NCE's Power Cab is a fine little starter set. And the most logical upgrade is adding a Smart Booster bringing it up to a 3 amp system with other benefits as well. But, what is the next step beyond this? What if you want to increase up to 5 amps, or maybe radio?
My question is: what are the most logical, and economical ways to upgrade beyond the Smart Booster? Some specific items that I'm wondering about are:
1. Can you go to 5 amps without adding a throttle? In other words, can you still use the original Power Cab throttle with a 5 amp command/booster? Does is require any factory modifications?
2. If you go up to 5 amps what happens to your Smart Booster; your original Power Panel and your P114 Power Supply? Do these become surplus or can they be re-used some way?
3. I assume that if you add radio components to the origianal Power Cab, the Power Cab/Smart Booster or a 5 amp system, it's simply a matter of adding a wireless base station and an appropriate radio throttle. But, can you not add a throttle and just have the Power Cab throttle converted to radio? What is the cost?
4. I'm familiar with all of the NCE throttle options available and understand that they can be added to the original Power Cab or at any stage of upgrade.
I hope that this is clear and that I haven't mistated anything. Please correct any of my mistatements or misunderstandings. Thanks.
Jerry
Rio Grande vs. Santa Fe.....the battle is over but the glory remains!
Jerry,
Answers are below...
jwils1 wrote:NCE's Power Cab is a fine little starter set. And the most logical upgrade is adding a Smart Booster bringing it up to a 3 amp system with other benefits as well. But, what is the next step beyond this? What if you want to increase up to 5 amps, or maybe radio? My question is: what are the most logical, and economical ways to upgrade beyond the Smart Booster? Some specific items that I'm wondering about are: 1. Can you go to 5 amps without adding a throttle? In other words, can you still use the original Power Cab throttle with a 5 amp command/booster? Does is require any factory modifications?
Yes. You can buy the Power Pro command station and use the Power Cab throttle with that. What happens is that it Power Cab automatically becomes a ProCab throttle. No modifications are necessary.
I think the Smart Booster (SB3) might become superfulous. You can still keep and use the PCP panel and power supply so that you have the option of programing with the Power Cab, right from your bench.
I know that the DB3 power booster doesn't have the "brains" that the SB3 does. I don't know for sure but I would think that you should be able to convert a SB3 to a DB3. This might be a good question to run past Larry Larson @ NCE.
Yes, you will still need the wireless base station and the repeater to go wireless. I think the cost will run you $300+ and you'll still need to send in your Power Cab to have it converted.
4. I'm familiar with all of the NCE throttle options available and understand that they can be added to the original Power Cab or at any stage of upgrade. I hope that this is clear and that I haven't mistated anything. Please correct any of my mistatements or misunderstandings. Thanks. Jerry
Jerry, you've asked some good questions and I think you have a good handle on things.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
Thanks Tom. This all looks pretty logical and not much waste, if any. I've been led to believe that the upgrade path wasn't very good with NCE but that doesn't appear to be the case.
I think if I was pretty sure of eventually going to 5 amps, I might by-pass the Smart Booster upgrade and put that money towards the Power Pro command station. That would depend on whether I could get by with the 2 amps for awhile. I'm not concerned about getting the 28 functions right away and the 2-throttle max. would be okay for me.
It looks like you can get the wireless base station and one repeater from Litchfield for around $226. And maybe for a small area the repeater wouldn't be necessary.
I like the idea of the separate programming and test track using the original Power Cab components. With this you wouldn't have to mess with a progamming track on the layout if you didn't care to.
When adding radio, it would probably be best to just add an 04pr and keep the Power Cab throttle as is.
Thanks again for your help.
Terrific. That's cheaper than I expected it to be.
I would have to agree with the Digitrax folks that their starter system (Zephyr) utilizes the original components for upgrading better than NCE does. Even so, I think NCE still does a pretty good job.
I forgot to mention that the DB3s can be added to a layout create 3A power districts. That's why I was wondering whether or not the SB3s could be converted to DB3s for that purpose. A slight (but correct) modification and - Presto!...Chango! - you have yourself a DB3.
I have a CAB-04p for an extra throttle. However, I use the Power Cab 99% of the time.
Driline wrote:When must one "MOVE" up to the SB3? How many trains can the original Powercab run without having to buy a booster? Just wondering. I've got a small layout 11X7 and without 4 arms, can only run 2 at a time.
The first issue that the SB3 addresses is the PowerCab's limitation of only two throttles, one of which (the PowerCab) must remained plugged in at all times. How many trains you can run will depend on scale, and to some degree on the locos themselves. There are some guidlines, but the more I read, the more I think that they may be overly conservative for modern locos.=, though sound changes the picture somewhat.
Jeff But it's a dry heat!
Vail and Southwestern RR wrote: Driline wrote:When must one "MOVE" up to the SB3? How many trains can the original Powercab run without having to buy a booster? Just wondering. I've got a small layout 11X7 and without 4 arms, can only run 2 at a time.The first issue that the SB3 addresses is the PowerCab's limitation of only two throttles, one of which (the PowerCab) must remained plugged in at all times. How many trains you can run will depend on scale, and to some degree on the locos themselves. There are some guidlines, but the more I read, the more I think that they may be overly conservative for modern locos.=, though sound changes the picture somewhat.
Well, so far I've run 4 trains with sound and no problems, so I guess I won't ever need an SB3. I'll never need more than 2 throttles either, so thats a moot point. As to having the throttle plugged in all the time....I don't really care. Its got to be plugged in to run anyway. I suppose if you had to walk more than 10' in either direction of the plug in, then you would want another jack panel.
Driline wrote: Vail and Southwestern RR wrote: Driline wrote:When must one "MOVE" up to the SB3? How many trains can the original Powercab run without having to buy a booster? Just wondering. I've got a small layout 11X7 and without 4 arms, can only run 2 at a time.The first issue that the SB3 addresses is the PowerCab's limitation of only two throttles, one of which (the PowerCab) must remained plugged in at all times. How many trains you can run will depend on scale, and to some degree on the locos themselves. There are some guidlines, but the more I read, the more I think that they may be overly conservative for modern locos.=, though sound changes the picture somewhat. Well, so far I've run 4 trains with sound and no problems, so I guess I won't ever need an SB3. I'll never need more than 2 throttles either, so thats a moot point. As to having the throttle plugged in all the time....I don't really care. Its got to be plugged in to run anyway. I suppose if you had to walk more than 10' in either direction of the plug in, then you would want another jack panel.
There you go! Sounds like you are set for a good while.
Frank,
Even though I only have a 4 x 8, I like the ability of being able to unplug and plug into a different UTP panel on my layout to be closer to the action. I also like the fact that, with the Smart Booster (SB3), I can now use my Power Cab throttle in "yard mode". Without the SB3, I could only use my CAB-04p throttle in yard mode. Now I can use both.
I would agree, Frank. If you're fine with the Power Cab w/o the Smart Booster, why buy something that you won't utilize or doesn't benefit you. Frank, do you have the newer Power Cab with v.1.28?
This thread got me thinking about where I am headed with DCC. Right now we've got an original Prodigy. The main purpose is mostly just to make sure decoders are installed ok, and to ring out the layout wiring as we progress. I am fully planning to replace it.
So, I'm running through the Digitrax/NCE debate. Nothing that hasn't been done before .
I think I can get my head around the Digitrax options, they are at last reaonably straightforward. So I spent some time today looking at the NCE manuals, prompted by this thread. I want to make sure that I understand correctly that the PowerCad/SB combination gives 3A, but a limit of 4 throttles. As I think about my layout, that is in the very grey area of enough. It might well be, but if I went that way and wanted just one more I'd need to get not only the throttle (obviously), but a CS02. Then the SB becomes just a booster (though I don't see in the manual how to do that), and the PowerCab 'just' a throttle. Am I understanding this right?
Thanks for any enlightenment!
Vail and Southwestern RR wrote:I think I can get my head around the Digitrax options, they are at last reaonably straightforward. So I spent some time today looking at the NCE manuals, prompted by this thread. I want to make sure that I understand correctly that the PowerCad/SB combination gives 3A, but a limit of 4 throttles.
You are absolutely correct. The Smart Booster increases the total maximum output from 1.7A to 3A and the maximum number of throttles from 2 to 4.
As I think about my layout, that is in the very grey area of enough. It might well be, but if I went that way and wanted just one more I'd need to get not only the throttle (obviously), but a CS02. Then the SB becomes just a booster (though I don't see in the manual how to do that), and the PowerCab 'just' a throttle. Am I understanding this right? Thanks for any enlightenment!
Yes. If you wanted to use more than 4 throttles on your layout, you'd need to purchase a Powerhouse Pro command station (CS02). When used in conjunction with the CS02, a Power Cab automatically turns into a ProCab throttle. I'm not sure about the SB3 turning into just a booster. (That would be a question for Larry Larsen @ NCE.) I do know that the DB3s can be daisy-chained to a SB3 in order to create power districts.
The other thing you gain with the Powerhouse Pro (or CS02) is that you're recall stack increases from 2 locomotives (like it is on the Power Cab) to 6. If I'm not mistaken, the Zephyr has a recall stack of 10.
You have received some good ideas. Here is a link to the Yahoo NCE group. There is a lot of info in the Files and Photos sections. The group is quite active.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NCE-DCC/
Rich
If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.
If you are happy with your limits of two throttles and only want to increase the power of the system - just build your own booster and pocket the money.
There are plenty of booster designs out there you can build. Some are simple power only boosters, while others have "smart" features to protect from signal loss and shorts. And the best part is the fact that you can pick the power supply (amps) to suit your needs.
My favorite design is the HABA booster. http://www.pdc.kth.se/~haba/slamra/dcc/booster/
This features protection from electrical shorts and loss of signal. It is very simple and cheap.
You may also want to look at Paco's web page on boosters. It has many designs as well. http://www.tinet.org/~fmco/booster_en.html
Boosters do NOT need to be made by the maker of your system (NCE). You can use any booster that works with NMRA systems. You could even use a Lenz booster on a NCE system if you so choose.