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Crane Lines

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  • Member since
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  • From: Amish country Tenn.
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Crane Lines
Posted by loathar on Monday, March 23, 2009 6:43 PM

I'm building this Walthers overhead crane.
http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/933-3102
I'm having trouble stringing the hook lines. I've used waxed thread and that lycra sewing thread, but the hooks don't have enough weight to hold the lines taunt. I'm almost ready to try an .006 guitar string. (no local source for brass wire) Any thoughts on using this or any other ideas??

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Posted by cowman on Monday, March 23, 2009 7:46 PM

I've got a couple of those on my "to do" list.  How about attaching a weight to  the hook to hold the line straight, maybe a little glue on the string to keep it straight once it has dried.  Just a thought.

Good luck,

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Posted by graphitehemi on Monday, March 23, 2009 7:47 PM

loathar
I've used waxed thread and that lycra sewing thread, but the hooks don't have enough weight to hold the lines taunt.

Is the hook large enough that you could drill out some of it and hide a fishing weight in it? Have you thought about replacing the hook all together with a metal hook?

As for riging I don't know of anything that would work better than the threads. Confused

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Posted by loathar on Monday, March 23, 2009 11:36 PM

One hook is metal and the other's plastic. Both are too small too add weight to. I found some smooth thread that hangs straight, but it's so thin you can hardly see it. I can't make my lines very long or they tend to twist up. (one hook requires 4 lines run to it.) Guess I'll spend $2 and try a guitar string tomorrow and see how that works.
My kingdom for a decent LHS!!

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Posted by cowman on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 9:10 PM

Could you tie a piece of thread onto a small nut, hook the loop of thread over the hook to hold it down?

Good luck,

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Posted by grinstuff on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 9:31 PM

piano wire maybe

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Posted by graphitehemi on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 5:57 AM

How about...... always have something suspended from the crane! WhistlingSmile,Wink, & Grin

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Posted by maxman on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 1:21 PM

There was an article in Mainline Modeler where the author did a mobile crane conversion.  He used 0.030 brass wire instead of thread.  The effect was very good, except that I thought the wire looked heavier than what I thought would be prototypical.  Looking up 0.030 on a conversion chart I found on line, this diameter would equate to 2.61 inch.  You mentioned 0.006 diameter wire.  This equates to about 1/2 inch diameter.  I think you could get away with 0.012 wire, which is about 1 inch in HO.  The article author indicated that he had glued the wire to the pulleys, but I couldn't tell if he used a continuous piece of wire, or used segments and went pulley to pulley.

Thinking about alternate methods (using thread for the cables), graphitehemi above suggested always having something hanging from the hook.  Expanding on this a bit, you could make some detachable (unhookable?) loads out of some suitable small steel object.  If you have the hook hanging over, say, a scrap pile, you could bury a small magnet in the scrap.  The magnet would attract the object on the hook and keep tension on the cables, keeping the thread straight.  If you have magnets buried at various places under the crane, you could move the crane from place to place to vary the scene.

Just an idea.

Now I'll go re-light whatever it was I was smoking when this idea hit me.

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Posted by GraniteRailroader on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 9:43 PM

 Try hair-spray.

Weight your hook down on the finished model, cover around the back side of the string to prevent overspray from getting on the other portions, and spray it. It'll give it a brittle but stiff finish.

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Posted by loathar on Thursday, March 26, 2009 12:06 PM

I tried some .008 guitar string but it was to springy and wouldn't hang straight. Kind of bowed out too much. I  think brass would work OK, but I don't have a local source for it. Gonna try string and maybe starch or hair spray next.

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Posted by xdford on Friday, March 27, 2009 4:58 AM

Try using thin copper wire which you get a reasonable length of and put one end in a vice and putting the other end in a power drill and spin it until the wire is nearly at break point. This will work harden it. 

You will find that the wire can be kept straight and looked at closely could represent the twisted lines of cable strands and bent around small wheels ( for the pulleys) should help you and yet keep fairly straight... sorry you won't be able to operate it but I presume that is not an issue for you!

Hope this helps

Trevor www.xdford.digitalzones.com

 

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Posted by loathar on Friday, March 27, 2009 9:57 AM

COPPER! Thumbs Up Didn't even think about that!Dunce I have plenty of types laying around to try. Thanks!

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Posted by Geohan on Saturday, March 28, 2009 10:59 AM

loathar

I'm building this Walthers overhead crane.
http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/933-3102
I'm having trouble stringing the hook lines. I've used waxed thread and that lycra sewing thread, but the hooks don't have enough weight to hold the lines taunt. I'm almost ready to try an .006 guitar string. (no local source for brass wire) Any thoughts on using this or any other ideas??

On my operating clam shell bucket (scratch built in HO) I finally found some braided fly fishing line of braided construction that takes acrylic paint and was limp enough for operation and more importantly did not twist.  Of course the bucket weighs more than a hook.  In addition to the suggestions above you might make the hook out of lead and/or crimp a split shot lead fishing weight just above the hook just like the prototype hook ball.  The fly fishing line is quite expensive for the minimum amount.  If you wish to e-mail me with your snail mail address I'll send you some.   Gudenuph@gmail.com

FWIW, Geohan

 

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Posted by Geohan on Saturday, March 28, 2009 11:07 AM

With regard to coloring the fishing line, I should have said "India ink" instead of acrylic paint.  Sorry, Geohan

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Posted by loathar on Saturday, March 28, 2009 12:21 PM

Thanks. I finally got some brand of black thread I had laying around to work. I weighted a long strand of it and hit it with some spray starch. It has more fuzzys on it than I like, but you can't see them unless your 3" away. I just need to hit the lines with some weathering chalk and I'll post some pics of it.
Thanks for all the ideas!Smile

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Posted by loathar on Monday, April 6, 2009 12:38 AM

Finally got to take some pictures of the finished crane and lines.




I don't think it turned out too bad.

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Posted by PLSWJR on Monday, April 6, 2009 5:06 AM

Looks good. The fuzzies on the thrread could be burnt off with a candle by carefully moving the thread over the flame, but this is best done before rigging. A lighter may work now that it is done but is risky. The fuzzies don't appear bad now, but what about dust accumulation?

Surveying, the worlds second oldest profession.
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Posted by canazar on Monday, April 6, 2009 10:09 AM

Looks great!  I have thought about building something like that for a team track area I have.   Well done, great weathering.  Looks like it was well worth the effort.

Best Regards, Big John

Kiva Valley Railway- Freelanced road in central Arizona.  Visit the link to see my MR forum thread on The Building of the Whitton Branch on the  Kiva Valley Railway

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Posted by loathar on Monday, April 6, 2009 12:18 PM

I thought about trying to hit them with a lighter. I might try that if I get brave enough.

 canazar -It's a pretty EZ kit. Beware though, it got a big foot print! 12"x9". It barely fits where I want to put it.

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Posted by bigpianoguy on Monday, February 6, 2012 1:12 PM

Excellent.

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Posted by chutton01 on Monday, February 6, 2012 4:07 PM

Well, since piano guy was nice enough to bump this thread, I have read that bees-wax can be used to cut down the fuzziness of thread lines - I have weight on both ends of the guy-lines of a mobile derrick I built (well, OK, it's actually an HO scale  "Roco Minitanks" M88 recovery vehicle that actually turned out fairly well, and I sure as heck ain't going to put an open flame anywhere near that). Searching turns up some suggestions on defuzzication, but since this thread is alive, any others that work?

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Posted by bigpianoguy on Tuesday, February 7, 2012 10:54 PM

Yeah, go ahead, blame the new guy. And it's true - I am finally getting around to assembling my version of the model but couldn't remember where I'd seen those (these) great photos. A quick search, & voila - but I had to bookmark it, so - it's alive!!!

This is a good thing - I need all the help I can get. I've got some really fine 'craft' chain that I got at a dollar store about a year ago on a whim; I'm thinking that this will be the time to use it. I've probably discarded the original packaging but I'll try to get a comparative pic up soon to show its scale.

And it IS 'big' piano guy; retired after 40 years as a professional pianist, I always found it challenging folding my 6'7" frame under & around, the piano...(is this the only size this comes in?)

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Posted by chutton01 on Tuesday, February 7, 2012 11:33 PM

bigpianoguy
I've got some really fine 'craft' chain that I got at a dollar store about a year ago on a whim; I'm thinking that this will be the time to use it. I've probably discarded the original packaging but I'll try to get a comparative pic up soon to show its scale.


Hmm, if you're talking HO scale, it may not be fine enough.
I have some cheap craft-store that I too use for background & heavy duty - it's approx 18link/inch.
Then there is A-line scale chain - 40links/inch (which I just measured)

So, the craft store chain is approx 1 link = 4.8inch, while A-line is 1 link = 2.1inch - even the A-line chain represents a hefty chain, and the craft-store chain is pretty much out of scale.for HO. But, it looks good enough coiled up representing tow chain and whatnot.

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Posted by bigpianoguy on Wednesday, February 8, 2012 10:28 PM

OK, OK, you're right - I got out my craft chain and it is indeed (real size) 12 links to the inch, which we usually equate to a six-foot figure...so this make the links in HO about 6 inches each - like you said, probably ok to have 'around', coiled but not much use for anything else.

So it's back to the drawing board. My other thought on this is to tighten some lengths of thread between a couple of screws, then spray them with low-luster acrylic paint, cutting them to fit for installation. A light sanding might smooth out the 'fuzzies'.

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Posted by eaglescout on Saturday, February 11, 2012 5:09 PM

Hobby Lobby sells some metalic looking thread that appears to have a twist in it like braided metal cables  use on cranes.  I used it on my crane car and other places I want "metal cable."

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Posted by farrellaa on Saturday, February 11, 2012 5:35 PM

I used some plastic coated stainless cable from Hobby Lobby for other applications and is a great item to have; but, it doesn' t bend too well and most likely wouldn't go around the pulleys. I have this same crane kit and laid it out in my car repair/ scrap facility before layiing the track. I may use some .010" phosphor bronze wire I get from Tichy Train. I use it on coaling tower models for the cable on the  counterweights and it works great. I paint it after bending and fitting. I use a pair of radius bending pliers to make the curves to fit the pulleys. They are straight sections of wire about 10-12" long.

Nice job on your crane! Hope mine cones out as good.

     -Bob

Life is what happens while you are making other plans!

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Posted by chutton01 on Sunday, February 12, 2012 1:17 AM

farrellaa
I used some plastic coated stainless cable from Hobby Lobby for other applications and is a great item to have; but, it doesn' t bend too well and most likely wouldn't go around the pulleys. 

Plastic coated stainless steel wire? Sounds like 'Bead String Wire', which I have right in front of me - .30mm (012in) thick, or 1 HO inch thick (which is a thick, but prototypical sized cable for heavy duty purposes.  Of course we are fudging a bit, and it can pass for cables sized down t 3/8inch is much more likely to be found in home and industrial usage.
Now, that plastic coating was bugging the heck out of me, and the wire encased within is actually kind of nice, twisted cable like - so I just burned the plastic off using an open flame (I did this outside, over a surface which wouldn't catch fire, and wearing gloves) A little sanding, and the results looked decent enough (I tried just stripping the plastic coating off, with disastorous results).
String at least twice the amount of wire you need between 2 nails over a scrap board (I put some foil over the board as overkill) I took a lighter and passed it over till the plastic caught fire, burned off any globules, and tried NOT to breath that melting plastic just in case. It worked.

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Posted by Geohan on Sunday, February 12, 2012 12:41 PM

What you need is a balanced braid fish line in order to control the twist. It's pretty expensive and I have more than I need and it is about 1" in HO scale.  Send me an E-mail with your address and I'll give you some,

Gudenuph@gmail.com

Geohan 

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Posted by chutton01 on Thursday, October 25, 2018 9:00 AM

I am officially reviving this thread, as I have a question as 5+ years have past.
I have a Walthers American Crane kit which I am finally building, but the thread with it has disappeared (of course). I don't recall the thread looking all that great to begin with. Since I will actually use the thead to crank up/down the boom/hook for posing (unlike the M-88 I mentioned years ago, which is a static model), I am wondering what people have used to replicate the crane cable in use (meaning no fuzzies or other wear after a use or two).
Obviously EZ line is out (being stretchy and all), not sure about real wire, and the polyesther thread I've seen in the big-box stores looks pretty poor...

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Posted by maxman on Thursday, October 25, 2018 9:10 AM

Don't know what the original line looked like, but you might want to investigate upholstery thread as a substitute.  You can get a spool of that at JoAnns Fabrics, and it is not very expensive when you use a coupon.

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