Oops, I goofed when I posted my suggested layout for our college friend earlier. I had in my head that the layout he showed us was an HO 4X8 when it is actually an N scale 2X4. I should have realized it from the look of the switch machines on the turnouts in his photos. (Well that, and he said it was N scale several times.)
Anyway, the ideas and track plan I posted should still work fine as an N scale layout in 2X4. It should also work well connected with a future second 2X4 turned 90 degrees to the first. The continuous running connection can be provided on the second 2X4.
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Hey!
By MSU I assume or at least guess that you mean Michigan State University? I go to Michigan State and am building an N scale BNSF model railroad based in Washington in my apartment. No trackwork or anything yet... Anyway, just curious!
or montana state.... oh well, back to searching
Don
Montana Railfan I will do what i can to fix and re-work, andi guess we will see what comes out of it. Thank you for the advice and we will see what i can do.
I will do what i can to fix and re-work, andi guess we will see what comes out of it. Thank you for the advice and we will see what i can do.
For newcomers to model railroad design who have not had time to study and gain some basic design principles, it can be hard to see the issues. So if you keep trying to do a design without that investment, your results may not be what you want.For your situation, an HO 4X8 is not what I would recommend. (Who am I kidding? I'd never recommend an HO 4X8). A big 4X8 slab is hard to move, so you'd be better off with sections, like the MILW "Beer Line" layout MR is featuring as a project series in the magazine now) But since you've already built the table, what else can you do?
Since you are interested in Linn Westcott's "Switchman's Nightmare" from 101 Track Plans, let's try laying that out in the 4X8 "sacred sheet" footprint. If you are willing to give up continuous-running, it fits pretty well, since there is a lot more square footage with which to work.
Anyone who is interested can read more about this layout here. That link includes a description of the layout design and bit about operations.
It looked like your layout used about 16-18 turnouts. The switching layout above uses only 12, but I think it could offer more operating fun and long-term interest, since it incorporates all the features of Westcott's "Switchman's Nightmare".
For portability, ease of future re-use in a different space, and more long-term useable radii, I think you'd be better off with a sectional apporach. But if you've built the 4X8 table and want to keep using it, something like this might be a decent alternative.
ByronModel RR Blog
Or find others in your college that like trains and start a college club:
http://www.ritmrc.org/
Started by and run by college students
Chris
RITMRC President 2004-2006
Lancaster, CA
Check out my railroad at: Buffalo and Southwestern
Photos at:Flicker account
YouTube:StellarMRR YouTube account
I don't know about Bozeman ,but Missoula has a very active model railroading community. If you get over there go to the Treasure Chest hobby shop. Its somewhere overe by malfunction Junction. You'll have to look it up. Also I think they have a swapmeet every spring there. Scince you're in the middle Helena has a pretty good swap meet too, also in the spring. I was raised in North Central MT(north of Shelby) and now reside over the hill from you in Lewwiston ID. If you are mobilr Spokane has a swap meet around the 15th of Feb.
Don't be afraid to do projects for college based on your railroad knowledge,specially in engineering. Plenty of research stuff to do. BILL
As for being direct, lets put it this way, i would rather know than be stabbing blindly into the dark. I read through the web pages you posted and as for a re-work, i realize what both of these layouts were intended to do, and yes you could say that the better majority of my decision making process for that was based around the idea of large industrial switching, which in turn overlooked judgement and or common sense.
Montana Railfan
There's probably no way to be delicate about this, so I'll just tell you. Those switchbacks are pretty grim. I count 6(!) back-and-forth moves to reach one end of the industrial tracks and all the intervening tracks have to be left mostly clear. Most peope would find that mind-numbingly tedious after a short while, but maybe it works for you.
Real-life railroads don't do anything like that. Scot Osterweil's layout is based on Linn Wescott's Switchman's Nightmare, which doesn't do anything like that. The difference between what Westcott and Osterweil did and this design may not be obvious, but they are extremely important.
While there is time, before scenery, I'd strongly recommend that you do away with the switchbacks.
Sorry to be so direct, I'm sure you were trying to add interest. There are lots of other ways to add interest, but one needs to apply solid layout design principles to the basic concept.
Best of luck with a re-work.
Byron
well it has been a rough road of thought and actually some lost sleep lol, but here it is the first module of the Montana Gateway Railroad in N scale.
and a different view
There is only a slight problem with one of the tracks which i believe can be seen in the first phot, but as of tonight it will be fixed and tranquility will be restored :P
The layout itself was kind of a burtal meshing of The highland terminal by Scot Osterweil and a layout taken from an article in the 2003 MR layout book which is a modified timesaver. and the loop is set in to allow breaking in of engines outside of just a straight motion in one direction or another. This Layout when finished will be approximatly 4 x 8 but split into modules. Below is a drawing of the second section of the layout
I hope you enjoy and any comments are welcome :)
Montana Railfan wrote:Hello, I have been in school now for the last month (roughly) and i am starting to feel like i need my fix so to say. Anyone have any advice on a scale, and or design that they have seen? Ideally i would like to put this in my closet so chances are space is VERY limited. Any advice or help would be great! MSU College rail fan
Hello,
I have been in school now for the last month (roughly) and i am starting to feel like i need my fix so to say. Anyone have any advice on a scale, and or design that they have seen? Ideally i would like to put this in my closet so chances are space is VERY limited.
Any advice or help would be great!
MSU College rail fan
I'm in basically the same situation, though I have a bit more space to work with. I just started grad school and decided that I would get back into model railroading after being out of it for a very long time. Since I was only about 10-12 my new railroad involved doing almost everything from scratch.
I live in a small apartment so my space isn't quite as constrained. I ended up going with a 1'x6' layout in HO, built on a 2x6 board. The layout is The Highland Terminal by Scot Osterweil. Since I expanded from 1' to 2' it makes room for some larger industries. It's probably not small enough to fit in a closet, but it could be turned on its side for storage or something. I also don't imagine it would be too hard to model in N scale either to reduce size further.
Good luck.
Folks:
About forty years ago when I was in college, and working for the railroad to pay my way through, I bought an N scale trainset along with one switch and mounted it on a 2'x3' board I could hang on my dorm room wall. It was a nice diversion and many folks thought it was neat to see something so small that actually operated and because it was an Minitrix 0-6-0 steamer it was pretty smooth and reliable for the times. I never built any structures or scenery but just the same along with magazines it handled my hooby needs for five years or so. Later on, after graduation and working in the railroad industry in several locations for many years, I have always had a nice, usually, small, N scale layout to enjoy.
I see Atlas has just released their new N scale Trainman trainsets with a GP-15 diesel, four freight cars, a caboose, an oval with their new, highly, detailed Code 65 track/roadbed and a power pack. Maybe you could place a set like this on a piece of styrofoam and add a structure or two along with a bit of scenery and have a nice little layout you could hang on the wall when not in use.
Just some thoughts from one who has "been there done that".
Enjoy,
Barry
As one heading off to college in less than a year, this is an issue in my mind. However, there is some great ideas at this site: http://www.carendt.com
Hope this helps. As for me? I have a Gn15 1'x2' layout awaiting attention
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot Visit my blog! http://becomingawarriorpoet.blogspot.com
Montana Railfan wrote: Bozeman, in a small cell with another person :P
Bozeman, in a small cell with another person :P
LOL I hear ya.
I wish I was in Bozeman, your in the middle of Gods Country.
You got the ski hill to the north, Yellowstone Park to the south, Montana Rail Links Bozeman Pass to the east. The Northern Pacific Railroad museum in the depot in Livingston is great, (they have a layout) You can ghost chase on the old Milwaukee Road mainline to the north and west along I-90. (Can you tell I miss Montana? )
Back to MRR, Greg had a great suggestion about detailing a loco and some cars, and the timesaver layout is small and fun. Keep us posted on your progress!!
GS
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein
http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/
Good Afternoon; This is a most interesting thread. I had not been involved with modeling for some time but "discovered" N scale waaay back when I was in school. It worked really well as a complete diversion/escape from the academic side.
IMHO, the academic/socal/family situations that previous posters have mentioned all fall into place after awhile; it's a matter of planning and time management.
Good luck!
work safe
I just started college at Ohio State myself, and I feel your pain. I dismantled my home layout before I left, so I can't even run on the weekends. While I'm here I've been refining my track plan for the layout I want to build next summer, but it's just not the same.
Right now I have a stretch of EZ-track set up on our windowsill. It's about 6 feet long and about 5 inches wide. Running back and forth, while relaxing, does get old after a while. I think the shelf might be just big enough to build a micro-sized switching layout. I might construct something I can mess with here and still be able to transport pretty easily back home.
I'm also watching this thread closely to see what everyone else has to say.
yeah, you just need to have them hosted on photobucket (or similar), then put the url for the image bewteen [ img] [ /img] tags on the forums.
Just about done with college myself (December). I found that kits were the best route... especially the Red Caboose/Branchline/Funaro & Camerlengo (or other insanely intricate cits of that nature) as opposed to shake-the box a la Athearn.
-Dan
Builder of Bowser steam! Railimages Site
Montana Railfan,
As someone who is in a similar situation as yourself, I would say don't worry about model railroading while at college. I returned to school last year and it is taking up all of my time. I had started a 2x4 foot n scale layout and have not touched it in about 4 months. Concentrate on your studies. If you are like me and do not want to prolong your time in college, do not worry about hobbies right now.
If you are dead set on having a layout make small and do not worry about details. An n scale switching layout would probably be best. But your time may be better spent coming up with track plans/modules for a bigger-future layout or researching a railroad and time period in which you want to model.
Sean
This is all awsome advice, i must say that it really has gotten the creative juices flowing again. In fact, i sent off yesterday to have some of my old kits sent my direction just to try and do what was mentioned earlier. I am also planning a trip to a local hot spot with my girlfriend when she comes up for the weekend.
Really this forum has been a wealth of ideas, and i thank you all for your input, it shows me that im really not as alone in this as i had originally thought :)
Just as another question though, is it possible to put your designs on this forum? i was thinking of posting mine when i get it done if possible.
Thanks again :)
MSU Railfan
At the last "Gopher Rail" sponsored by the Univ. of Minnesota RR club, they had a rather large room filled with a big Free-Mo layout. You could do something like that, build one section of a larger layout that with some good design you could use in the dorm as a switching layout, but could be joined up with other student's modules once in a while.
I would still try to organize something on campus. The U of M gave our RR club a decent sized room to build a layout in on-campus. Find out who is in charge of organizing clubs on campus and what you need to do to qualify - how many members etc. If you find enough other modellers, the school will probably help you get going.
BTW although I do agree with earlier comments on drinking (FWIW I turn 50 next month and have never been drunk) and recognizing that the first two years of college are usually the toughest (because you have to take so many required classes that may be in areas you don't know a lot about), I wouldn't turn away from having a social life on campus either. I spent a lot of time working on what turned out to be a worthless Liberal Arts degree, and sometimes wish I had been able to do more stuff not directly related to classwork. Well OK I wasn't like a hermit, I had girlfriends and was in a college club and had friends that I did stuff with etc. but in some ways I did miss a lot of interesting stuff that was going on.
If you decide to build a layout, there are lots of better choices than a Timesaver, IMHO. Model Railroad Planning 2003 magazine included nine layouts that would fit in around 1'X3' (some of them cheat a bit by folding or stacking to meet those dimensions).
My own submittal for the 1'X3' article didn't make it into that issue, but was in MRP 2005.
It's based on the real-life Alameda Belt Line and was designed to fold to 1'X3'.
In a similar vein, my own N scale switching layout is 18"X72" and would fit in many closets
Best of luck
you know what dude? What I would do (and actually did) would be to get a couple choice pieces of equipment that you think/know you will use later on in your life and then GO CRIZAZY! on them, lol.
Before I had my layout up, I weathered my models. Get a few junky things to practice your skills on, and then move up to your choice models. I would personally start on an engine, whatever period/type you like the most.
I say this, because you can TOTALLY use this to get chicks, too (i'm actually serious). By having a couple diesels (or even one) that you've detailed the crap out of with snowplows, fuel guages, air filters, MU cables, MU hoses, wire grab irons, number boards, upgraded front/rear headlight sets, drop steps, lift rings, cab shades, windshield wipers, and air horns and then weathered, you can totally pull off that you're 'an artist' and not just 'into trains'. It would be just like someone who paints, or draws... just a different medium.
I suggest this, because it takes time... it presents a legit, yet easily over-come-able challenge, and its something that you can keep forever, and when your 48, you can look at that engine running down your layout and think back on how many chicks it helped you score with
Haha, but nah dude, seriously... i'm 22 so I know how you feel.
Oh, and you MUST start listening to the Grateful Dead. How can you be in college and into trains and NOT be blasting that sick 11/1/77 Terrapin Station, grooving an early 70's Big Railroad Blues or rockin' the Workingman's Dead version of Casey Jones? Besides that, Jerry himself got into model railroading in the early 90's when he got into painting as well.
N Scale, Montana Rail Link, using Kato Unitrack on a black/gray board. Rearrange the track every once in a while, just like they do at the railheads in the Powder River Basin! Seriously though, the Unitrack, while expensive, will allow you to break it down, rearrange it, etc. You can set things up to play with the trains, then stash them if needed, etc.
HO and N are the only practical options, you just have to decide which factor is more limiting, space or $$. Its easiest to do HO on the cheap cheap, but takes more space. N is possible to do cheap ($65-$80 for quality new locos if you're not too picky on roadnames), albeit not as cheap as HO (smaller market, less opportunity for blowout sales), but more space effective. Z, while really space effective, is also pricey, pricey, pricey.
The best thing about using the Unitrack is you can experiment easily with different trackplans to your hearts content.
As for the "college experience" blah blah blah. I'm not saying that to be disrespectful of the others, but I wouldn't put too much emphasis on chasing the "college experience." But then again, I went to college in my home town, lived off campus the entire time, worked multiple jobs at the same time as going to school, went off to one war, got married and had four kids while I was in college, so mayhap my perspective on the value of the college experience is skewed. If you considered it to be a crucial part of college, you'd probably belong to a fraternity by now. Just make sure that you do socialize with other students, and that you don't spend all your time cooped up in your cell, er, dorm room, even if it is to play with your choo choos.
And if you want some ideas for simple engineering projects, let me know. I was going to have my son help me out on them, but he went and changed majors from engineering to pastoral studies.
Grace and peace, BD
truth of the matter is, with my current class schedule, i have more time than i do homework.... i spend about equal amounts of time doing homework as compaired ot actual class time. I have always realized that studies come first, but like i said the question that is remaining now is what do i do with the time that im not studing or writing papers (3 essays a week makes me cry), I really dont want to do the usual college stuff, because honestly that doesnt appeal to me. Thank you all for the advice though i really do appriciate it!
Hi!
As indicated by "Mister Beasley", this is a really important time of your life. I urge you to put your efforts into your education, if for no other reason than it will allow you access to higher paying jobs that will allow you to put more monies into the hobby later on in life. In simple terms, you will never regret doing your very best in school!
What I would do if I were you, is to subscribe to MR and/or RMC or CTT and allow them to keep your MR juices flowing. And, if you really have spare time, do some future layout planning!
"Trust me",
Mobilman44
ENJOY !
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
Sawyer Berry
Clemson University c/o 2018
Building a protolanced industrial park layout
When I was an undergrad living in the dorm, I built a small HO layout, about 30"x50". One year I had it mounted with hinges on the headboard of the bed - it swung down for operation. Another year I mounted it on the back of the desk with hinges, and again, it swung down for use. The bed worked out better - it was always a pain clearing off the desk! The layout was a double loop of track, over and under, with a couple of sidings in the middle.
Ted
My plan at this point however is to draw a small track plan (since my major is Engineering that shouldnt be that hard) and then hopefully build a small either section or layout over the multiple breaks (christmas and Thanksgiving).