Leaving Paper Templates Glued Under Cork Roadbed ala Joe Fugate

[Capt. Grimek]

Last night I posted and read on the Siskyou Line forum that Joe Fugate left his computer printed paper full sized templates glued down to the plywood when he laid his track and cork roadbed (at least two of the yards). He told me that he did this 18 years ago! (He shows pics). I've been wanting to do this with my 17'X3' blueprint paper strips before I cookie cutter the ply. Here and elsewhere I've been able to find almost no one who's done this so thought I'd let you all know that it worked for Mr. Fugate so I'm thinking of giving it a try, at least in the yard. It'll be nice not to have to pommel wheel, constantly lift paper to be sure the ink marker is marking the ply, realigning every time, etc. If gluing the templates and roadbeding/scenicing over works fine, it seems like this could/should become a part of the average M.R.er's toolbox like zip texturing, foam based scenery, etc. I wonder why more layout builders aren't doing this? Is it just tradition? Lack of feedback/data from modelers who have? If others here have done their layout this way and have been sceniced and running for several years with no problems please let us know? It just seems like a "no brainer path" to leave templates in place if they help and cause no harm down the road. I'll try a test glue up with a scrap of ply just to be sure the blueprint paper adheres for several weeks under different "climatic conditions" and isn't glue resistant due to some coating,etc. If my consumer reports type test passes I think I'm going to try or go with this "technique". Anyone else that hasn't responded in the past done this? Thanks for the feedback in past threads but it seemed like no one to hardly anyone knew if it was "safe" to do this. Joe and 18 yrs. both sound good to me.

[DeadheadGreg]

do you mean simply gluing down paper templates for like turnouts, etc, and then laying the track on top of the glued-down template?  If so, lots of people do that.  I do that.  Thats how I made some of my turnouts....  i glued down the paper template on top of some HO-cork-thickness basswood and laid the ties directly on the template, then laid the rail. 

I'm not sure what else you might mean......    like do some people try to trace the template onto the actual roadbed/subroadbed and then lift the template off, but still have the track lines drawn?  thats a whole lot of unneccessary if you ask me. 

[tomikawaTT]

Howdy, Captain,

I go the paper template one step farther - my templates are cardstock.  Also, they don't go under the roadbed, they go between the (fan-fold underlayment) foam roadbed and the flex track (or wood ties.)

My procedure is the exact reverse of the intuitive:

• I make my templates first, the old fashioned way, with trammel, straightedge and flex track on a work surface of 2" foam.  Specialwork (anything from a single turnout to a puzzle palace of double slips) is configured by shaping flextrack to follow each route, then marking the tie ends on the cardstock with a sharp pencil.  Once the tie end lines are established, I cut along those lines to make a track-width template.
• Next I plop the template on a sheet (24 x 48 inches) or several of fan-fold underlayment, anchor it with a few track nails and give the whole business a quick spray of plastic-compatible grey rattle can paint.  With the tie lines transferred to the roadbed material, I attack with great gusto and a steak knife, angling my ballast shoulder at 30 degrees.  If the template crosses two pieces of foam, I mark curves with a straight line after lifting the template but before disturbing the foam, to assure future alignment.
• The procedure is repeated with the cut roadbed on the to-be-cookie-cut plywood, transferring the roadbed edge lines to the plywood with a narrow spritz of green paint.
• After the saber saw has come and gone, the roadbed is anchored to the plywood with latex caulk - whatever color happens to be in the caulk gun, or the cheapest found at the hardware or home improvement emporium.  Since the edges will be buried under scenic materials, it doesn't make any difference if the caulk is brilliant white, baby blue or neon pink.
• The template is caulked to the roadbed, centered by noting where pink foam becomes grey paint.  For this phase, my material of choice is grey caulk.
• Finally, the track goes on, either flex, applied 'straight,' or wood ties and whatever shims might be necessary if specialwork is involved (I hand-lay specialwork in place.)  A little excess caulk, spread along the outer edges of the cardstock, will seal it from future moisture incursions.  Flex is pre-bent, and temporarily anchored (laterally) with track nails that can be removed once the caulk sets.

 

Some of our fellow forumites push ballast into the soft caulk.  So far, I haven't ballasted anything, so I can't speak for that aspect.  I will say that subgrade-roadbed-template-flex, all anchored with caulk, has already survived as much as three years in a non-climate-controlled garage in the Dessicated Desert without any apparent ill effects.  I run trains almost daily, so problems would become obvious in a hurry!

Hope this has been helpful.

Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)

[Capt. Grimek]

Yes, laying down track and cork roadbed on top of glued down blueprint paper over plywood, using white/carpenters glue. I've posted asking club members (my own and other clubs) about this for several months on several forums and it seemed like almost no one did this and almost everyone thought it would lead to future problems like track lifting/buckling, etc. Or non-adhesion of scenery plaster. I'm glad to FINALLY find some others who've done this. How long has your track been down and ballasted and running without issues? Years? I'm even considering leaving "off track" spaces papered/glued down for building footprint pads, etc. to be plastered/painted later. Thanks for responding to this Greg. I'd like to hear any specific techniques/glues/whatever you've used and how long it's been having trains run on it. Thanks! By the way, I like your new icon. Chuck, thanks! (this is an Edit)... I just saw that your post sqeezed in after I responded. I'll read through it and get back to a response later. I'm back! Thanks so much for your very detailed outline of your procedures. Although I won't be using caulk, I'm thinking the dried carpenter's glue should seal out moisture almost as well... although I could put bead down alongside the glued cork but Joe Fugate just glued his. This is getting very encouraging now! Thanks again! If I use the full sized templates, things should go MUCH faster tracklaying.

[dehusman]

I have been glueing down paper templates on the roadbed and handlaying switches over them for probably 2 decades. 

I draw the track center lines down on the Homasote, spread white glue and then put the paper template on the glue, lining up the center lines.  When it dries I glue wood ties to the paper and then spike the rails to the ties.

[Capt. Grimek]

Thanks Dave, I can't tell you how great it is to hear so much support and experience for this, after hearing lots of naysaying. I presume you used white or carpenters glue? I'm glad I posted again about this as the last two threads I requested info./opinions about this didn't receive many responses. I appreciate it and getting excited that I can proceed without worry. The pattern for the entire layout is stretched out on my bench tops and I'm just about ready to stabilize it's position and start track laying. It'll be GREAT not to have to go through the pommel/ink marker/tracing/ lifting and checking dance. I've noticed that hand laid track often uses paper templates in pics but there was never an explanation as to whether or not they were glued down permanently and the pics always showed raised corners,etc.

[dehusman]

White Elmers in the gallon jug.

The universal glue.  Benchwork.  Templates.  Ties.  Ballast.  Scenery.

[Capt. Grimek]

Thanks again Dave. This gandy dancer is giddy with anticipation. This layout is finally going to start looking like more than a glorified picnic bench!