Rather than start a new thread for my new plan (which is much simpler than what i was aiming for with my other plans) I'll just use this one.
This is a simple 1 level layout with under layout staging. It has all that I want, a good loop for a scenic trestle area, some elevation change, the ability for continuous running (which is relatively new, since I was planning on using point to point operation with my other plans--a more than interesting concept, but not a concept to be toyed with now), an engine servicing area, and it uses staging to eliminate a toy-like feeling. (That being, I can drive trains into the yard from staging, and from the yard to staging, but still have the option to just run trains in a loop if I want)
It has 3 'mini industries', that being 3 separate tracks that have to be switched for 1 large industry to keep things interesting. The feel I was going for with this layout, was '4x8 extended', that being, the relatively simple principles of a 4x8 layout, that uses space more effectively and gives a longer mainline run.
Now one thing, I did not do with this layout, that many people have suggested, is give the yard a yard lead and A/D tracks. Why? If you look at a usual D&RGW narrow gauge yard, rarely was the yard anything more than a 2 or 3 track yard, with a standard pyramid ladder, and a passenger depot right on the main (and maybe engine servicing facilities). Speaking of the yard, I have changed my standards for the trains to be run on the layout. 1 Loco, about 5-11 cars plus caboose. Just about 5 feet long. So my shortest yard track is 66" long. So without further adue, here is the plan.
Main Layout Level:
Staging:
gandydancer19 wrote:Well, yards are yards, and to operate well they should have the same elements. The Drill track could connect back to the mainline and double as an arrival / departure track as long as it will hold one train.Have you decided on how many cars your longest train will have? That will determine the length of any passing sidings and arrival / departure tracks. I was running eight cars and a caboose on my last NG layout, for operations purposes.Glad you got the book. Here is what I do when reading a reference book the first time. I read it from cover to cover. Just read it, just read the words, don't try and understand it on the first reading. Then I will re-read the sections that interest me and then try to digest the meaning.
Well, yards are yards, and to operate well they should have the same elements. The Drill track could connect back to the mainline and double as an arrival / departure track as long as it will hold one train.
Have you decided on how many cars your longest train will have? That will determine the length of any passing sidings and arrival / departure tracks. I was running eight cars and a caboose on my last NG layout, for operations purposes.
Glad you got the book. Here is what I do when reading a reference book the first time. I read it from cover to cover. Just read it, just read the words, don't try and understand it on the first reading. Then I will re-read the sections that interest me and then try to digest the meaning.
Many thanks for the help, I will try and incorperate the drill/A&D track into a yard. And my longest train will be in the area of 130 inches long, that being two locomotives, 25 cars, and a caboose. That would be a rarity though, most trains will average one or two locomotives, 7-14 cars and a caboose. I will also re try reading Track Planning for Realistic Operation.
--Jake
Elmer.
The above is my opinion, from an active and experienced Model Railroader in N scale and HO since 1961.
(Modeling Freelance, Eastern US, HO scale, in 1962, with NCE DCC for locomotive control and a stand alone LocoNet for block detection and signals.) http://waynes-trains.com/ at home, and N scale at the Club.
gandydancer19 wrote:A good yard should have a couple of things. One is a yard lead that allows a cut of cars or the last train to be classified (sorted) without blocking the mainline. Another is an arrival departure track that allows trains to arrive and depart, also without blocking the mainline. It can be one track in a pinch. If you are going to use cabooses, you need a place to put them that is not a regular yard track. It is called a caboose track. It can be short enough to hold about three or four cabooses.Here are a couple of previous postings about yard designs. They should help you. I know they helped me on my yard design.http://cs.trains.com/forums/1540030/ShowPost.aspxhttp://cs.trains.com/forums/1490163/ShowPost.aspxSince you are still in the design stage of your layout, I would suggest that you find and get a copy of John Armstrong's book "Track Planning For Realistic Operation". It is very good, and since you are young, it will serve you well in the future as well as now.
A good yard should have a couple of things. One is a yard lead that allows a cut of cars or the last train to be classified (sorted) without blocking the mainline. Another is an arrival departure track that allows trains to arrive and depart, also without blocking the mainline. It can be one track in a pinch. If you are going to use cabooses, you need a place to put them that is not a regular yard track. It is called a caboose track. It can be short enough to hold about three or four cabooses.
Here are a couple of previous postings about yard designs. They should help you. I know they helped me on my yard design.
http://cs.trains.com/forums/1540030/ShowPost.aspx
http://cs.trains.com/forums/1490163/ShowPost.aspx
Since you are still in the design stage of your layout, I would suggest that you find and get a copy of John Armstrong's book "Track Planning For Realistic Operation". It is very good, and since you are young, it will serve you well in the future as well as now.
Thanks for the links, Mac. Those will be helpful, as for the John Armstrong book, I have it but have only read part of it. I'll admit a bit of weakness on my part here, I have many times tried to read the entire book, but I can never keep myself going through it. Also, as for the drill track, I purposely left those out, since I have never seen one on a narrow gauge yard probably because most weren't constantly switching trains like most standard gauge yards. Although I have a hard time finding decent pictures of yards, so I could be wrong.
Texas Zepher wrote: Jake1210 wrote:yes this is a narrow gauge layout. Toledo was/is a freelanced town, as I am planning on making the entire layout a freelanced branch of the D&RGW, and I didn't really plan for the layout to run to Moffat, I just slapped Moffat into the description to keep it from saying something to the effect of "...From Toledo to Undetermined".Ah, what time period are you talking about? Are you aware of all the really cool branch lines of the D&RG and RGW railroads had in the late 18xx and early 19xx? There is a set of books called Trails Among the Columbine that deal with this very subject. I've got the one for the Calumet Branch and Turret Mining Area of the D&RG. And another for the Monarch Branch of the D&RGW. There is also the book Tracking Ghost Railroads in Colorado that shows the amazing amount of railroad track that used to exist in Colorado.
Jake1210 wrote:yes this is a narrow gauge layout. Toledo was/is a freelanced town, as I am planning on making the entire layout a freelanced branch of the D&RGW, and I didn't really plan for the layout to run to Moffat, I just slapped Moffat into the description to keep it from saying something to the effect of "...From Toledo to Undetermined".
I was planning on having the layout set in about 1935. Those branches you mentioned, what were they like? I am interested in routes like the Cumbres and Toltec or Durango and Silverton, you know, steep grades, rock faces, rivers running alongside or under the line. All of the really photogenic stuff, and that is what I am trying to plan my layout for. Also, are those two books you mentioned still in print? Or if not are they relatively easy to find?
My apologies for not responding to your comments, I have been quite busy with my schooling.
tangerine-jack wrote:All work and no play makes Jake a dull boy. Enough of the planning, what you have is somewhat workable, start building the yard end and get some trains operating. You can nail down the rest of the details later. (personal opinion- loose the round house)
dehusman wrote:There are only 3 tracks So that means you can only make two blocks (the cut to be switched occupies the 3rd track and if you block the back track then you have sealed off access to the turntable). If you make 2 blocks then you cannot meet two trains at the yard. If you only make 1 block in tha yard, then you don't need to call it a yard. So that means if a train terminates at the yard. Nothing can come out of staging or go into staging until the terminating train is completely switched.You haven't really said what you plan to do at the yard or what its purpose is. If its not really a switching yard, just a siding with a set out track and a helper terminal or you are only planning to run one or two trains at a time, its not a problem. If its supposed to be the class yard that will supprt your whole layout, then its a bit undersized.Dave H.
There are only 3 tracks So that means you can only make two blocks (the cut to be switched occupies the 3rd track and if you block the back track then you have sealed off access to the turntable). If you make 2 blocks then you cannot meet two trains at the yard. If you only make 1 block in tha yard, then you don't need to call it a yard. So that means if a train terminates at the yard. Nothing can come out of staging or go into staging until the terminating train is completely switched.
You haven't really said what you plan to do at the yard or what its purpose is. If its not really a switching yard, just a siding with a set out track and a helper terminal or you are only planning to run one or two trains at a time, its not a problem. If its supposed to be the class yard that will supprt your whole layout, then its a bit undersized.
Dave H.
Dave, the yard is passenger depot, small classification yard (switching 2 trains at a time) and a helper pickup/dropoff point. But I will explain that more in depth later when I am finished working on a new layout plan. (which includes a redesigned yard)
ndbprr wrote:Be careful, be very very careful on those S curves that you have sufficient straight sections between the two curves. You usually need at least one car length of the longest cars you intend to run. The reason is that the couplers will want to skew in opposite directions at the same time derailing one or both cars every time they pass that point. The straight section gives them time to come back to the center before going the other way.
I had already taken that into account, and had at least 4 inches between the curves, but I am redesigning the plan with at least 6 inches between them.
selector wrote:It is not clear to me where the bench begins and ends throughout the diagram. From where will you operate? How will you reach stuff?
That is rather hard to say now, seeing as that plan is obsolete but it was going to be a walk in layout with a peninsula, with a duck-under entrance. It would have helped for me to have marked the layouts edges, but I was tired at the time and didn't do so.
Thank you all for your comments, and be on the watch for track plan V.3.0 (This was the start of 2.0, and I finished 2.5, but didn't think it felt right after Mark [hoople] and I discussed it)
EDIT: Also, Texas Zephyr, yes this is a narrow gauge layout. Toledo was/is a freelanced town, as I am planning on making the entire layout a freelanced branch of the D&RGW, and I didn't really plan for the layout to run to Moffat, I just slapped Moffat into the description to keep it from saying something to the effect of "...From Toledo to Undetermined".
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
The Dixie D Short Line "Lux Lucet In Tenebris Nihil Igitur Mors Est Ad Nos 2001"
I think I'm actually starting to get moderately good (or at least not-suckish!) at track planning. I'm still working on the specifics but I have a general idea of what the layout is going to do now. (It took long enough!!) But right now I am still kinking out a basic idea. So far I have a lower deck yard that I finally like. So before I get going on everything else, would you people mind giving me your thoughts on the yard? I'm going to fix the peninsula to make the aisles more balanced, and try to eliminate (or at least slightly widen) the pinch points at the blob end of it. So don't concern yourself with that just yet. But either way, the lead on the left end of the yard is going to the staging yard and reverse loop, and the right is (obviously) going to the main line. So please tell me what you think. If you wish, I'll label the yard tracks, but everyone I've shown it to was able to figure what was what.
But, enough yammering, and onto the yard plan:
TIA!