Local Hobby Shops Price Themselves Out of Business!

[Anonymous]

Two of my local area hobby shops offer good discounts to their regular customers. I am upgraging some turnouts on my layout and got the discounts on the new stuff without even requesting it.

[grayfox1119]

The Hobby store business is a low margin business, profits are small, they are not selli ng big ticket items for the most part. Mom and Pop stores are going out oif business to stores like Lowe's, HD, WalMart, etc. because these larger stores do huge volumes of purchasing and have massive warehouses in strategic locations. How can small LHS survive without volume purchasing power?
They can offer sales, and run specials, but that cuts margins even more. Take a small town location.....how many MRR people will this store have within a reasonable driving range? And will these people be running in every week buying track, tools, cars, scenery, big locos? Of course not.
As stated above, only the stores that are well located within large metropolitan areas, that can draw on a huge population, can survive. These same stores will need to do enet sales as well. It is imperative for them to be able to buy wholesale in LARGE volumes, so that they can procure the best prices possible from the manufacturers, and then inturn, offer the consumer prices that can compete with the enet stores.

Huge wholesale purchases + large customer base = Best prices to the consumer

[Anonymous]

enduringexp, I agree with your statements about running a business. I must say that I provide my hobby shop with "work" to keep him happy thru the year. I know that you can use ebay or mail order to get a better price. But understanding just how slim the LHS's profits are I usually check with them first about an item.

Kind of like shippers and recievers. If you haul a load for em with class and treat them well... they may want to call you and your company again for the next load out. There are a bunch of people willing to spend a little bit or alot in the hobby and it is up to the LHS to keep an ear on the rail by listening to the customers and perhaps building up over time a "core" of customers who are building layouts and constantly in need of this and that.

But given a choice of a good price on a budget I will take the item for the lowest I can.

[Anonymous]

As I have stated before, the shops in my area are extremely overpriced, understocked, and 1 is filthy. I have gone out with the intention of making a purchase, knowing I would pay more than on the net, only to find the above conditions. I am in a large metropolitan area, a suburb of Detroit. I can understand the small town shops having a hard time, but I wouldn't think this area would be a problem. You can go into the shops near me and see the same item that was on the shelf in 2003. Now, I wait until I have a large order, and place it at once. Most internet dealers offer 1 price shipping, and believe me, I take advantage of that. I will order $100 or more of clearance items from Discounttrainsonline and pay $6.95 shipping. The shops near me just don't know what they are doing. They haven't done any research into what sells, what roads people around here want, etc. It's like they are planning on going out of business right from the start.

[davekelly]

During trips to Dallas (300 miles from here) I've stopped by Discount Trains in Addison. The place is always filled with customers. While the prices there are a bit higher than what I can find on the internet, most prices are less than list. The neat thing is the wealth of stuff there. Everything from top of the line engines down to a whole wall of detail parts - many of which I didn't even know existed. The staff there (even the teenaged part time help) are friendly and knowledgable. It was very obvious that the staff recognizes its regular customers by name, scale, interests etc. New folks are greated with a smile. Last time I went I was planning on buying a Kalmbach book I was looking for and ended up walking out with about $100 of stuff. Could I have gotten the stuff a little cheaper? Yup. Could I have spent about an hour having a blast walking up and down the well lit, clearn aisles looking at shelf after well stocked shelf? Nope.

These guys are a lesson on how to run a hobby shop.

[HAZMAT9]

I think a lot has to do with costumer service. I've always had bad luck finding a LHS with good costumer service until recently, but they went out of business. No pun intended to some but the LHS's I've dealt with were owned by grouchy old men which wouldn't lift a finger to help. As some others have said, the LHS owner looks down on you; it's as if you're in there to buy a few trains to run for a week or so and shelf never to return. Or, they have the attitude that if you don't like what you see, shop elsewhere. I'd be more than willing to pay the extra sales tax or a bit higher prices in order to have the experience, knowledge and courtesy of a LHS. Back in '84 while growing up in California we had a LHS just for trains and the store owner would yell, ridicule me and shake his head whenever I would purchase something outrageous to him (like a DD40X), he thought that a 20 year old was too young to be playing with serious toys and I needed more knowledge of the hobby. Well at 40 yrs old and back in the hobby with this being my third layout, I sometimes get a feeling of deja vu when venturing to the LHS. Only if I had the money to open an LHS, all of you would have decent prices and good ole' fashioned courteous service. Steve

[grayfox1119]

enduring exp, I guess you just have a guy who doesn 't know how to run a business. He certainly is in a large enough area to draw plenty of customers. That is really a shame.

[Anonymous]

how much is a up dd40x in ho

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by rayben

how much is a up dd40x in ho

[jddav1]

The problem with my nearest LHS is everthing is list(msrp) price. I would give them more business if the prices were lower.

[Don Z]

I guess I'll consider myself lucky in regards to the LHS. On my 2nd trip into his store, he called me by name, surprising me. He always takes however much time is needed to answer any questions I have concerning DCC, tracklaying, anything at all. He'll stand there and explain it to me until he knows I understand his answer.

Knowing I was wanting to build a layout, he offered to take my sketches and put them into a CAD program to scale it out to make sure my ideas would work. The cost?? ZERO DOLLARS! When I offered to pay him for his time in doing the Cad drawing, his reply was "If I invest the time to create the drawing for you, I'm willing to bet I'll have your business when it comes time to buy track and supplies for your layout".

He also gives me a substantial discount on everything I buy from him, and if I can't afford to take something home, I now have an account with my own shelf in the stockroom. The cost for this? ZERO. I don't even need to make monthly payments for my lay-away items.....he knows I'll pay on the lay-away when I can...which is every other week when I get paid...lol.

I guess he understands that if you treat customers as they wi***o be treated, they'll be back when they want to purchase something new.

Don Z.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: During trips to Dallas (300 miles from here) I've stopped by Discount Trains in Addison. The place is always filled with customers. While the prices there are a bit higher than what I can find on the internet, most prices are less than list. The neat thing is the wealth of stuff there. Everything from top of the line engines down to a whole wall of detail parts -

They are about 45 minutes from my house (I live right outside downtown Dallas) They are a great store and are a shining example of what a Model Train store has to be to survive. I've been to a couple other shops here in town that have everything at list price. With all the internet options I simply can not afford list price.

But Discount Model Trains with their great layout and helpful staff will get more of my money even if they are a little over internet prices (not much over though [:D] )

[Anonymous]

"Some people know the price of everything and the value of nothing".

[chateauricher]

What is the point of dragging up a topic thread that is over a year old ??? Particularly when there are other threads dealing with this very same topic. Ad nauseum, I might add.

[Tom Bryant_MR]

I have an ulterior motive for supporting my LHS. When I retire from the real job in a few years, I'm going to work part time in that LHS [}:)]. Maybe even trade my time for stuff. So, I need him to be there.

It's a two way street. All the comments made so far are true. One has to decide with whatever factors drive them to decisions on purchasing. Mine is simply, is it worth it to me. When you think about it, it's a complicated process; time, gas, can I/should I wait, how available is the object of one's desire etc. etc. etc.

I recently wanted a MKT AB set. The LHS had an MKT ABA set. I looked on the internet at several shops and got a price range. I then approached the LHS owner and told him that while I could get the unit cheaper I wanted to know what price he would offer for just the AB portion of his set.

I walked out with the AB unit feeling that we both had made a deal. And, I didn't get the lowest possible price but I got what I felt was very fair. And, he knows I'll be back for the other A unit one day. I will, simply because of the service.

So, again, you have to decide what it's worth to you.

[SirPeter]

I'm just entering my second year into modelling North American Railroads and I agree with Matt. Here in the UK the shops seem to pile the prices up whenever they feel like it. I have found it cheaper buying from the States and getting the gear shipped over. The customer support is great too. Support I have received from you guys in the Forum is something I have not met over this side of the pond. Thanks to all participants.

Peter

[Anonymous]

I just was at my "Local" hobby shop (closest one 60 miles away) Carr's Hobby in Duluth MN and well that place was stacked with a huge selection of MRR Items from Z on up and well I was only going to look but he had some Clearance Items that I had to pick up a lifelike BN GP38 locomotive #2098 for 23.77 was 51.00 and I picked up 7 life like Freight cars for 2.87 each
His Prices where reasonable on almost everything in the Store some where great deals and some where not so great but it was not outragously priced like I was expecting.

[Anonymous]

I'd say if they give you decent service and carry a good line of products it's worth the extra couple bucks. Plus you can't beat actually having the item in your hand compared to waiting 2 or 3 weeks. I mostly use the internet to pick up stuff my local shop doesn't have.

[Anonymous]

My LHS has some items under-priced, and some over. About 5$ less than internet prices for EZ track, but he charges 160$ for an Athearn loco that you can get for 110$ on Athearn's site.

[Anonymous]

My LHS is pretty good when it comes to their prices and services. You can order stuff from.
The service is good, the guys know what they're talking about. Model railroading is just an exspensive hobby one reason is because of oil prices.

[R. T. POTEET]

I've never ordered anything over the internet; I have, however, ordered things through mail-order houses and therein lies my story.
When I was stationed in Germany with the Air Force in the early '70s I had no choice but to order merchandise mail-order. I responded to an ad in one of the hobby magazines. This particular flake had about a 40% discount on almost everything in his ad; he required a $25.00 minimum order with something like a $2.50 S&H fee. I don't remember exactly how much I ordered but the total bill was somewhere in the vicinity of $35.00. I added the required S&H and fired off a check which cleared American Express in about 10 days;
the package arrived in about six weeks. (For those of you who have never experienced this this is not unusual. When you are dealing with an APO/FPO address all - or at least most - parcels travel by surface mail). When I opened the package, however, I found that I had gotten less than half of the merchandise ordered and the invoice was annotated "Out of Stock" on those items which I didn't receive. In addition the invoice also informed me that there was no such thing as a back-order. There was a credit memo for $17.00 or so but there was also a notice that there were "No cash refunds."
By this time I had in my possession newer issues of the magazines (periodicals also travel by surface, by the way) and the current ad listed most of those "Out of Stock" items at the same "fantastic" savings. I drew up a fresh list totalling more than $25.00 and the S&H and fired it off in the mail. Check cleared - package arrived -"Out of Stock" - credit memo - new magazines - same-o - same-o" Another order. I think you know where this goes. After three times I filed the latest credit memo for $7.00 or so away and went to Terminal Hobby Shop who didn't have any "fantastic" bargains, charged only $1.00 S&H, magically almost completely filled any order I ever sent to them and who did give cash refunds.
It took me over four years before I finally saw the opportunity to get rid of that last credit memo and that was by paying $25.00 for a $24.99 advertised item.
This was all in pre-credit card days (at least for me - and maybe, with credit cards such abuses are unlikely) but it left me with a sour taste in my mouth and I sure as the dickens am not going to commit a check for good ol' "Out of Stock". I'll pay retail - at least my money is occupying a comfortable spot in my checkbook and not in somebody elses cash drawer - until the merchant requires payment. And this is also the reason I do not pay for special orders in advance.

[karle]

Most of these LHS guys need to think about a better business plan. Their stock usually stinks, and whathey do have is often overpriced... more than MSRP/Walthers catalog... give me a break! You want $4 for a pc of Atlas code 100 flex? OK, I need paint, I'm willing to pay full MSRP, maybe more, who wants to mail order a couple bottles of paint.. oh... you're out of most colors and haven't reordered in years. Hey, look over there, its the same Walters kits I see advertised in great detail, and priced at more than MSRP... forget it. Maybe if you had some of those kits that aren't advertised extensivly I'd be interested, might even pay more than MSRP since I can actually peak in the box... sorry nothing unique in this store. OK, lets buy a magazine... sorry, only stock MRR. How about a box car kit.. sorry, only a few pre-builts, $30/ each. OK you'll order for me from Walthers with no S&H, then when I do it, you never call to let me know it came in. Hey, I'm at a train show, and there you are Mr LHS... and your stuff is now discounted, or at least some of it is marked down... why not when I visit the shop? I have one LHS that does it right, and guess what ,when I go there I always walk out with something. The rest are more toy stores than hobby shops.

[Anonymous]

I live in Sayreville, NJ and have been going to The Model Railroad Shop. They are great there!

I had no idea BLW was in Manalapan, I seriously thought they were in Brooklyn thats like 10 minutes from me!!!

[ham99]

I wish I could find a LHS within 50 miles. There is one 185 miles away that has some basic items, but it's over 300 miles to the nearest fully stocked shop. I drive 56 miles [each way] to our club meetings. The prices PRRMan states are pretty much in line with what I find in our "LHS", but I also like to see what I buy. And shipping eats up the discount on online purchases, unless you order lots of things at the same time.

[M&PWJOHN]

Having been on both sides of the counter I have a rether unique prospective on this. Yes it seems like a problem, but is it really? Or is this a strech the dollar kind of thing. I have to remind myself from time to time how inportant it is to have a local hobbyshop. Remember this. If yoour shop can't make the profit from the sale, them how is he going to stock the little items that really count. Try going to a discounter for the "detail parts" They don't cary them. My worst experiences were those guys who just had to have the latest big item, loco etc. I would get it as soon as it was released. When they saw it, they picked it apart, then decided they would not buy it. Now I was stuck with a big dollar item. Now to add insult to injury, I would see this same guy at a local club. Yes he has that same item. He bought it from a discounter. He had to "see" it before he would order it. This really soured me on these types. When too many of this thing happened, I quit. Now all the modelers have to go further, or mail order, as I have had it. So remember, if you have a local hobby shop, support him as he can them have the "little items" on hand for that last minute project. I have seen too many shops become toy stores because of this problem. You have to make a profit to stay in business