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12" to the Foot Track Plan Pattern

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  • Member since
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  • From: Seattle Area
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Posted by Capt. Grimek on Sunday, October 5, 2008 1:42 PM
Hi John,
Sorry I haven't made it over yet. One of these days! Immersed in back drop construction/painting. 2nd primer coat, blue next week! (I screwed panels directly to the wall and paper taped seams with vinyl caulking, coved corners to 22" for those who helped me with advice about those things).

Maybe when I can slow down during bench work. Gotta stink up the house
fast and move the "crap" back into that room sooner than later to keep my wife supportive and in the cheering section and fit my helper buddies' schedules.

So...it sounds like there would be no harm in burying paper templates under the cork roadbed on top of plywood permanently if I go that route? I like the idea of lifting a corner or edge, slipping carbon paper under
a little at a time, but these sheets are 17' long and 3' wide and I'd like to keep 'em that way, cutting the
extra/blank areas away from the cookie cuttered roadbed areas.

It's always cool to see how many different ways there are to do these things.



Thanks Jules, I'll check out the video clip. Yes, copier/printer ribbons (even recycled) can break the bank pronto!

Raised on the Erie Lackawanna Mainline- Supt. of the Black River Transfer & Terminal R.R.

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Posted by JulesB on Sunday, October 5, 2008 1:40 PM

Maybe a look at Fastracks new "Infinate Track System" would be usefull for you. They have a vidio of it on http://www.handlaidtrack.com

Jules

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Posted by jxtrrx on Sunday, October 5, 2008 10:19 AM

I also used 1:1 printouts from Xtrk-Cad.  I scotch-taped everything together.  Xtrk printouts line up easily.  Then I laid it all out, and used large-headed thumb tacks to hold it in place, and removed a few tacks in a section, slipped carbon paper under to trace (just using a dull pencil).  Flawless.  Perfect.

By the way, I use plywood, not foam.  My thumb tack method probably would not be secure in foam.

-Jack My shareware model railroad inventory software: http://www.yardofficesoftware.com My layout photos: http://s8.photobucket.com/albums/a33/jxtrrx/JacksLayout/
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Posted by hewitt on Saturday, October 4, 2008 11:51 PM

I used XTrkCad to design my layout and printed out full size the areas that needed to be perfect.

these areas were the turnouts and curves etc and I left the straight areas in between so the flextrack could be added with gentle curves which I think looks better than completely straight track

I glued these areas down and built everything  on top, with no problems.

 

trevor

trevor Experience enables you to recognize a mistake when you make it again.
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Posted by johncolley on Saturday, October 4, 2008 10:09 AM
At first I was surprised when I saw joe Fugate's video no.2 on Layout Planning and Construction. His method is a neat idea, but, being in the business, he must buy his ink cartridges by the case, eh? I would consider three line or the centerline method you describe would be fine and the sheets could even be pinned, taped, or glued on the plywood floor as a guide for your cork roadbed install. I tend to do my laying out right on the plywood or in the case of yards, etc. I do them on the foam slab, locating the turnouts as needed. Drop me a line on your progress, Jim. I have stud walls between the existing porch columns, with OSB sheathing and windows in place. Eventually I will use Tyvec and T-111 siding to match the rest of the house, (spendy!) but for now it is just painted to match, and I have temporarily trimmed out the windows. With insulation and drywall down the road it will be a snug train room. Hopefully I will have some of my modules set up to work on soon. For now I only have a 4 foot 1x4 with flex track across the desk in my bedroom to test and configure my locos. At least I get to listen to them when nobody else is home! I hope to see you in Chilliwack on Oct. 25/26LOL John Colley, Port Townsend, WA
jc5729
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Posted by tomikawaTT on Friday, October 3, 2008 5:49 PM

I never have been able to plan anything bigger than a ping-pong table layout in great detail.  My present layout 'plan' is a sketch drawn in Armstrong squares.  Detailed track planning is done full size on card stock 500 scale meters (or less) ahead of the tracklaying crew.  The card stock is cut out, tie-strip wide, and used to mark out the cut lines on whatever plywood I'm cookie-cutting that day.  Then I lay it on some fan-fold underlayment (thin extruded foam) and spray it with grey rattle-can paint.  The foam gets cut into roadbed and caulked to the cookie-cut plywood subgrade, which is wider than the roadbed base to allow attachment of scenery.

There is now a pink strip exactly the shape of the trackwork, right down the middle of the roadbed (the sloped sides of which are also pink.)  If I was so inclined, I could lay flex track right on the foam, but instead I caulk down the cardstock template and lay my track on that - clear caulk under the template, grey caulk under the flex track.

As I see it, the major point is to make sure that everything in the roadbed/trackwork 'sandwich' is securely anchored to whatever is above and below it, unless that, 'Thing,' is air.  Since I consider ballasting track to be part of second stage scenery construction, I can't depend on ballast glue to hold anything in position - except for the ballast itself.

Chuck (modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - on full scale track templates)

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  • From: Muskoka, Ont.
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Posted by BigG on Thursday, October 2, 2008 10:15 PM

 No, my 'sections' were random length. What I did was to take the 4x8' sheets of Velum and roll them like (4' wide) scrolls, and then try to get the best fit of track bed to minimize the wastage of plywood. Some of my pieces were 8' long, while the others were somewhere from 2' and up. Remembering that this was to build the 2 layer sandwich, the tracing was done again for the other layer, and the criteria was to never have 2 joints within 6" of each other (that's why I marked the section-ends and numbered them onto the original drawing). I marked out the 3" width of my sub'bed and the centreline on the tracings, and transferred them with a stilletto point onto the plywood and joined the dots like in a kid's puzzle. Worked beautifully. For tracing accuracy, I unwound the scroll and taped it to the plywood sheet before poking the dots. Also marked on the upper layer were the turnout drawbar locations. If I get to do another, I might use 3-1/2" bed width, since in a few spots there was a bit of springiness because of the distance between supporting risers that I had to deal with- not a big fix, but it had to be done.

 The plumb bob just kept me on the straight and narrow as I put the sections end-to-end. Funny how a thin jigsaw blade can wander just a bit, and after a couple of joints, that small error can add up, especially on a curve!  The orig drawing is on very heavy paper I got at the local carpet/vinyl store. It comes in the rolls of flooring to keep skidmarks from scratching the surfaces. And it was free! It's strength means I can walk on it without stretching it too much, so it'll survive until the scenery is done, whenever...

 The only gaps in the benchwork are where I knew there would be a long bridge across the end of the yard, and the other where there will be a drop-down leaf containing a Bascule bridge that will run across the entrance to the operating-pit. Any other bridges or trestles will be cut as I get to them. I wanted to get trains rolling now so I wouldn't get bogged down in construction. FWIW, the base of my plan is #62 from Lin Westcott's book "101 Trackplans", with some changes like a 4 track staging area with provision for continuous running, and a size change to fit the allotted space.. 

 I work as a lonewolf, and often seem to reinvent the wheel. Glad to see another modeller who has done it this way also. Thanks for the vote of confidence!

      George

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Posted by Capt. Grimek on Thursday, October 2, 2008 1:53 AM
Thanks guys. Very helpful info.
I could only afford one copy (3 36" strips 17ft. long) so I guess it'll
get transfered directly to the plywood via spiked wheel or traced or left under the cork roadbed in it's entirety.
My copy (and original hand drawn plan) only has the single center line so I'll have to tack track or cork down lst and trace it to get my double/outside roadbed/track lines.

I can't see a downside of leaving the paper/plan under the tacked down cork roadbed and track can you?
That would be easiest and fastest. Will this cause any problems later?

Unfortunately the best price I could find in my area was $79 to make the plan blow up copy at a local
blueprint outfit. The paper costs are surprisingly expensive ($59 for bond paper strips to the dimensions
indicated above.) so a 2nd copy was out of the question... This layout will use at least 4 sheets of ply so I guess my price isn't way out of line
compared with your one sheet of ply.

BigG, when you say you did sections at a time did you mean that places where bridges would be needed
later, caused to to cut the roadbed into sections rather than one continuous cookie cutter run?

I appreciate the info. The use of a plumb bob to a copy below the bench is interesting and something I would not have thought of. Is that step really needed to line up centerlines if you've already traced them
out onto the plywood?

Raised on the Erie Lackawanna Mainline- Supt. of the Black River Transfer & Terminal R.R.

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Posted by subman on Wednesday, October 1, 2008 11:53 PM

I did the same thing as you taking a plan that was 1/2" per foot and blowing it up full size to 13`10" by 6`6". It also took 3 sheets to accomplish this at a cost of $25 per set. I bought 3 sets and have used every one. I first layed the plan on the floor and built the benchwork to the plan making sure that I did not space a joist over a turnout throwbar. After completing the benchwork I then layed another set  on the table and cut the plan along the track lines and then traced the cut line to the plywood. I did have a little problem lining up the sheets as I lost some accuracy between the different sheets (about1/2") If I ever do this again I will go to a place that has a 60 inch machine as it will eleminate the third sheet and I will place sheet carbon paper under the plan face down to the plywood and run a pencil over the 60 inch sheets theryby forcing the plan onto the plywood. I left the set on the floor as I was able to take measurements off that set to check on the accuracy of the drawn plan on the tabletop and crossreference it with the scale drawing that I had blown up.

Bob D As long as you surface as many times as you dive you`ll be alive to read these posts.

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Posted by BigG on Wednesday, October 1, 2008 11:43 PM

 I traced my 100% size drawing onto Velum tracing paper that I taped together to make 8'x4' sheets (same size as my plywood). By doing sections of track at a time, I was able to reduce the wood wastage to practically nil by careful fitting of the sections on the paper. I marked on the original plan each section copied. Since my sub'bed is a 2-layer glued sandwich of 1/4" ply, I did this twice, staggering the joints by at least 6" to avoid cusps at the joints. In effect, I now have a 11x14' cookie cutter layout that crosses over itself, made of a continuous sheet of 1/2" ply.

 Since I'm not too speedy, some of the pieces lay flat on the cellar floor for over a year after cutting, and all fit nicely when I went to assemble them. The nice thing is that the grade changes are smooth and vertical easements were a snap to do. (I laid the lower pieces of ply onto their risers before gluing the upper layer to them. Use lotsa clamps!!) 

 As for line error, I can't say there was any, or none of consequence. The track centreline was drawn onto the velum and onto the ply as the final reference for the cork that would come later. I'd do a sight-check on critical turnouts like at yard throats before gluing the cork down. I have a lot of curved turnouts; they save real estate well. Flextrack is very forgiving if you make small changes later. My original drawing is still on the floor as a slop-catcher. I'd drop a plumbline to it occasionally as I was building to keep the centreline in place. The paper will disappear later after the paint and plaster are done.

  George 

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Posted by Capt. Grimek on Wednesday, October 1, 2008 9:02 PM
Thanks. I wondered how much displacement you saw on average. Much more than an eighth or quarter of an inch? I also thought about building right on top of the pattern and wondered if that would cause any problems in the future from swelling, etc. or once it's sealed in glue and ballast it's fine? (I'd think so.)

I'm planning on cookie cutter construction but this might allow me to cut out all of my roadbed to shape
prior to afixing them to the risers. Is there a huge advantage to doing the latter?

I've got to get the benchwork started in a couple of weeks before I'll be able to test out the pattern.
Might find a floor to stretch it out on somewhere in the meantime just to be sure it'll fit in the room it's supposed to...

Raised on the Erie Lackawanna Mainline- Supt. of the Black River Transfer & Terminal R.R.

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Posted by ChrisNH on Wednesday, October 1, 2008 8:56 PM

Most of the trouble I had with full size track plans was lining the pieces up. You should have a lot easier time of that compared to my array of 11"x17" laser prints. Still, the area where track moves from one piece to another is where little alignment errors creep in. A small move at one end can result in a lot of displacement at the other.

I used a pounce wheel and/or a stylus pushing down on tailor's transfer paper to get the plan onto my subroadbed. Next time I may just glue it right down and build on top of that.. undecided at this point.

Good luck!

Chris

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  • From: Seattle Area
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12" to the Foot Track Plan Pattern
Posted by Capt. Grimek on Wednesday, October 1, 2008 8:46 PM
I've had my 3/4" to the foot track plan blown up by a local blue print company to real life 12" to the foot
so that I can lay it out on the bench top and see if the plan is close to reality or if more adjustments than expected will be needed.
It'll come in three 36 inch by
17ft. strips. I realize that due to blow up steps, paper stretch, etc. that things will maybe be off as much as a quarter of an inch (?) , but I think this will help reduce a newbie's flex track waste due to errors and more immediate and accurate placement of yard ladders, etc.

Are there any other issues/problems that I should expect to crop up? I'm picking it up tomorrow.
Hopefully this will be a good investement. I think it's going to take the fear out of moving beyond snap track Atlas layouts for me.

Thanks.

Raised on the Erie Lackawanna Mainline- Supt. of the Black River Transfer & Terminal R.R.

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