It depends on how you think about it.
If your guess 'n check is about the track, it is one thing, but if it is about the entire scene that another. (same goes for planning too)
Don't forget when you are guessing and plopping to include room for scenery, towns, buildings, industries, access roads, parking lots, etc.
My whole first Rock Ridge and Train City was about making those things fit as an after-thought. It would have a heck of a lot more hair if I would have thought about more than track.
Chip
Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.
I gleened through MR magazine for about two years looking and anguishing over track plans for my first layout. I finally found two or three that I liked and hand drew something that looked like a combination of the parts of the planss that I liked. A friend graciously drew it in Xtrkcad and after 13 revisions, I started building. As I went along, I saw things that were OK, but maybe I could do it a little better, and as a result, I'm barely close to the original plan. I started laying it out by pinning flex track and turnout templates to the foam. I made radius templates by joining curved sections of track in a couple of different radii. I would check a curve with these "templates" and as long as it was that size or larger and it looked good, it stayed like that. I did use the printouts as a reference for track spacing and to locate some turnouts, but it's pretty much been plan as you go. I've got all of the roadbed and about half of the track laid, although, I'm redoing a section now that needed some help and it won't be long before I get to at least see a train run. This my first layout and it's a learning curve, but it's a ton of fun, and I'm lovin' it. My big regret is that I just waited so long to get started. Gotta go rip up some more roadbed..
There's no substitute for a plan if your layout will last more than a couple of years. Without an adequately pre-planned track design, you're setting yourself up for boredom and/or failure down the road.
Having said that, I do believe that, if someone has a solid understanding of how railroads work and layout design in general, the build-benchwork-first-and-add-tracks-to-it procedure can result in a worthwhile layout. Especially if you're willing to make changes later.
The current HO layout I'm building I planned for a couple of years on paper and computer. The computer work was to place the major curves and turnouts. I then ran trains on it in my mind's eye to see how things would flow. When it came time to lay roadbed and track, I used the computer plan to place the curves and turnouts, printing out crossovers full size so I could get accrurate spacing, and then used eye and natural flow of the flex track to place the rest. If I'd have used the computer drafted plan verbatim, I couldn't have really gotten in things I really wanted the way I wanted them. Because unless you have a 3D drafting program with good models of the structures you're using, you'll not get an honest feel for what you want to have on the layout.
If you use computer work to layout your track, make sure the program has accurate dimensions and geometry for the track you want to use, especially turnouts and crossovers.
de N2MPU Jack
Proud NRA Life Member and supporter of the 2nd. Amendment
God, guns, and rock and roll!
Modeling the NYC/NYNH&H in HO and CPRail/D&H in N
Raised on the Erie Lackawanna Mainline- Supt. of the Black River Transfer & Terminal R.R.
This is pretty much the approach that George Selios used with his F&SM railroad. He didn't plan out his track. As he built the railroad, he laid the industrial track where he thought it would look right. I'm sure he had a general track plan in his head but did not get into the specifics until he laid the tracks.
I used a similar approach but did go to the trouble of sketching a track plan with paper and pencil. I kept a flexible approach as I built the layout. Often what looks right on paper does not work in 3-D. Also sometimes I get better ideas for track placement when I see it on the layout.
Flexibility is the key to this approach. I see nothing wrong with what you are planning to do. Even a detailed track plan will often need to be modified as you go.
Jake, Been there and doing that.
First I had a general idea of my track plan so I estimated the turnouts needed, bought flex track as well as some snap track along with roadbed. Also I got some structures to help with the overall laying of the track. Some of the outside loops of track are glued down but the rest is held in place with track nails until I have the track laid for the industries etc. As you can see I have a long way to go but this method is working for me. It's a challenge and that's what makes it interesting. As has been previously mentioned as you are laying track you have to be thinking of roads and streets. Keep in mind that you can count on the forum to help you along the way.
The hardest part is to bite the bullet and start laying the track.
My advice is to do it your self.
Don't Ever Give Up
Yeah, Me Too. I'm with you and Loathar.
I spent two and a half years trying to get a plan down and I was never satisfied. I made up my mind that it wouldn't take as long to do if I had to re-do an area and in the mean time I would get some train running in. I had a main idea and I just went with it and kept adding and adjusting and have had a lot more fun along the way than sitting with computer or pad and pencil. That was the worst for me.
I now have a three deck layout with a four loop helix, nicely started on some scenery (mountains) four tunnels. always something new cropping up, some problems to solve but boy it is lots of learning and a good feeling of accomplishment.
Don't be afraid to just get at it. Nothing is cast in stone. Nothing is so permanent that it can't be changed or re-worked. Just get doing it and have fun as that is what it is all about. Other than that it is just work. WE WANT THE FUN >>>>>>> Yeah. Right Loathar ??
Johnboy out..................
from Saskatchewan, in the Great White North..
We have met the enemy, and he is us............ (Pogo)
I made a crude sketch. Then layed it out full size on the floor with masking tape. Then I built the table and just built the railroad. Some of it looks sort of like the sketch. I have had to change a few things, but that is how the prototype does it, they make it fit the current customers. None of the aditions even had sketches. I just laid some track in the existing space and went from there.
My hats off to the planners, but my heart is with those who just build it.
Don't feel too bad. I'm the same way. I ended up using some graph paper and colored pencils. I got a plan that was pretty close. Laid my two outside mainlines and went from there. I've made a few changes to the plan since laying track, but it's pretty close. (nothing disastrous) My biggest problem is fitting roads into the plan now. But it's still a manageable problem.
You can download track plans from the internet and look for areas you like. Print those areas out and kind of paste them together to get a rough idea of a plan. I found some nice switching layout pics that I opted to use instead of what I had planned for yards.
I refer to what you want to do as, "Planned plopping," as in, "Make a general plan to keep the curve radii valid, then plop flex track onto it and bend it to align turnouts to sidings, yards, allow for passenger platforms..."
I laid out my space in Armstrong squares, sketched a projected mainline that would meet my needs, then laid out curve and transition templates on cardstock. When it's time to build in a specific place I lay down the appropriate templates for the main track, verify that clearances will be maintained, then wing the rest with bent flex and a pencil, the whole on a sheet of cardstock which will be cut up to provide a template on which I will do the final tracklaying.
One joker. I handlay specialwork, so I don't have to worry about fitting a Brand X number whatever into my track plan. If you use commercial 'switches,' take the one you want to use and plop it on a photocopier, then use the photocopy to fit it into your full-size track plan.
Happy tracklaying.
Chuck (modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
Amen to that! The only POSSIBLE down side could be some do-over work as you progress to go back and adjust pervious work to make new additions/changes fit.
Many a fine layout was created "back in the day" using good 'ol fashioned "Kentucky windage"
Best of luck!
-Jim-
Okay, long story short, I'm SICK of layout planning. I'm almost positive I have a mild case of ADD now, because I can't sit in front of XtrkCad (no, it has nothing to do with the program, you XTC haters! ) and plan a layout, not on DRail, AnyRail, RTS, Paper and Pencil, ect. So I have been giving thought to only giving a general location of a few things around the room, the major curves around the walls, the basic outline of the peninsula, and the yard(s), and just guess n' check to fill in the gaps, kinda like a surveyor. Because instead of sticking to a plan (even though I could just change the plan any way) I'd like to try and let loose my creative side that likes to hide in the dark recesses of my mind when I plan. I get so many ideas for a scene when I'm in school or something, but I loose sight of that vision when I try to plan the layout. So I figure, if I can just lay out the major things, it would be easy to let that vision out, know? Has anyone tried this method, and NOT had disasterous outcomes? Because I am so close to paying someone to try and design a layout for me (which isn't really on the top of my to-do list...) it is not funny.
Jake "Done ranting!" S.