layouts/signals.. ( 2 questions )

[Sperandeo]

Hello Brian,

As others have suggested, where to put signals is a big question. There really isn't a simple answer, and you need to start with some knowledge of how signals work. A couple of years ago I wrote an article to help people get started in this field, and you'll find it in the December 2002 "Model Railroader." Look for "Understanding railroad signals" on page 104.

Good luck,

Andy

[cwclark]

go to www.gatewaynmra.org and there is a basic explanation of signals and plans to scratch build them listed under "electronic projects"...it does require 6 signals per siding as Larry suggested...a target searchlight signal and two other block occupancy signals at each end of the siding if you want to do a real railroad..I like to do real railroads because it is the ultimate challenge to model the real thing..i like to take pictures at different locations on a railroad and then model what is in the pictures......Chuck

[ClinchValleySD40]

The mainline on my protofreelanced railroad is 600' long. Passing sidings are 20' long and there are two 20' single track blocks between sidings. Each siding will require 6 signals and the intermediate blocks will require two. I'm not going to do CTC at this time but will start with APB so I can get it rolling quicker.

The railroad is loosely (very loosely) based on the Clinchfield.

[johncolley]

You can combine the two and create a fictitious place on a real railroad. For example, on my portion of the Great Northern through the Cascades I have a mythical major yard, engine service, and industrial area where the center of the Cascade tunnel really is. That way I service Wenatchee and south, Spokane and east, Everett and north, and Seattle and south, as well as local industries. ' works for me!

[CBQ_Guy]

As you mentioned, it would "seem" simpler to create a ficticious railroad rather than copying a real one. Actually, though, the made up one is harder (at least to do convincingly) because you have to decide and figure out EVERYTHING. By following the prototype (the real one) they have already done all of that, so you just copy what they've done and you can't go wrong.

If you have a lot of knowledge of the prototype, you can more believabily create your own, and for some people, that's a LOT of fun. Just ask Allen McClelland or Tony Koester!

[Anonymous]

ABS, yards = pot's/dwarf signals. sidings.. oh, it will depend on how much human hands would normally destroy the signals if accidently hit, pretty much true for yards as well. And what I can afford (and already have.[;)])

thanks for the reply

QUOTE: Originally posted by dehusman

The placement of the signals depends on whether the dispatcher controls the signals and the siding/junction switches (CTC) or the signals just keep the trains from running into each other (ABS).

In CTC the switches at the ends of sidings and at junctions are normally controlled by the dispatcher. Each controled switch has a signal governing an entrance to the switch. At a siding there are three ways in (main from the east, main from the west, and from the siding) so there are 3 signals. At a crossover there are 4 ways into the switches (main 1 east, main 1 west, main 2 east, main 2 west) so there would be 4 signals.
In ABS another method tells the trains how far they can go (train orders or track warrants) so you have signals at each end of the siding on the main, one signal in each direction just beyond the switch. of the siding.
In both ABS and CTC there are "intermediate" signals located every 2-4 miles between the sidings.

Dave H.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Tyson

..........If i dont do that then i just dont feel like my road is realistic enough and that bothers me!

Actually that is exactly what I feel like.

part 2, as for the signals.. yeah, yeah, that's it.. not making fun, but that answer works..
I wasn't sure how much or how little to write out about the signals, part.. when I write too much I seem to confuse people. Not enough and [:I]


thanks for posting

[dehusman]

The placement of the signals depends on whether the dispatcher controls the signals and the siding/junction switches (CTC) or the signals just keep the trains from running into each other (ABS).

In CTC the switches at the ends of sidings and at junctions are normally controlled by the dispatcher. Each controled switch has a signal governing an entrance to the switch. At a siding there are three ways in (main from the east, main from the west, and from the siding) so there are 3 signals. At a crossover there are 4 ways into the switches (main 1 east, main 1 west, main 2 east, main 2 west) so there would be 4 signals.
In ABS another method tells the trains how far they can go (train orders or track warrants) so you have signals at each end of the siding on the main, one signal in each direction just beyond the switch. of the siding.
In both ABS and CTC there are "intermediate" signals located every 2-4 miles between the sidings.

Dave H.

[der5997]

The other Armstong book that will be of help if you can get it is "All about signals".

My preference, real road, locale of my choosing.
Signals where they look good, and maybe tell me something I need to know about where my trains are (hidden track occupancy).

[Big_Boy_4005]

Railroads are divided up into blocks along their mainlines. A mainline wouldn't have 60 switches between towns. A mainline between towns may not have one switch. Blocks vary in length from a couple of miles to maybe 5 miles. You need to go study a real railroad, you have some interesting misconceptions. Track Planning For Realistic Operation by the late John Armstrong would help you understand a lot better.

[Anonymous]

Can't answer your second question, but I would prefer creating a ficticious line, that way I do not have to worry if it looks like the prototype or not. If my skill allows, I'd also like to create my own railroad name and paint sheme.

[Anonymous]

My personal preference is a fictious rail line but because of my partial lack of imagination i always pick holes in the plausability of my own road! Thats why when i create my fictious railroad i have think through logical reasons for the why's, how's, when's, etc of its equipment, route, and other things that make it what it is. If i dont do that then i just dont feel like my road is realistic enough and that bothers me! A bit of a shortfall on my part some of the times when i dont feel like being super realistic!!

Anyhow, as for your second question not every turnout needs to have signals associated with them. I'm no expert but the way i see it is signals in general usually control the main lines and tracks that join or cross the main lines. Other signals such as dwarf signals are often found along secondary tracks at major junctions, yards, terminals and the like. A quiet branch line however would probably have few, if any, signals at all. For better info there is bound to be someone on this forum that has a much better idea of what their talking about though!! hehe

[Anonymous]

i can't answer your second question, but I can say that I prefer modeling a real railroad but not in a real place.
Reed

[Anonymous]

1. In ANYONE'S personal opinion/preference, do u prefer modeling after a real railroad or creating a fictitious one? (which by the way seems easier.)
AND
2. Just where do u put the signals? ( no one say duh..) I mean say u had 60 switches and long stretches between towns, that would probably be 100+ signals, or if you didn't have the cash, 30+ signals. I thought they basically were like 3 signals per switch and a few scattered here and there.. (scale is N)