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Looking at making a pond, ideas?

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  • Member since
    September 2006
  • From: Wayne County Michigan
  • 678 posts
Looking at making a pond, ideas?
Posted by dale8chevyss on Wednesday, February 20, 2008 10:59 AM

Hello.

 

I've been doing research on water scenes online and at woodlandscenics.com about water effects and what have you as I am interested in making a small pond on my layout.  I've been looking towards the 16 dollar bottle of fake water to construct this pond and I have a pretty good idea of what I need to do.

 

Wondering if I could get some info on anyone who cares to post on it, tips on what I need to look for, etc from someone who may have done what I am looking to do in the past.

 

Thanks

Daniel 

Modeling the N&W freelanced at the height of their steam era in HO.

 Daniel G.

  • Member since
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Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, February 20, 2008 11:22 AM

  I tried that WS realistic water on a diorama once. Make sure to fill in ALL holes in plaster cloth or foam as it will seep through the holes and go into the benchwork, or worse, into the layout wiring.(don't ask me how I know that). WS talus can fill major holes. Also, try covering the shores with a light coating of green ground foam on top of real sand for algae, etc. Since it dries absolutely clear, some experience is needed with simulating water depths with paint. Old, rotted REAL twigs can be covered with (once again) a light dusting of green ground foam for moss. Since the WS realistic water can be used as an adhesive, just set the driftwood in the water and pour the WS water in. If you are planning on having a murky pond I came up with an UNTRIED idea:

     1) Pour the RW into a plastic disposable bowl.

     2) Mix in WS "earth undercoat"; less undercoat=less murky

     3) pour RW from bowl into pond; repeat as needed

For tall underwater plants in murky water, simply use some green pipe cleaners, usually found at craft stores. If it is in clear water, it will completely ruin the simulated depth effect, of course you can also go with carving out actual depths, but it consumes a lot of the RW. WS field grass with ends dipped in brown paint can be used for reeds and cattails. I hope this helps!

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Posted by ham99 on Wednesday, February 20, 2008 11:59 AM
Have never used the WS water products, but I like Environtex Lite for water.  I have used it for both standing and moving water.  Yes, be sure your streambed does not leak -- try it with water first.  Pour in layers no thicker than 1/8" at a time.  Color with food colors if you wish, but don't use too much.  Since it is self-levelling, plan your streambed with different levels.  I used rocks to separate levels and then used pieces of glass wood [aquarium filters] soaked in the Environtex downstream from the rocks to model rapids.  I used Angel Hair as a base for waterfalls -- attach at top and bottom of the fall and let the resin run down it. 
  • Member since
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  • From: Dover, DE
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Posted by hminky on Wednesday, February 20, 2008 12:32 PM

There is always my party balloon technique:

 

 At:

http://www.pacificcoastairlinerr.com/scenery/ballon_pond/

 Since water at most distances and shallow viewing angles has no depth it works well

 

Thank you if you visit

Harold

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  • From: Northern Ca
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Posted by jwar on Wednesday, February 20, 2008 2:18 PM

Dan..I was really impressed at first with using WS realistic water (c1211). For larger rocks,  I filed down talis rocks flat with a light coat of RW on the bottom, then placed  them on the water after it dried. The down side is this product never really sets up hard and I have heard of other's with the same problem. I have a ring from a hair spray can in the middle of my river, I inadvertenly sat it there a year later. I am really thinking of scraping it off and using another product that I know will dry hard, it also hold dust and stray foam bits, and scraches very easy. Just my 2 cents...John

John Warren's, Feather River Route WP and SP in HO
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Posted by 2021 on Wednesday, February 20, 2008 4:16 PM

For my money, you can't beat envirotex.  If you want ripples, use water effects.  For a pond no ripples but, make sure you paint the bottom, both to seal and to simulate depth.  Dark in the middle with light tapering to the edges.  I use real, fine filtered soil around my ponds and this is very effective.  You can't learn everything by reading.  The best teacher is experience, so try and see what you think.

Ron K.

  • Member since
    January 2008
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Posted by saronaterry on Wednesday, February 20, 2008 5:40 PM

Envirotex lite is all I use. It drys hard and I clean it with a Swiffer thingy.I agree with the above post about sealing your benchwork. I form the watercourse,slather on some premixed drywall mud,paint it flat black in the "deep"water and my ground color latex feathered into the black.Add rocks, real twigs etc.Pour the Envirotex and let it dry. Add another layer as needed. If your layout is not flat the stuff WILL find the lowest area, and ANY pinhole leaks.Thinner layers seem to work better than one big pour.Heed the directions. I dam the end with layered masking tape and haven't had a problem with dripping.The down side I've seen is it creeps up the rocks and scenery a bit, making them look damp.Doesn't bother me ,just wanted to let you know.

Set anything that'll be in the water before you pour, like bridge piers and such.

I've poured 6 streams/rivers/ponds with the stuff and love it. Oh yeah, mix it in plastic beer glasses and toss'm when done.The kind you get at kegger parties!

Good luck!

Terry

 

Terry in NW Wisconsin

Queenbogey715 is my Youtube channel

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Posted by loathar on Wednesday, February 20, 2008 7:39 PM

http://www.unrealdetails.com/ponds.htm

Here's an idea for the pond base in case you haven't seen these yet.

  • Member since
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  • From: Wayne County Michigan
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Posted by dale8chevyss on Wednesday, February 20, 2008 9:14 PM

I wonder if I could get away with using Minwax Polyurethane instead of Envriotex, unless Envirotex is a product that is readily available at hardware stores.  I've never looked for it.  I'm leary with other posts informing me that WS water does not dry entirely and picks up things that are set on top of them. 

 

Thanks 

Modeling the N&W freelanced at the height of their steam era in HO.

 Daniel G.

  • Member since
    June 2005
  • From: Phoenixville, PA
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Posted by nbrodar on Wednesday, February 20, 2008 9:37 PM

I will third or fourth the comments about WS Realistic Water.  The one place I used it, never set hard, and now has collected bits of ground foam, dust and a bug.  Plus it has a nasty habit of shrinking.

Another option is a painted base, covered with either Enviro-Tex, gloss poly, or acrylic gloss medium.

Nick

Take a Ride on the Reading with the: Reading Company Technical & Historical Society http://www.readingrailroad.org/

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Posted by BlueHillsCPR on Thursday, February 21, 2008 6:14 AM

Check out Joe Fugate's Scenery Clinic on his forum.  Scroll about 3/4 of the way down the page to find the first post on modeling water.

http://siskiyou-railfan.net/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?1270.30 

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Posted by saronaterry on Thursday, February 21, 2008 7:00 AM

I found Envirotex at menards(about $20,but it was enough to pour everything I've done so far).I can't say for sure, but I would assume the big box and wally's mart would carry it, in the paint dept.

Terry

Terry in NW Wisconsin

Queenbogey715 is my Youtube channel

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Posted by MAbruce on Thursday, February 21, 2008 8:02 AM

My pond was made with Modge Podge Gloss Lustre (Gloss medium).  Easy to use, water based, non-toxic, and no harsh fumes.  Dries clear and has held up well for over five years now.  You can purchase it from any major retailer (like Michael's):

The key is really how you paint the bottom of the pond.  Once you get that down, the layer(s) of gloss medium will be the easy part.

  • Member since
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  • From: Wayne County Michigan
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Posted by dale8chevyss on Thursday, February 21, 2008 10:35 AM

Sweet picture!  (wonder what I'm drawn to most, the landscaping or the stunning looks of the J--)

 

Thanks everyone for the help, I'll keep looking into it and probably go with the envirotex as that seems like a better choice for what I want, keeping it dust free and rock hard. 

Modeling the N&W freelanced at the height of their steam era in HO.

 Daniel G.

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: Apache Junction, Arizona It's a dry heat!
  • 351 posts
Posted by perry1060 on Thursday, February 21, 2008 6:15 PM

A pond or river is a great addition to a layout and well worth the effort to create it. I used a two part resin with acrylic green mixed into it before I poured it.

 

 

 

Enjoy the hobby Perry
  • Member since
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  • From: south central PA
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Posted by concretelackey on Thursday, February 21, 2008 6:19 PM
How much does the water medium (envirotex, etc...) change the color of the stream bed/pond bottom? Does it enhance,detract from it at all?
Ken aka "CL" "TIS QUITE EASY TO SCREW CONCRETE UP BUT TIS DARN NEAR IMPOSSIBLE TO UNSCREW IT"
  • Member since
    January 2008
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Posted by saronaterry on Thursday, February 21, 2008 6:44 PM

Ken, the Envirotex dries clear, one of the reasons I like it. you can see the details near shore that you so patiently placed! With the flat black paint in the "deeper " areas it really looks good,IMO.Smile [:)]It seems that a little goes a long way depending on the pour thickness.

Terry

Terry in NW Wisconsin

Queenbogey715 is my Youtube channel

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Posted by dave9999 on Thursday, February 21, 2008 9:05 PM

I have used a product called Klock-Kote. It is a two part epoxy that sets up in about 24 hours. I like that you can make changes within the first hour or so without any damage to the project. Here's a couple of pics. Good luck, Dave

Click for a better veiw

 

It works good for creeks as well...

 

 

 

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Posted by ham99 on Saturday, February 23, 2008 3:44 PM
In our small town, the local hardware stores and lumber yard carry Environtex Lite in 4, 8, and 16 ounce kits in their paint sections.  Crafts people use it for decoupage and clockmaking.
  • Member since
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Posted by izzy on Monday, February 25, 2008 8:07 PM
 MAbruce wrote:

My pond was made with Modge Podge Gloss Lustre (Gloss medium).  Easy to use, water based, non-toxic, and no harsh fumes.  Dries clear and has held up well for over five years now.  You can purchase it from any major retailer (like Michael's):

The key is really how you paint the bottom of the pond.  Once you get that down, the layer(s) of gloss medium will be the easy part.

How did you get the waves? I use the same thing for water but mine dries flat.

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