Terry, I think starting with a smaller portion of layout in my case will make the most sense. Not worried about scenery creation or any of that, more concerned about overall time involved in a larger project, plus the lack of any track laying experience. Even considering a 4'x4' table to start with, which would become one end of a larger layout to be built as time (& money) allows.
As for the mining operation, I have long wanted to model one along the lines of The Lavender Pit (Bisbee AZ), except much smaller in scope, (within a 3'-4' hole). But that is in reality much more involved than a freelance mountain range, so I'm leaning towards nixing the idea completely, at least for the foreseeable future. I will however have a few old (perhaps abandoned) mines in the mountains, as the structures available I think are cool, even those that date back to around the time N scale was new.
Look forward to seeing the progress on that large layout you have going. Thanks for the suggestions. Rob
The prime benefit, since you can turn your locos, and one passenger car, at a time on the turntable, is that you can turn an entire train on the wye without handling it. Every time you lift an item you run the risk of damaging it or of marring the paint job or the decals. Yes, it is slight, but over time...better to be able to leave the trains be and turn them the way the real operators did/do still.
But, apart from that, you will want to run trains the other way for variety. You can't turn trains as your diagram exists. So, a reversing loop, of which the wye is essentially one, is often included in "better" layouts, space and money permitting.
It would be nice is someone else viewing this thread would offer an opinion or experience since this is somewhat of a personal choice. I failed to provide the facility in my first trackplan, and made darned sure I could turn a whole train in the current one. I use it every second or third operating session...so it's used more than the turntable.
-Crandell
Edit- P.S. - Terry, I don't want to put you on the spot, but do you understand how the wye allows you to turn the entire train, not the just one item? And if so, again, not wanting to pin you down, would you agree that it would be valuable from the point of view of offering you some variety in tasks, but also a way to re-orient an entire passenger train so that it can return along the route a few hours/a day later? Is that something that you would enjoy having to use when you decide to reverse the train's direction? Then the cost of an hour or so, two turnouts, a section of flextrack cut to fit, and some ballasting is all it'll be for you.
I decided that I wont bother with the little 90'er Ive already made the decision to purchase the 130' ready to run from Walthers... just have not ordered it at the store yet. It still takes up less room than a wye does.
It's one of those kinds of decisions that makes life easier all around. At least on my line.
Terry, you have two tracks that cross each other and then go on to form a nice long oval loop on that central peninsula. I would place a turnout just before the southern one makes its sweep into the oval towards the crossing because as you have it depicted, I think the curvature would be more favourable at that southern approach. It would be a right hand turnout, perhaps curved if necessary, and then arc some track to join the southern branch of that loop a short way into it. There is your wye.
Would you please note the image and save a copy so that I can remove it from my railimages account.
Im not happy with the idea of yarding a train with the engine way up to the end of your drill and your switcher way down to the left trying to caboose to that short track.
At some point you might want to cut off one or two body tracks and use the new found space for a additional run around. You are going to bite off a section of the newly arrived train, set it there, back the train down, bite off another section and hopefully find room to stand with it until your road power gets out of there and into the engine house.
I think the result will be three sections of train on three seperate track with your switcher on the wrong end of it all and no way to run around to reach your ladder.
Driving your road power into your switcher's drill track is a bad idea. That switcher needs to have exclusive ownership of that track. YOU MAY put a caboose track somewhere in the engine facility so that your crew does not have to walk the length of the yard.
I see you coming in from the lower left. Stopping your train with the road power cutting off and proceeding STRAIGHT ahead into the engine facility and your switcher coming down off the drill and pulling the cut off the train to be backed all the way up the drill track and then shoved into a yard track.
Eventually you will run out of train and reach the caboose. Isnt it nice to have the caboose track on the right side? And not waaaaay to the left? If your train was coming in from the RIGHT your caboose SHOULD stop somewhere near that one crossover so your drill track switcher can get to it. and then chew on the rest of the train until the road power is clear to back all the way into the engine facility.
You may want to extend the OLD caboose track towards the left side yard lead and call it the engine escape track.
Suddenly you need two operators now. One to drive the road power and the other the switcher.
Oh, your train length is going to be decided from Engine to Caboose by the switch off the mainline onto your yard lead all the way to your crossover for the drill track. You dont want to hang out onto either mainline because that might interfere with other traffic that wants to use it.
Terry, from a total novice, it looks great to me.
After considering all the various questions to be answered (or at least considered) before starting to build a layout, I find myself wondering if a larger layout is going to prove too time consuming & costly, even though the open expanses I desire would be impossible on a smaller layout. Now I am considering dumping some earlier ideas, like an open pit mining operation. I suppose the answer may be to plan a smaller layout but include some switches with "track to nowhere" that could later be continued to additonal layout projects if & when time/money/etc permits. Is this a sound approach? I am also less interested (at this point) in serious prototypical operations than in just running some trains through interesting scenery with a few stops here and there. I know that may cause a few of you to shudder in disgust...I just want to be running trains in this lifetime and not simply looking at an idle collection. Any thoughts will be appreciated! Rob
Terry, with just a cursory look, I like what you have done. Not withstanding what others are saying to you, it looks like it would be fun to operate from my interests' sake.
What I would urge you to do, with a short 22" radius arc of 20+ inches of flextrack and two more turnouts, is to create a wye at either of the entrances (that cross each other) to the central loop. As it is, I don't see a way for you to change trains so that two can pass in opposite directions, or if you simply want to give your vestibular system a break after so many circuits clockwise or counterclockwise.
OK. Thanks.
Let's see.
The switcher would pull one body track with cars to build a train back into the drill track.
Then shoves the cut down through the crossover and towards the lower left. You can see a lighter track connecting with the main in the trees there. The switcher might return for the rest of the cars on a second body track. But the result should be a 14 foot or so train ready for the road power to come out of the engine facitlity to hook on on the front which would be towards the right side. Then it will proceed onto the main counter clockwise.
For trains departing clockwise the engines will move to the lower left corner and the switcher will tack the cars onto them.
Assuming modern day ops, there is no caboose involved.
That is how I would operate Lorien Yard.
Safety Valve wrote:I identified and approved of your Lorein Yard Drill track. Nicely isolated from the main. It also appears long enough to grab a whole track and pull it. Useful when quickly getting a train to the departure or yarding an arrival.
I identified and approved of your Lorein Yard Drill track. Nicely isolated from the main. It also appears long enough to grab a whole track and pull it. Useful when quickly getting a train to the departure or yarding an arrival.
I can't see how a train gets into and out of Lorien Yard. Can you fill me in?
Conemaugh Road & Traction circa 1956
The one thing I mentioned and no one took up is about increasing your staging. IT should not be a big deal to drop your staging a little and extend it under the Soy factory.
The one thing people mention consistently when asked about what they'd do differently is they would add more staging. Compared to your yard tracks, your staging is pretty small. It makes for a large operational imbalance.
Chip
Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.
snaggle tooth - Good pt on the swift plant. CUrrently I planon 6 loads of soybeans in per day and four bean meal loads andthree bean oil loads out. I also have a four car wash out rackfor some additional switching. Not sure if that is proportionalor not but it looks good on paper. Also with the dedicatedswitcher I will have sand/diesel fuel brought in as well as burlapbags, Hexane gas, coal for the boiler house. I did take one trackout of the yard and it seems to be sufficient. I ran projectedlenght trains to all of the industries including the interchange andthe yard based on my industry analysis using the Train func in Xtrakcadand it appeared to work. Of course all that will go to crap wheni start laying track I am sure.
Space Mouse - I took youradvice and eliminated the connection that bypasses thepenninsula. I played with the elevations until I was able to geta 3.75 in clearance at the crossing. The ruling grade will be 1.9% inand out of the penninsula but only for a short distance. I alsoput some hills and valleys on the rest of the layout with the rulinggrade at 1.6%. Nothing my PCM 2-8-8-2 cant handle. Sothanks for the idea of the overpass. I think it will look reallycool.
And thanks to everyone else who has contributed their timeand ideas. Still have a couple of weeks before starting thebenchwork so if anyone has any more ideas or comments I would reallylike to hear from you. My wife and I are finally putting downroots so this hopefully will be the "Big One" I've been planning on formany years so I want to get it right.
Terry
I think it is ok. I would start bench work and begin laying track and then you will probably want to change something. I planned mine and made about 25 changes by the time the track was laid.
Craig
Here's my 2 cents. Scutaterry, I don't think your yard is to big. If you consider the Swift plant probebly be recieving cars faster than they can take them (most real plants are like that) they take the oldest first to avoid rotting and demurage charges. And say Pennsy has higher demurages, they'll always take those faster than your home road. You'll need a storage track. Then there's outbound loads of meal (if your taking it that far), awaiting emties would be gathered and stored until needed. Another track dedicated to Swift. A track for Evansville "branch", and another for the far northern town next to Swift, and a track for Pennsy interchange. Now you've tied up four of seven tracks. You have proper sized yard, IMHO.
But I do think that the peninsula should be a stub end branch. You have a siding for run-around and all (well, ok one isn't) face the same direction. I'd run the track straight of from the yard lead. pull into the southern town and switch there. garab your cars and go to Evansville. from there you can caboose back, or build another small siding, just enough for 2-3 cars, and run back around to pick up the rest. Then back to the yard.
Just a though.
Good luck with it, it is a really nice design with quite a few different possibilty of running it.
GD brings up a coupl good points. The edge of the track is close to the edge.
Your yard is huge compared to the visable flow of traffic. One thing I can see that you can do is to lower your staging and run it underneath The Soy Bean plant. You might have to exit from the main further towards the bottom of the plan. Anyway, increases size of the train in staging would help top justify the size of the yard.
I don't get the crossing at the base of the pennisula. I can't picture a reason for the prototype to do it that way.
Now if it was me, and I'm not you so take it for what is worth. I would want a longer main. That said, I would force the train around the pennisula and not allow it to bypass it. I would also make one side or other go underneath and have two levels, so that the track doesn't actually meet itself.
Why is the Lorein yard so large? Where are all those trains it can make and break up going to go to/from? I am glad another yard was scrapped in favor of a soy-bean industry. One thing this doesn't need is more yard.
The loop track on the center island looks really close to the edge.
Well I think I am about ready to start up the benchwork. Iwanted to post my layout plan one more time for feedback. Somemay remember this plan from several months ago. I removed theupper yard in the alcove and replaced it with the Swift Soybean plantfeatured in the latest MRR special issue. It fit perfectly andhas the potential to almost double the industry capability of thelayout. I have three sound switchers. Two BLI SW-7's NYCand one LL SW-8 NKP. Do to the amount of switching at the Swift plant Iam going to permanently lease the NKP SW-8 to the plant and put theother two at Lorien yard. I also added the hidden staging for thePRR Interchange. Check it out and let me know what youthink. I am a solo operator and plan on using carcards andwaybills. A process I have already begun paperwork wise.
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a72/scubaterry/FinalPlan.jpg