Aboooaaaaard!
You know, I just noticed we don't have one of those smilie thingies with an engineer's hat.... funny thing, that, for a model railroading site, wouldn't you say??
John
selector In fact, I'll probably have to squat and work on my knees much of the time. When actually running it later, I could sit on a wheeled dolly of some kind on that smooth floor to ease my viewing height and my back.
- Douglas
Dumb question - especially as moderators and former moderators are involved
Wouldn't this be more appropriate in the layout and layout building area? Just thinking that folks later on might have an easier time finding it.
I'm trying to model 1956, not live in it.
BATMAN selector: I had the place to myself (mwahahahaaa...!), and didn't have to watch endless reruns of HGTV's House Hunter series with her. Crandell I thought I was the only male on the face of the planet that had to endure the agony of these shows. Until HGTV hit the airwaves, wives did not require new kitchens and bathrooms every six months. Nice room Crandell. I am imagining that Selkirk plying its way around it now. The space appears to be about 25' x 12'. Am I close? Like others I am looking forward to watching your progress. Hey maybe this should be on HGTV! I would certainly stop squirming and would sit down with a cuppa. Good Luck! Brent
selector: I had the place to myself (mwahahahaaa...!), and didn't have to watch endless reruns of HGTV's House Hunter series with her. Crandell
I had the place to myself (mwahahahaaa...!), and didn't have to watch endless reruns of HGTV's House Hunter series with her.
I thought I was the only male on the face of the planet that had to endure the agony of these shows. Until HGTV hit the airwaves, wives did not require new kitchens and bathrooms every six months.
Nice room Crandell. I am imagining that Selkirk plying its way around it now. The space appears to be about 25' x 12'. Am I close?
Like others I am looking forward to watching your progress. Hey maybe this should be on HGTV! I would certainly stop squirming and would sit down with a cuppa.
Good Luck!
Brent
You guys are looking at this all wrong-- you need to put a TV that gets HGTV and Food Network in the layout room so she can watch it while you work! The only problem is, if she spends too much time in there, you might walk in one day to a new layout "plan"!
And no Brent, unfortunately, you and Crendall aren't the only ones uncomfortably acquainted with House Hunter and Design Star...
Tom, you are not wrong. After six whole years with a too darned hot layout room (I heat the house with a wood furnace that gets the layout space up to 90+ degrees before the low speed fan circuit kicks in on the furnace), and that wretched duckunder, oh and the reach into the 'highlands' behind the yard level and depot where I have no fewer than five turnouts out of reach....yeah, the Selkirk really helped, LOL!
Michael, I think that's a capital idea! If it wouldn't look goofy, I'd make it a cinder cone like the ones we saw in Southern Chile two years ago. Inside the caldera would be the handle to lift off the top of the mountain for maintenance of the helix.
Crandell:
That helix looks suspiciously like CP's famed Spiral Tunnels, which means to me:
1: Either you bought the Selkirk for your new layout--or:
2: You're building the new layout for your Selkirk, LOL!
Either way, it looks VERY interesting!
Tom View my layout photos! http://s299.photobucket.com/albums/mm310/TWhite-014/Rio%20Grande%20Yuba%20River%20Sub One can NEVER have too many Articulateds!
Crandell, I think you should go for a nice sized SNOW SCENE on the new mountains!!! (maybe a frozen pond too).
Michael
CEO- Mile-HI-RailroadPrototype: D&RGW Moffat Line 1989
Mark, although the diagramme doesn't show it, the mains are actually going to be twinned. The inner is the one that will allow access to under-surface staging as you can probably see with the turning wye that crossed over itself in order to keep the curvature suitable for my brass Selkirk 2-10-4. Outboard of the main line at left that runs toward the helix, there will be another main. They climb at 2% to cross over themselves just inside the portal below them with a clearance just over 4". Subtracting the thickness of the 1/2" subroadbed plywood and the strips of the 1/8" vinyl underlay silencing layer, it leaves me with lots of overhead room, even for a pantograph.
So, the two sets of tracks, the twinned main and the access to the lower level staging, enter the helix at opposite ends of the helix. The staging enters at right, already descending before the 30 deg crossing, at a 2% grade by the time it gets to the portal on the right. Similarly, the twin mains enter on the opposite side, also climbing at 2% just after the tunnel entrance where the transition into the grade takes place. This keeps the 4+ inches of vertical separation inside the helix for the descending to staging route and the climbing to exit at the far left corner of the loft.
The building of the helix will be nothing like yours, certainly not as high or complicated...and fancy. It will have a single full turn, and I'm not sure how it will go together just yet. Brackets on uprights, maybe, held in an octagonal frame? T'will be a test of me mettle.
Interesting plan, Crandell.
Where does the helix lead? to staging underneath?
Mark P.
Website: http://www.thecbandqinwyoming.comVideos: https://www.youtube.com/user/mabrunton
Thanks for all your comments and encouragement, everyone.
Stebby, yes, I have accounted for the batter. Because the roof is hipped, I felt I would have to minimize the layout surface's height...nothing like the 49" of my last one. In fact, the best use of space seemed to me to place the layout's mean surface at 29". It seems quite low, but it allows for storage, around the walls boxed frames bolted to each other with carriage bolts and large washers, and still have some of the same lower wall angle to place a backdrop of sorts.
Notice in the lower left corner, the blue roll of something? It is 1/8" thick vinyl underlay. I was thinking of the same type of roadbed silencing layer as on my last layout which really worked well...and it didn't cost me a red cent. I went back to United Carpet who installed our basement flooring when we did the completion six years ago and told the guy behind the counter I was on the scrounge. They had just given me some odd ends last time, and did they have such things still? No, but he took me back to their warehouse, took down a roll of the same stuff, but blue now, and asked me how much I wanted. I assured him I would pay for new material, and wasn't looking for any freebies, only waste/scraps. He said it wasn't worth the paperwork, and to just tell him what I wanted. So, there's the roll. But, standing over it a couple of days ago, self thinks to self, that stuff could be used as a backdrop and wouldn't need anything but some sprayed-on clouds! So, I'm going to go back for more...probably to pay this time. I really would feel a lot better if they charged me for the 20 linear feet I'll need (with the material split lengthwise in half because I won't be able to use more than about 15" of backdrop height before the wall angle changes).
Here is the original track plan. Please remember that I am not a shelf switching kind of operator, and I don't particularly like building layouts. I enjoy running the trains and watching them move, particularly the steamers. So, this goes around the walls, will be the deepest by far at the yard (forgetting the helix for now), and will generally be easy to reach and to work on. In fact, I'll probably have to squat and work on my knees much of the time. When actually running it later, I could sit on a wheeled dolly of some kind on that smooth floor to ease my viewing height and my back.
My main goals were to eliminate a duckunder (yup, I'm finally over that phase, LOL), get a twinned main (for watching trains, remember?), and to have a solid crack at a working yard. I have found that I actually enjoy switching, just not mainly switching.
The yard, as depicted in the diagramme, is not what I currently contemplate. You can see that there is no lead, for example, and that's just about no-no #1 in the list of Cardinal No-no's. So, I have already revised and relaid it in tape, and it looks better. With my broad 40" curves at each corner of the loft, and since the whole length is only 21', it doesn't lend enough room for a really good long diamond configuration, for example. So, it will have an A/D and lead, several ladder tracks for storage and shipping, two accesses to the turntable this time, and I am going to build the Branchline Woodard NYS station for a new depot. Time to step up my detailing and painting/weathering.
I can already see that, as much as I would like to have the trains running and last bit of details added to the whole in about four months, it just won't happen. I have to build things, I want this one to work well, be wired well, and so on, and I would like it to look good, better than my knobby ground job extant. As a determined learner, I have to take my time. Maybe end of summer...who knows.
selector and didn't have to watch endless reruns of HGTV's House Hunter series with her. Crandell
and didn't have to watch endless reruns of HGTV's House Hunter series with her.
Don't ya hate that.
"Mess with the best, die like the rest" -U.S. Marine Corp
MINRail (Minessota Rail Transportaion Corp.) - "If they got rid of the weeds what would hold the rails down?"
And yes I am 17.
Not to be too critical, but I note that while you are laying out that trackplan on the floor, you seem to be getting awfully close to the outer walls in some areas.
I am assuming you are going to have the layout elevated by some dimension. And I also note that the walls of the loft are sloped, so that the higher up you lift the benchwork, the more constricted the space becomes. I hope you are allowing for that...
I have figured out what is wrong with my brain! On the left side nothing works right, and on the right side there is nothing left!
Hum, new layout out room and no heat? Think it is time to back up and regroup Crandell.
Looking forward to seeing the layout done in a timely fashion, say next 2 weeks?
I am really looking forward to seeing what you will come up with. Off all the great layout I have seen on this forum I would places yours in the top 5 %. Reason? Your old layout shows you don't have to have 150 + square feet of bench work to have a great layout.
Ken
I hate Rust
Crandell, Now the pressure is on. Now it will be tough to slack off!!.
Very nice space, must have been just screaming for a layout. Better than just filled w/ junk.
Is there some reason for that 16 degree tilt to the outer benchwork? Just wondering, different, and could make placing facia a bit difficult esspecially on any spots that may need to be taller due to any elevations.
If you don't get that miter saw, making a jig for the angle as mentioned will help. Setting a sliding bevel for every free cut can be a pain. I would suggest a piece of masonite/ 1/4" ply screwed to a 1x2. this can act as your preset 16 degree fence for all the cuts. Could even clamp it to the work if you like. As you use it you can figure just how far from the cut to set it (blade to saw table dimension).
Can't wait to see the progress, and remember- NO Pressure....
You make me feel like a slacker. Here you built, operated and outgrew a very nice layout, and I'm still mucking around in the Netherworld...
Of course, things in the construction department should start picking up speed soon. My health problems seem to be under control, and I finally finished my novel. (Yes, the lady got the hero...)
I solved the HGTV problem in my house, but the solution isn't universally applicable. I just got NHK (aka Japan TV) linked to our cable. (If your wife doesn't understand colloquial Japanese this won't be helpful)
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
selector ... Righ now it's in a state of rubberishness. Flexibility, that is. Crandell
... Righ now it's in a state of rubberishness. Flexibility, that is.
Is that an official MRRing terminology? I didn't find it in the glossary!
Congrats, Crandell!
Enjoy the Sn*w!!!
-G .
Just my thoughts, ideas, opinions and experiences. Others may vary.
HO and N Scale.
After long and careful thought, they have convinced me. I have come to the conclusion that they are right. The aliens did it.
.Crandell,
My wife watches NCIS and all the CSI's, messy, messy. I have a TV (MR videos and sports) near the workbench and tread mill, which are next to the layout room. AN ESCAPE.
I have a camp in the southern part of the state and mice used to be a problem. Now we put dryer sheets around and they haven't messed the place up for at least three years. Might help keep the little critters from trying to move into layout housing and sampling who knows what.
Hope you can keep the room warm. 27 would be balmy right now. Was -15 the other morning and suppose to head that way, but not quite that far tonight.
Good luck,
Richard
Darn, I knew I was forgetting something!!
I'll post it once it is finalized. Righ now it's in a state of rubberishness. Flexibility, that is.
By the way, I really ought to have thanked everyone for their interest and good wishes. Where are my manners?!
So, thanks everyone.
Do you have a track plan?
BATMAN ...Nice room Crandell. I am imagining that Selkirk plying its way around it now. The space appears to be about 25' x 12'. Am I close?... Good Luck! Brent
...Nice room Crandell. I am imagining that Selkirk plying its way around it now. The space appears to be about 25' x 12'. Am I close?...
Thanks, Brent. You are very close. It measures 22' x 13' at the floor, but because of the angled walls, the finished dimensions will be closer to 11 X 21, with the shorter length allowing a bit of clearance between a far wall baseboard heater under the large window, and also some at the sliding door.
I will be building this layout with frame sections that can be unbolted. I will use better wiring with terminal blocks for ease of deconstruction when it comes time to move.
The construction is 1X4 sides and joists, joists at 15.5", 1/2" flooring grade plywood surface, the legs are 1X2, and I am using blocking of waste ends of either of those to anchor the tops of the legs against frame corners. Except for some carriage bolts, I have most everything I will need.