1x4 or 2x4?

[dstarr]

 

indiana rr

 In many of the layout plans I parouse, I see that the benchwork is a 1x4 skeleton.  Why do most use 1x4 instead of 2x4s?

'Cause 1*4 is plenty strong enough.  2*4's are strong enough to hold up a house.  Your model railroad, even with you climbing on top of it, is nowhere as heavy as a house.  If you add a 1*2 flange to the 1*4  (Lynn Westcott's L girder design) it adds even more strength.  The flange prevents buckling under load. 

  Someone suggested getting a radial arm saw or a table saw to help with bench work.  Good quality used ones are plentiful on Craigs List for $100 and less.  Long as they run, quietly and without vibration, and aren't too rusty, they will work fine and last a long time.  And they make construction so much easier.  You can rip boards down to fit, and the crosscuts come out smooth and square.  

[mobilman44]

Hi!

I tend to overkill, making certain that my 225 lbs could be supported if/when I crawl over the layout.  So, my last layout and the current one under construction use 2x2s, with about 50 of them for an 11x15 layout.  I find they work extremely well, and are easy to manipulate.  Note the layout is in a spare room on the second floor of my house.

The basement layouts I built while living in Illinois all used 2x4 legs.  Thinking back, I used them because weight was not a problem, they were readily available, and made an extremely solid structure.

I certainly can't be critical of what anyone else uses, for as my dear ol Dad used to say, "there is more than one way to skin a cat"!

ENJOY,

Mobilman44

[jbinkley60]

I used 1x3s with 2x2 legs and it is plenty strong enough.  I'd suggest the 1x4s.  Some folks have ripped 2x4s down to 1x4s because of the cost but you have to have a saw which will support this. 

 

[willy6]

I just got done with my 8' x 10' benchwork. I used 2 x 4's with 3/8' carriage bolts, #14 x 3 wood screws and  bolted it to the wall with 1/4 x 3" lag bolts and 1/2 ' plywood top. It's sturdy. I had most of the 2 x 4's and hardware in my shed, that's why I used them otherwise it would have been 1 x 4's.

[jamnest]

I use 1x4 for layout construction, but have my lumber yard rip a sheet of 3/4" plywood into 8 foot strips of 1x4 lumber.  All of the lumber is straight and I don't have to worry about knots in the wood.  I use "domino" construction and use a chop saw to cut the lumber into pieces for the dominos. 

[EM-1]

An idea some years back in MR suggested a compromise,  If one has access to a table saw, get straight 2 X 4s, and with a couple cuts, end up with an 8' L girder and an 8' long 1 X 3 for crossmembers from each length without the work of screwing or nailing two pieces of 1 X  lumber together to make the girders.  Saves screws and nails, and the work involved in keeping the edges ligned up while joining the pieces.  2 pieces of useble lumber from one, instead of buying 3 separate pieces.

[IRONROOSTER]

grizlump9

 when i was buying 1x4 and 1x3 lumber a few years ago, i found the best quality at lowes.  they didn't care if you picked through it since it was self service anyway.  i don't know if they still have the good stuff or if it is available at all locations but if they have a store near you it would be worth checking out.

  my hick town has 2 lumberyards and they both sell junk.  you have to chase the squirrels out of it before you can cut it.

  on another note, i would avise anyone starting a large sized model railroad to invest in a radial arm or table saw.  it makes life easy and you can always get a lot of your money back by selling it when you are done.

grizlump

 

I agree on the radial arm saw.  I have had one for 30 years and I love it.

Lowes bottom of the line wood here is something called whitewood.  I don't like it, poor surface, splinters easily and splits easily.  I used some for trimming my shed out back, had to drill pilot holes and still had problems near the ends.  Soaks up paint like a sponge. 

I paid extra for select pine for the layout, but you have to be picky. Some of the smaller pieces like 1x4's can be warped and twisted pretty bad - I couldn't get enough decent ones and finally had to buy some 1x8's and rip them into 1x4's.

Enjoy

Paul

[grizlump9]

 when i was buying 1x4 and 1x3 lumber a few years ago, i found the best quality at lowes.  they didn't care if you picked through it since it was self service anyway.  i don't know if they still have the good stuff or if it is available at all locations but if they have a store near you it would be worth checking out.

  my hick town has 2 lumberyards and they both sell junk.  you have to chase the squirrels out of it before you can cut it.

  on another note, i would avise anyone starting a large sized model railroad to invest in a radial arm or table saw.  it makes life easy and you can always get a lot of your money back by selling it when you are done.

grizlump

[IRONROOSTER]

Unless you are getting 2x4s a lot cheaper than 1x4s go with the 1x4s.  Easier to work with, shorter holes to drill, shorter screws required, etc. 

Years ago, when  I could get decent pine 2x4 studs I used to rip them into 1x4s. Not sure the current stuff is worth doing that.

Enjoy

Paul

[doctorwayne]

When using 1"X2"s or 1"X4"s, don't "cheap-out" by using strapping lumber, which is basically that crummy dimensional lumber ripped in half.  Good, kiln-dried pine or fir is much less likely to warp or twist, especially after you've assembled it into a layout.  Some modellers opt to rip plywood to similar dimensions, another good choice for stable benchwork.

All of my layout benchwork (open grid style) is 1"X4" pine, although I did use 2"X4"/2"X6"/2"X8" for the supporting  structure (mysteriously "left-over" after building my house ).  The shelving beneath much of the layout is covered with 3/8" sheathing plywood, and provides plenty of storage for train "stuff" and all sorts of heavy household items. 

Part of the layout will be double-decked, and my plan is to use a 1"X2" framework covered with the sheathing plywood - support for the layout, plus underslung fluorescent lights, will be with custom-made steel brackets, bolted to the wall.

Wayne

[Doughless]

indiana rr

 In many of the layout plans I parouse, I see that the benchwork is a 1x4 skeleton.  Why do most use 1x4 instead of 2x4s?

Because as most have pointed out, 2x4's provide much more strength than what's needed to support a layout.  1x lumber is easier to work with as well.  Having said that...

If your benchwork will not be mobile, I would skip the 45 degree leg bracing that's seen on so many layouts and add a shelf about 18 inches off the floor as leg bracing.  A ribbon of 1x4 circling the inside perimeter of the four legs will provide the same amount of bracing, when 1/2 plywood or MDF is used as the shelf material.  You could make more ribbons and shelves attached to the legs also.  If you do that, I would use 2x4's for the legs only.  Work hard to find ones that aren't twisted.  You could use 2 1x4's screwed together to form an L as well, but that's a bit more work of course.

[Anonymous]

 The layouts I have built in recent years all had to be movable, light weight constructions were a must. This excluded 1 x 4, let alone 2 x 4 lumber for the framing. I use 1/2" by 4" grade a plywood in a typical open grid fashion and 18" spacing. All the "lumber" I get at our local home improvement store, cut to size on a CNC diamond saw with less than 1/50 of an inch tolerance.

For shelf layouts this has proven to be practical.

[tomikawaTT]

We are building picnic tables, not bedroom floors.  For most model railroads, even 1x4 lumber is overkill.

That said, I personally use 2xs almost exclusively.  The difference is that mine are steel studs.  Wood does weird and wonderful (NOT!) things when subjected to extreme heat and single-digit humidity.  Those conditions don't bother steel.  The kicker is that a steel 2x4 weighs less than a fir 1x3 of the same length.

Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - on steel stud 'C acts like L' girder benchwork)

[spidge]

The 2x4 is so heavy by itself. Where the 1x4 is much lighter and easier to work with when it comes to cutting. The 1x4 still offers close to the same strength in the 4" dimension.

I used 1x4 for my brackets and my L girders, but elected for the 1x2 stingers in the yard and 1x3 and 1x4 stringers in the mountain areas.

 

[tgindy]

1" x 4" wood has always provided more than adequate strength, and; will the basis for at least the perimeter benchwork and legs for the CR&T, as well as some of the cross-section supports.

Each corner leg has always used (2) 1" x 4" pieces screwed together in an L-shape.  Each L-shaped leg is screwed into each corner using (5) wood screws on each side to the 1" x 4" perimeter benchwork.  So, that's (10) screws to secure each corner leg benchwork top, plus; a couple screws to make the L-shaped legs.  There will not be any shifting benchwork here.

The rest of the benchwork can then be smaller such as a 1" x 3" and/or 1" x 2".

[mcfunkeymonkey]

I used 1x3 & 1x2s for L-girder:

 

This is 9 1/2' x 7'.
(1/2" ply covered the top)
It's divided into three sections (4' table, 3 1/2' bridge, 7' table).
I'm able to carry the sections when broken down, but it's still pretty heavy.
Can't imagine this thing with 2x4s.
Guess then it could double as our family bomb / earthquake shelter.

Keep it light!

Cheers!
--Mark

[dehusman]

If you think find 1x4's that are straight and won't warp, try finding 2x4's that are true.

[Midnight Railroader]

 Because there's no need for the overkill of using 2x4 lumber.

 If you ever need to move the layout--even to shift it a few inches--you'll find it much easier if you use lighter lumber.

[indiana rr]

 In many of the layout plans I parouse, I see that the benchwork is a 1x4 skeleton.  Why do most use 1x4 instead of 2x4s?