Guys (and gals) :
Here is a tip to help people avoid following up on old threads that have been made irrelevant by the original poster (OP) moving on to newer threads in the meantime:
Look at the date of the post you want to follow up. If it is more than a few days old, click on the post count under the OP's name - that will give you a list of posts by the original poster. Check if the OP has posted new threads elsewhere - have a look at the new threads and see if it still relevant to follow up on the old thread.
Here is the newest thread by swapilot : "my new layout part tres" (ie part three): http://cs.trains.com/trccs/forums/p/151917/1680448.aspx
Smile, Stein
Swapilot: If I'm not mistaken, it is still your layout isn't it? Don't give up on the Forum. Absorb, then retain or disgard the advice and/or comments.
The way I see it.....If a member posts a response, it indicates an interest in the subject. (So many posts go unanswered)
All the best.
If your ends were a little wider, say, 28" or 30", could you run around them, and head back to the other end, like an L shaped dogbone? That might add operating interest - but I don't know; it's just a top of the head idea. My current idea is considering something like that, in 2 parts, based on a little layout from April 08 MR. Haven't nearly thought it through! For that matter, if one could come back, maybe one yard would do it, and the other end could be something else. I'm am NO expert, but will read stuff I don't care for, and pitch it. How one is treated seems to be in part the question, and in part the responder. It may pay to keep chewing on the ideas that have enough meat on them to be worthwhile, and spit the rest out. Bottom line: it is for fun!
This space lends itself to the switching layout concept. I have to agree, there is not much justification for a yard on a layout this size. I was inspired by an article by Jonathan Jones in the May, 2001 issue of MR. This layout, although very well designed is only 2 X 10 feet, but still lent itself to realistic operations.
I have a layout of very similar dimensions to yours. I use the "short" side, along the shorter wall space as a fiddle yard. The 9 or 10 foot side is my "visible" layout space, or the modeled portion. There are seven tracks on the modeled portion. The staging side is only 1ft. wide and has three tracks. The main operation is as a "push-pull" with the "main line" being an abandoned branch line, which now serves as the interchange track (set out) for the industrial corridor it serves. The "class1" railroad pushes a train onto the branch line (operating rules require a caboose on the tail end of this train as protection) and leaves a cut of cars. Return cars are set out on an adjacent track to the interchange track. the class 1 RR picks up the cars that have been set out on the pick-up track then makes the return trip. An industry-owned railroad takes on the switching duties from there, serving the customers locally. I just added the fiddle yard as a convenient way to make up trains and to remove and/or place cars on the layout.
This is doable space that can have realistic operations. Keep researching. As said previously here, coming up with a design that suits your needs, especially in a space like this can be challenging..
I think some hidden staging somewhere on your layout would be a great investment to the operations scheme, and would add additional interest instead of moving the same cars back and forth each time.
Behind your industrial area, with a vertical backdrop, you could have one or two tracks hidden to allow your switcher to shove cuts of cars in and out of. All it would take is one switch if you wanted a single "interchange track" to the outside world, or two if you wanted to mix it up and have two completely different sets of interchange built in your railroad. This could easily be accomplished by shortening your yard tracks by 6", adding an additional switch, and laying another curve that parralels the one to the industrial area.
I would also consider continuing the curve into your yard tracks just a little longer, and allowing them to run diagonal towards the edge of the layout. You won't lose much in terms of length, but it'll "split the scene" and help get rid of the "toy train" look by allowing the design to be fluid, and not ruler-straight. Railroad tracks in the real world are anything but "ruler straight", even on tangent track.
I didn't catch if you planned on using cork, but if I were you, I would definately consider a mix of HO cork and N scale cork. Use the N-scale cork on your other-than-main-track like the yard tracks, customer tracks, etc. The HO cork will give your main track a built up appearance, and will further define the visual aspect of your layout.
This space reserved for SpaceMouse's future presidential candidacy advertisements
Hang in there. I see that you have already cleared one major obstical with the layout support issues of the moving boxes. Siever's makes some great benchwork. Pricy, but you don't need that much.
On step at a time...... you'll get there.
Modeling B&O- Chessie Bob K. www.ssmrc.org
swapilot,
Selector is correct, if you need some help, Stein will be a good choice. Him and I kicked around some plans a few times with some old pictures. If you are intrested in maybe changing some thing without coming under fire, exchange emails with Stein. He does really excellent drawings with everything you want and is always willing to go the extra step.
Don't get to frustrated with the forum, opinions all very from person to person. So don't give up to soon, you are going in the right direction. Good luck.
Is there a good reason the trackwork is all on the far side of the layout? Visibility and access is better up front.
Also, you have plenty of room so the track doesn't always have to parallel the wall and the front edge. A change would make things more visually appealing/interesting. Track arrangements are all parallel too. Same issue.
Mark
swapilot
So these two are the ones you have now, and the other two were the before pictures, right ?
I like the changes. Cutting down the yard along the right wing of the layout to 5 tracks seems sensible - that's enough for two tracks of on layout staging and three tracks for sorting.
And the industrial zone on the left wing is much improved - it no longer looks like just a second yard connected to the first yard, but more like an industrial area. Got a couple of switchback industries, but that's okay for a small switching layout like this. Got some extra tracks for work room, so you can drop off cars before handling more - good call. Got room for industries and tracks.
Looks pretty good.
I also posted a picture of a track plan from another poster who made a similar sized switching layout which looked very promising - especially in the way he (as you did) allowed enough space for roads and parking - something which quite a few people (including me) are not all that good at. Could be that you will get extra ideas from that track plan - like having the runaround curve around the corner, and having the yard tracks branch out in a different way that creates yard tracks of more equal length.
Hang tough, swapilot. It isn't always peachy when we are trying to get past first base in this hobby....layout design. And, if you've already had Stein posting here, you are in very good hands. Tap him for all you can. He is a patient, skilled, and knowledgeable regular of several forums who likes to lend a hand to needy track planners.
Midnight can be gruff, but I don't think his reply above was out of line...more like trying to get a sense of what it is you had wanted out of the space and configuration you show. It was an opening engagement. You'll have to accept that some folks need a bit more information before they get what you want, and Midnight knows that asking some questions, or making certain observations, helps to cut to the chase...so to speak. This type of thread is really a negotiation between all the minds that pop in. The final choices are yours, but when you open up your planning to other brains, you have to expect some perhaps blunt or pointed statements.
I like your images. If you are a dad, you are already in possession of a thick skin. If a dad to daughters, you have the hide of a rhino.
-Crandell
swapilotI am all ears for ideas that will fit a corner of a bedroom with a single level "L" made out of 2 8'x2' boards.
Here is an (in my opinion) very good L shaped layout plan by forum poster Arjay1969 (Robert Beaty) made from two 7' by 2' boards, complete with a scenery plan, buildings etc:
Smile,Stein
swapilot I really think I am done with these forums. This is the second time I have gotten up the courage to post photos here, and this is the second time I have basically been treated like an idiot. Some of us are not very talented, nor do we have a lot of space.
Hey, you asked for comments.
I was neither rude nor uncivil.I simply expressed an opinion, which is what you asked. There are lots of ways to design a layout, even for those without a lot of space. Of course, you have to be willing to listen.
Maybe others will respond to you with "attaboy, you're doing great."
And maybe you'll like that better, since that's what you seem to want to hear.
I really think I am done with these forums. This is the second time I have gotten up the courage to post photos here, and this is the second time I have basically been treated like an idiot. Some of us are not very talented, nor do we have a lot of space. We are in this hobby because we want to have fun and we really love trains.
Yes you are seeing it correctly, and yes I do undestand the purpose of a railroad. I thought I was doing the best I could with the space I have. Trains "come in" from either end of the industrial area or from one end of the yard. They can drop off cars or short trains and then the locomotives "exit" the layout and are taken off the track. After that the switching begins and cars are then taken to the yard or industrial area by switchers. Trains are rebuilt, locomotives reappear and take their train for a short 8' or 16' run off the railroad. I am all ears for ideas that will fit a corner of a bedroom with a single level "L" made out of 2 8'x2' boards.
If I'm seeing this correctly, this is essentially two yards connected by a curve.
If true, that's going to become very dull, very quickly.
Remember, railroads exist to move goods from one place to another. You haven't really laid much out that allows for that to happen.
Take a look at some published short shelf track plans and you will see what I'm getting at.
Given your limited space, I wouldn't waste it with even one yard; there's no place for a train to arrive from and be broken up in it, and there's nowhere for a completed train to go after it has been built.
Okay, here are some pictures of the revised track work for my new layout. First, a giant Thank You to Tomkat-13 for all of his advice and patience when it came to revising my original track work. Second, yes there will be bench work under the particle board. According to the people at Sievers it should be arriving today. Third, the track on the far left of the industrial yard if for a Bar Mills false front building that I will get to one of these days along with the bench work, roadbed, possible overhead wiring for an Overland Models Milwaukee Road ES-2, ballasting, etc. etc. etc..
Slowly the North Bank Terminal Railway is coming together . I want to get it up and running correctly, not quickly. So here are some before and after shots. As always, critiques are sought and welcomed. All that I ask is please be nice and teach me how to do it correctly.