So, I'm 15, and I'm trying to find a new hobby. I suppose 'rediscover' is more appropriate, seeing as that's what I doing. When I was younger (6-9ish), I was boderline-obssesed with all things train. Between the things my father and I have, we're probably pushing into the low thousands of dollars split between HO (small is bad when you're younger, of course!) and Lionel (the big boys!), and I'm trying to get back involved. I have several 10-year-old Model Railroader magazines I've been referencing, and they have all proven, while interesting, to be woefully inept by today's standards. Basically, I have a decent-sized space complete with table that amounts to about 4'x8' with another 8'x2' rectange tacked on one end, forming an 'L' shape. So, here are my questions:
Any good layout suggestions? I'd love to do something themed, like mountain logging or coal mining...
How does one go about hand-laying turnouts? My income is seasonal, so paying $13.00 a pop is not happening.
That's about it. Any suggestions would be great, as well as perspective layout ideas!
How about starting to find layout suggestions by downloading "Atlas Layouts" . Or just type in "Model railroad layouts". Once you find something that you like, we will be glad to suggest the dos and don'ts of what makes a particular layout interesting. Often, you can get back issues of the Model Railroader magazine for about a "quarter", from your local hobby shop. I just got a piece of paper and sketched in various layouts, until I found one that I liked... Bob Hahn
So you have a 4*8 with a 2*8 L shaped extension. You want a main line loop on the 4*8. The main line can be single track, with passing sidings, or double track. Put some waviness in the main line, don't run track straight down the edges of the table, it emphasises the table edge and makes the layout look like toy trains on a table instead of scale models going thru real scenes. Think about a view block in the middle of the 4*8 table to prevent seeing across the table, things look more realistic, you can do a backdrop on the view block which gives a background for photos. Add plenty of spurs for a peddler freight to spot cars on.
The 2*8 entension could have an industry or mine or logging camp at the far end served by rail. You cannot have a loop in just 2 feet, so plan on the engine pulls the train up to the industry. Have a run around siding at the end so you can uncouple the engine and run it around to the back of the train to pull the loaded cars back to the main line. Or you could do a yard, or a roundhouse with turntable, or just a lot of staging tracks.
Hand laying turnouts is possible. Search or Google and a how to article with photos will show up. Count on making a couple of learner's before you can make one good enough to run trains thru. Hand lay a little track to gain experience.
David Starr www.newsnorthwoods.blogspot.com
A tiny limited income can be a problem. That being said, this book is worth the 20 bucks.
This is the unofficial "bible" and it contains a plethora of useful information. Get it, skim it, read it cover to cover, read it again. It's not perfect but contains a lot of important and useful information. Read this book before putting your track plan into practice. It can only change it for the better. Enough said.
The mind is like a parachute. It works better when it's open. www.stremy.net
I would suggest cruising the plans on the Model Railroader.com site. Buy a couple books of track plans. Ian Rices shelf layouts and a general one with 40-100 plans in it would be good. You don't have to build one of the plans, but it will give you ideas on the common arrangements and some idea of what you can do in the size space you have. Feel free to borrow pieces of different layouts to create the one you like or take one you like and modify it to meet you needs.
Typically the 2x8 ft piece lends itself to an industrial switching area or a yard.
Hand laying turnouts can be done, but it takes time to learn how to do it. So don't exprect that your first one will be perfect right off the bat. Before you embark on handlaying, realize you won't be saving that much money. First off you have to decide how you are going to build them. If you spike the rails down you will need Homasote, Homabed, white pine, basswood or luan plywood under the track to have a soft material to spick into. Plain old plywood is too hard. Another alternative is PC board ties which will require you to learn how to solder. Finally there are the Central Valley switch kits, when you glue the rails down. You will only be saving a couple bucks per switch by the time you are done.
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
I don't want to scare you away from handlaying your own switches, I learned to hand lay back in high school. Just go into it knowing that there is a learning curve and that its still has a cost for rail, ties, spikes, rail joiners, etc. You have to be willing to be fairly precise in your construction or they won't work well. You have to also be willing to devote some time to both learning and then building your track, so its not like you will have trains up and running tomorrow with handlaying. I have no doubt that if you want to do it you can.
Everything is a trade off. Using commercial switches you trade money for time, using conventional handlaid switches you trade time for money. Using jigs to build your switches you trade money for a shorter learning curve.
Handlaying switches is tricky. If you don't get things just right, you will have no end to derailments. This will just leave you frustrated and wanting to give up on the hobby, all for the sake of a couple of dollars.
I would say that any money you save by handlaying (and with the cost of the supplies, it's not that much cheaper) is going to be more than offset by the time it takes you to get it right. By which time, you would have saved enough to buy a commercial turnout.
Or you could decide which scale you want to model and sell the other stuff on e-Bay, and use the profits to buy more track.
Connecticut Valley Railroad A Branch of the New York, New Haven, and Hartford
"If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right." -- Henry Ford
Welcome into the hobby and the forum! All of the previous suggestions are right on target and sound. This forum will help you along the way as you get into working on your layout. Just ask the questions as you have need. Every one is here to help, I know, because they have helped me.
Happy modeling, Hal
CTValleyRRHandlaying switches is tricky. If you don't get things just right, you will have no end to derailments. This will just leave you frustrated and wanting to give up on the hobby, all for the sake of a couple of dollars. I would say that any money you save by handlaying (and with the cost of the supplies, it's not that much cheaper) is going to be more than offset by the time it takes you to get it right. By which time, you would have saved enough to buy a commercial turnout.
I disagree. Very similar to the OP, in 1975 I was bringing home less than $500 after taxes. As a young newlywed with rent and a car payment there just wasn't enough to buy commercial track - even from the discounters - for my 4x8. I decided to trade time for money, and hand lay my track. I used Jack Work's "Birth of a Turnout" in the April 1963 Model Railroader as my guide to learning how to hand lay track. Today, there is pretty good guide at http://www.railwayeng.com/handlay6/hndly-h3.htm. Fast Tracks videos are also useful as long as you keep in mind that you don't need his special jigs or tools - all the steps can be easily done by hand with hand tools.
And I learned by reading the article and doing. I had no metal working and very little soldering experience. My wood working skills left a lot to be desired. Yet I was able to build a successful turnout on the 1st try. My second looked a little better due to fewer solder blobs, but both performed flawlessly. Did I sometimes respike or push spikes to re-adjust rail locations after the initial try? Yes, of course. But I readjusted everything until it was gauged correctly without kinks or dips.
Each turnout takes me two 2 hour sessions from bare roadbed to complete ballasted, weathered, and wired trackwork. The 1st night is marking rail locations, staining and gluing the ties, ballasting, painting the rail. The 2nd night is soldering feeders, sanding and restaining the ties, forming turnout parts, spiking rail, soldering and cleaning out frog, adding throwbar and throwbar mechanism.
Costs of supplies (I just bought these over the past 2 months at my LHS at full retail):
ties: Kappler turnout ties (500 - builds 14 turnouts) $13.65
Kappler regular ties (1000 - 21 actual ft of track) $13.65
rail: 99ft ME code 70 (code 55 is $10 cheaper) $39.95
spikes: ME micro (1000 need 2 for total OP layout) $18.80
gauges: Kadee (2) 7.00
Total for 2x8 layout (40ft of track including 14 turnouts) with some leftovers: $93.05
Total for 6 Atlas code 83 #4 turnouts (@$17.35): $104.10
So for less than the price of 6 Atlas turnouts, I can build 14 turnouts plus all the track that will fit on a 2x8 shelf and have stuff left over. And it will look better than Atlas code 83 track, "flow", and perform better.
Left out of costs are a piece of PC board (I got mine at Radio Shack and saw my own throwbars from it), rosin core solder, soldering iron, needle nose pliers, rail nippers, flat and edge needle files, knife, mill file, hack saw blade, a sanding boat made from 1x2 10" long using sheet sandpaper, leather shoe dye, and NMRA gauge. Just about all these things have important uses other than just track laying. Ballast and rail paint are common to both handlaid and commercial track, as are rail joiners (I didn't/don't use them per Jack Work), feeder wire, and turnout throw devices.
I don't pretend handlaid track is for everyone. It won't get trains running as quickly as prefab track will. But handlaid track is a valid way to save money, gain new skills, learn patience and relaxation if not posessed already, and end up with very nice trackwork on a smaller layout. There is a special feeling when the train runs flawlessly over track you build yourself.
Fred W
Have you thought about cutting the 4x8 into 2 4x4's and putting one on eace end to allow enough space for a dogbone. Just a sugestion.
Good to see your back in the hobby for starters. I would first subscribe to MR not pushing the mag but if your a subscriber you can take advantage of the subscriber extras which includes a track plan data base, your not going to find a better resource in my O/P for track plans. As mentioned pick up some of the Kalmback books on track planning etc. before you lay your first piece of track.
Even though I am a hell of a lot older then you I know the pain of working with a limited budget as a lot of us do. my suggestion would be to check online sites like Craigslist.com for example for used equipment. I shy away from ebay as I have had too many bad experiences for my taste. You also may want to look into local train shows, the bigger shows like the Greenburg shows are flooded with dealers so their are a few good deals but they are few and far between. I have gotten fantastic deals at smaller local shows. Your dealing with a model railroader typically who is either getting out of the hobby or maybe changing equipment, or era rather then a hobby store who sends a couple of guys to a show and charges the same price as if you walekd into their store.
I thin the best thing you can do to save money is to do your research first and make sure your take your time and you know what you want, mistakes cost money.
God luck
Since you didn't describe what equipment you already have, I'll assume it's loco's and rolling stock with maybe a little track. Based on that and the relativly small size of your layout I see no reason not to use sectional track and that can be puchased for pennies at yard sales and flea markets. About 1 in 5 yard sales I've been to have an old trainset for sale for say 5-10 bucks and includes the typical oval of track, some abused rolling stock and locos and a power pack. Turnouts are scarce and the rolling stock will need upgraded couplers and wheels but these are cheap improvements about $2 per car. I acquired closeto 400 feet of track, 50 pieces of rolling stock and 10 cheapie locos for less than $200 which left money for new turnouts and couplers and wheelsets. The cheapie locos are plenty capable of pulling a train that will fit on yuor layout. DC works just fine for small layouts but DCC is better (thuogh more money) Another option to look at is modeling traction since the small equipment can run on smaller radius turns leaving the option of a return loop on the 2x8 section. Careful shopping can get you started and upgrade can be made later as budget permits. Now go have some fun!
Modeling the Cleveland and Pittsburgh during the PennCentral era starting on the Cleveland lakefront and ending in Mingo junction