Trains.com

Subscriber & Member Login

Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more!

question for those who have used the Proto87 Ultimate Throwbars

957 views
10 replies
1 rating 2 rating 3 rating 4 rating 5 rating
  • Member since
    December 2007
  • From: Delmar, NY
  • 671 posts
question for those who have used the Proto87 Ultimate Throwbars
Posted by DeadheadGreg on Thursday, October 16, 2008 4:04 PM

Hey guys.  Since Andy like, never answers emails anymore, haha, I had a question I wanted to see if anyone here could answer. 

I've got the Proto87 Ultimate Throwbars.  However, I'm scratchbuilding my code 70 turnouts and not using his points, which I'm using for my code 55 turnouts.  For my code 70 turnouts, I've made my points with my Fast Tracks pointform tool. 

My question, though, is has anyone here used the Ultimate Throwbar with a NON-hinged point turnout?  As in, have you used the Ultimate Throwbar on a turnout that features continuous point and closure rails?  The examples on the Proto87 site only show it with use in a Micro Engineering hinged-point turnout. 

I ask, because with hinged point turnouts, you're supposed to use the non-hook piece as the actual throwbar, and then the 'dummy' throwbar is what actually hooks into the rail after you've drilled out the holes.  With a continous point/closure rail turnout, do you think it would be reversed?  This seems to make sense, because like with the Fast Tracks turnout, you solder the throwbar to the rails, and with the Ultimate Throwbar, the throwbar with the hooks hooking into the rail would take the place of this.  I know this is kind of confusing without knowing what i'm talking about.

http://www.proto87.com/throw-bars.html    Go there and you can see what I'm talking about.

the only one of you that I know who has used this is Wedudler, but you're turnouts are all hinged, correct?

Anyway, if anyone has any thoughts, that would be awesome.  Thanks guys

PHISH REUNION MARCH 6, 7, 8 2009 HAMPTON COLISEUM IN HAMPTON, VA AND I HAVE TICKETS!!!!!! YAAAAAAAAY!!!!!!! [quote user="jkroft"]As long as my ballast is DCC compatible I'm happy![/quote] Tryin' to make a woman that you move.... and I'm sharing in the Weekapaug Groove Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world....
  • Member since
    July 2006
  • 3,312 posts
Posted by locoi1sa on Thursday, October 16, 2008 4:35 PM

 Greg

 I dont see why they wouldn't work on your fast trax turnouts. Most hand laid turnouts are continuous rail.

    Maybe the hand laid yahoo group can help further.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/handlaidtrack/

         Pete

 I pray every day I break even, Cause I can really use the money!

 I started with nothing and still have most of it left!

  • Member since
    December 2007
  • From: Delmar, NY
  • 671 posts
Posted by DeadheadGreg on Thursday, October 16, 2008 10:12 PM

oh i know it would work, i just don't know if I should reverse the 2 throwbars since its a continous point/closure rail turnout....   because of the 2 throwbars, only one of them has tabs that actually hook into the rail via a hole drilled in the base of the rail; the other is for 'show'.  The way Andy has them set up is that the 'dummy' one, which does not hook into the rail base, is the one that is actually controlled via groundthrow or whatever, and then the 2nd one, which does have the hooks that secure the rails to it, is located closer to the frog. 

i'm jsut curious because the rail flexes differently for hinged points vs. continous points

PHISH REUNION MARCH 6, 7, 8 2009 HAMPTON COLISEUM IN HAMPTON, VA AND I HAVE TICKETS!!!!!! YAAAAAAAAY!!!!!!! [quote user="jkroft"]As long as my ballast is DCC compatible I'm happy![/quote] Tryin' to make a woman that you move.... and I'm sharing in the Weekapaug Groove Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world....
  • Member since
    February 2005
  • From: Southwest US
  • 12,914 posts
Posted by tomikawaTT on Thursday, October 16, 2008 11:50 PM

Greg, right under the pretty picture in the link you provided the caption says the throwbar can be used with either hinged or continuous points....

Chuck (modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - with a totally different point geometry)

  • Member since
    August 2004
  • From: Amish country Tenn.
  • 10,027 posts
Posted by loathar on Friday, October 17, 2008 9:53 AM

The short bar with the tabs drilled through the rails(closest to frog) hold the points in gauge. The actual throw bar tabs just push the point rail against the stock rail and don't need drilled holes through the point rail. This allows the throw bar to "float" and not bind when the switch is thrown. 
It didn't make sense to me either when I first read it, but the more I looked at it, it's the correct way to do it. (regardless of which type of point rails you use)

  • Member since
    December 2007
  • From: Delmar, NY
  • 671 posts
Posted by DeadheadGreg on Monday, October 20, 2008 9:58 PM

So, you think thats okay then?  Thats a better way of explaining it.  I just thought that since Fast Tracks and other scratchbuilt turnouts with continuous point/closure rails have the throwbar soldered to the points, that the NON-floating throwbar should be the one FURTHEST from the frog, the opposite of the way Andy says to install them with hinged point turnouts. 

This way, it would be as if I'm using a soldered throwbar.  I donno...  just throwing ideas out.  I just don't wanna have to fix it later, haha

PHISH REUNION MARCH 6, 7, 8 2009 HAMPTON COLISEUM IN HAMPTON, VA AND I HAVE TICKETS!!!!!! YAAAAAAAAY!!!!!!! [quote user="jkroft"]As long as my ballast is DCC compatible I'm happy![/quote] Tryin' to make a woman that you move.... and I'm sharing in the Weekapaug Groove Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world....
  • Member since
    August 2004
  • From: Amish country Tenn.
  • 10,027 posts
Posted by loathar on Tuesday, October 21, 2008 8:47 PM

Your comparing apples to oranges since the Protos use 2 bars which is prototypical and Fastracks uses one soldered bar. I've always worried that one soldered bar would cause binding. That's the reason I like the way Andy's are set up.
You could always make all four tabs drilled through the rails. Just throw the ones with no tab away. Of course you will only get half the yield out of a pack that way. (2 turnouts instead of 4)
I wouldn't worry about reliability doing it the way Andy recommends.

  • Member since
    September 2004
  • From: Germany
  • 1,951 posts
Posted by wedudler on Thursday, October 23, 2008 2:59 AM

 I've used those throw bars and I'm very satisfied with them.This pic shows the throw bar with a scratch build turnout. You have only to drill two holes. One into each point rail. If you want to use the second throw bar, this don't need holes.

One thing I wouldn't repeat: Installing Andy's throw bar into a finished ballasted turnout.  Sad

 

More How To at my  Diamond Valley sites .

Wolfgang

Pueblo & Salt Lake RR

Come to us http://www.westportterminal.de          my videos        my blog

  • Member since
    December 2007
  • From: Delmar, NY
  • 671 posts
Posted by DeadheadGreg on Thursday, October 23, 2008 12:54 PM

yeah but are your turnouts made with continous point and closure rails?  or are they hinged?

 

PHISH REUNION MARCH 6, 7, 8 2009 HAMPTON COLISEUM IN HAMPTON, VA AND I HAVE TICKETS!!!!!! YAAAAAAAAY!!!!!!! [quote user="jkroft"]As long as my ballast is DCC compatible I'm happy![/quote] Tryin' to make a woman that you move.... and I'm sharing in the Weekapaug Groove Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world....
  • Member since
    August 2004
  • From: Amish country Tenn.
  • 10,027 posts
Posted by loathar on Thursday, October 23, 2008 5:40 PM

Greg-Check your PM.

  • Member since
    September 2004
  • From: Germany
  • 1,951 posts
Posted by wedudler on Friday, October 24, 2008 2:37 AM

 Greg,

look at my Diamond Valley sites and you will see both ways. I've used hinged point rails with the CV turnouts and continous point rails with my scratch build turnouts. But both types I've with PROTO:87 throw bars!

Wolfgang

Pueblo & Salt Lake RR

Come to us http://www.westportterminal.de          my videos        my blog

Subscriber & Member Login

Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more!

Users Online

There are no community member online

Search the Community

ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT
Model Railroader Newsletter See all
Sign up for our FREE e-newsletter and get model railroad news in your inbox!