I'm surprised at the number of track nail users who hammer the nails into place. I've found it easier and faster to simply push them in with pliers. On cork, only half the length of the nail goes into the plywood subroadbed, but even for track laid directly on plywood, the pliers work better for me.
Wayne
doctorwayne I'm surprised at the number of track nail users who hammer the nails into place. I've found it easier and faster to simply push them in with pliers. On cork, only half the length of the nail goes into the plywood subroadbed, but even for track laid directly on plywood, the pliers work better for me. Wayne
Mike
riogrande5761 rrinker In the old days - the track nails. Now, caulk. Faster and easier. If I can put an Atlas track nail in instantly to fasten cork down, how can caulk be faster than instant, which has to cure/dry? The old days are still here and nothing wrong with them. Caulk has been around a long time so why wasn't it used in the old days, whatever "old" means? I lay track on a center-line which I draw - and if I put the nail dead on the line, it seems more accurate than having to eyeball where the track is to go, especially if caulk is obscuring it - unless you use translucent caulk. I have never seen the advantage of adhesives to lay track and cork - you have to wait. I am impatient and I'd rather not wait. If I don't like something or need to pull up, I can pull the nails out with needle nose plyers and relay. Again, no waiting. If anyone objects to the nail head on the ties, no problem. After I have applied the ballast and secured it with a dilute glue or matt medium, I can pull them out. Some may complain, hey, I bend a few nails. *shrugs* not a big deal to me - I toss it and move on. Still faster - plain and simple. I can't see the advantage of adhesive; I mean, after it has cured, you site down the rail and see, oh, it dried crooked, funs over. With nails, often all I need to do is push the rail a little one way or the other and it will hold in that position. Again, ballast plus adhesive will hold it permanantly after I am completely satisfied.
rrinker In the old days - the track nails. Now, caulk. Faster and easier.
In the old days - the track nails. Now, caulk. Faster and easier.
If I can put an Atlas track nail in instantly to fasten cork down, how can caulk be faster than instant, which has to cure/dry?
The old days are still here and nothing wrong with them. Caulk has been around a long time so why wasn't it used in the old days, whatever "old" means?
I lay track on a center-line which I draw - and if I put the nail dead on the line, it seems more accurate than having to eyeball where the track is to go, especially if caulk is obscuring it - unless you use translucent caulk.
I have never seen the advantage of adhesives to lay track and cork - you have to wait. I am impatient and I'd rather not wait. If I don't like something or need to pull up, I can pull the nails out with needle nose plyers and relay. Again, no waiting.
If anyone objects to the nail head on the ties, no problem. After I have applied the ballast and secured it with a dilute glue or matt medium, I can pull them out.
Some may complain, hey, I bend a few nails. *shrugs* not a big deal to me - I toss it and move on. Still faster - plain and simple.
I can't see the advantage of adhesive; I mean, after it has cured, you site down the rail and see, oh, it dried crooked, funs over. With nails, often all I need to do is push the rail a little one way or the other and it will hold in that position. Again, ballast plus adhesive will hold it permanantly after I am completely satisfied.
Water Level Route doctorwayne I'm surprised at the number of track nail users who hammer the nails into place. I've found it easier and faster to simply push them in with pliers. On cork, only half the length of the nail goes into the plywood subroadbed, but even for track laid directly on plywood, the pliers work better for me. Wayne Differences in stregth of plywood? When I used OSB, I too simply pushed nails in with pliers. When I switched to plywood? Not a chance. The nails wouldn't go in, but bent every single time.
Differences in stregth of plywood? When I used OSB, I too simply pushed nails in with pliers. When I switched to plywood? Not a chance. The nails wouldn't go in, but bent every single time.
May also be a difference in the thickness of the outer ply along with the type of glue between plies. Also, if the outer ply is thin you might hit a knot in the next ply.
Paul
riogrande5761Are you enjoying yourself there?
I have the right to remain silent. By posting here I have given up that right and accept that anything I say can and will be used as evidence to critique me.
Depends on the area. Also depends on if it is handlaid or flex track.
Flex track is on foam base, with cork or WS foam roadbed, both roadbed and track are held in place with straight pins, like those used when sewing or quilting.
Handlaid segments are on foam base, but with a balsa sub-roadbed, then cork, then ties and rails. On these segments, the cork is glued to the balsa, using liquid nails, then the ties are glued down with wood glue, with rails spiked to the ties. The balsa sub raoadbed is however held in place with the same straight pins, pressed through the cork and balsa into the foam base.
Ricky W.
HO scale Proto-freelancer.
My Railroad rules:
1: It's my railroad, my rules.
2: It's for having fun and enjoyment.
3: Any objections, consult above rules.
For cork - staple gun - as long as you use the right staples (not too long) it is easy to pop the staples out if you need to move it or dismantle (before ballasting).
For track - nails in predrilled holes - in my opinion, they aren't very visible after weathering track and ballast.
With Homasote, I don't hammer the nails or spikes, I can push them in-place with a nail-set I have - that works really well. Sometimes a tap with a small hammer I have will help get them at just the right distance.
With the OSB I use, well, you may have seen some people object to using track nails because they bend a lot. Thats just how hard the stuff is a lot of the time. I also bend a few here and there but that doesn't put me off because I still prefer the control I have over how the track geometry is and I like that the track is secured the instant the nail is driven - no curing or wait time, the centerline is still totally visible so I have the accuracy I prefer. Anyway, no, pliers wouldn't work on the stuff I've bought - too hard. That should make sense I would hope.
Anyway, I know from plenty of experience what works for me and what doesn't. I realize there are folks who like their way and thats fine - the topic was started for the user to consider common methods used and choose for himself.
I do want to point out that just because a lot of people use caulk and pins doesn't mean it's necessarily the "best" way, or what is the latest or most modern thing is necessarily best. I feel that way about spline - it's been all the rage for the past 20 years or so, and sure, it looks exotic and cool but it also looks like a heck of a lot of extra work that really may not be necessary to get good geometry.
Also some have commented on using nails and cork saying it's "old fashioned" as if it's a bad thing. It's not. It's worth considering and trying and up to the hobbyist to decide if they like adhesives with pins or track nails and spikes.
BTW, one reason I still like model train cork is that it is split in the middle and I can lay it right on the center line I draw.
I've found the OSB is pretty hard stuff and the staple gun I use I often have to try several times and even then the staple is not really in consistantly that well, often all bent out of shape. It does seem to depend on what type of wood or material you use. I have tried my staple gun but it doesn't like the OSB very well. I don't feel like going out and buying another to see if it works better since track nails have always worked just fine.
The time I would spend pre-drilling holes isn't worth it to me, I just drive the nail and yes sometimes they bend but inevitably the next on goes in fine.
As far as leaving them in place - I haven't decided if I'm going to - I have painted the track with the nails in and you can definitely still see them so I'll probably pull them out after the ballest is secured with dilulte glue or matte medium.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
Try Foam Tack adhesive (Woodland Scenics) it sets up in a shorter time than white glue and is easy to spread,
I use adhesive caulk with foam roadbed. My club layout uses liquid nails with cork roadbed held in place with track nails.
Bear "It's all about having fun."
Yard and some industrial leads install - 1/8" underlayment sheet cork with yellow wood glue. Scrap plywood sheets to spread weight evenly. Weights (coffee cans filled with concrete) on top. Overnight dry.
Roadbed install - Midwest cork with yellow wood glue on plywood. Long pieces of scrap 2x4s on straights, many short 2x4s on curves, butted end-to-end to spread weight evenly. Weights on top. Overnight dry.
Roadbed and sheet cork finish - 180 grit belt sander to flatten. Special attention to switch fills. Taper grade changes to lower roadbeds and no roadbeds. Vacuum.
http://www.lkorailroad.com/cork-roadbed-part-iii/
Track install - Dynaflex 230 caulk brown. Scrap lumber to spread weight evenly. Lots of weights on top. Overnight dry.
Worth all the trouble? You bet. How is this for smooth trackwork?
Alan
Freelancing the LK&O Railroad