I am just starting out in Garden Railroading. I have just moved and will have an area of about 35 feet deep x 60 feet wide to work with. It seems much too steep as it is. There is a 5 foot elevation drop from the front to the back of area. Its pretty level side to side. I am going to put in a retaining wall to get it more level.
I have read that a completely flat area is not as interesting to work with as one with some slope. I am not into mountain railroading, but just more of a general type of railroading. So my question is can anyone offer advice about the slope. Would a 2 foot drop from front to back be about right, or is that too steep?
Thanks for any help you can give me.
-Jim
General railroading is going to have minimal grades, 1 - 2%. Thats a 2 inch rise in 100 inches of track (or about 8 feet of track) for 2%. A two foot drop or rise will therefore need to have to do that in 100 feet of track. That will be tough to do if your track area is 30' x 50' but possible if you use a long winding S curve up the hill. If you go up to a 3% grade (running shorter trains) you only need about 65 feet of track to do it. You could also consider using a raised track on the lower end to lessen the grade.
-Brian
Main line ruling grade GENERALLY about 2%.
Narrow gauge GENERALLY about 4%.
A 40" drop in 35 feet is 10%. At 2', you're over 4%.
But, that's not allowing for curves (or a model of Tehachapi).
I have 150' of 4%, no problems here.
I had the same problem, though not as severe. My solution was to use extensive trestleworks scratchbuilit from cedar fence pickets and redwood bender board.
You can see my solution at http://members.cox.net/cacole2
Click on the "Other Layouts in the Sierra Vista Area" link and then my Rock Line G-scale layout.
Thanks for all the feedback. I'm kind of thinking now that I'll be better off grading up to having more like a foot drop from back to front rather than two.
Jim
I built my layout on a similarly "topographically challenged" piece of property. I have a 34" drop from the highest point to the lowest point of the layout but have about 140' of frontage so I was able to keep the grades to below 3%. The 34" drop was achieved only after building a 3' + retaining wall.
Lessons learned the hard way;
Have a viable track plan before building the retaining wall. Kind of hard to modify one of those puppies after they have been in a while.
Your curves will be the biggest problem. Engines don't like grades and don't like tight curves. The combination can be a killer. I was able to keep mine to minimum diameter of 11' and a gradient of less than 1% on the curves. I also spent over 3 months on just the layout design using track planning software. Planning becomes an imperative.
Access to the layout will be crucial and was my biggest challenge. It takes a lot of dirt to fill a retaining wall. I have lost track of the number of dump trucks that have visited my place and always keep a pile of dirt on hand. Even a small addition to the layout requires a couple of wheelbarrows of dirt.
Dirt settles. The dirt behind a three foot retaining wall will settle at least 6" in the first couple of months even if it is well packed when installed. Don't get in a big hurry to lay track. I use a supported roadbed system so I can backfill as needed without relaying the track. The system I use is the Mainline Enterprise system now sold by Split Jaw but the ladder roadbed described in this forum and others will also work well and would be a lot cheaper.
As mentioned in an earlier post, poor drainage on a slope can wipe out a layout in a heavy rain. We had just built the retaining wall when we were hit by a gully washer before the dirt had settled in and lost about 4' of the wall and a dump truck worth of dirt. I now have bigger rivers on the layout and lots of bridges. But then, I like to build bridges.
Don't plan on a lot of sidings. Most of your mainline track will be devoted to making grade so you will be limited on places to put flat things like sidings where cars can be parked without rolling down to the front of layout.
Be patient. All of the foundation work takes a long time and it will be a long time before you will have someplace to run to run trains. We built a small layout initially to have a place to run trains and test ideas. Once we decided we liked the hobby we were able to commit to the time and effort to building the big layout. The small layout kept my sanity during all of the time it took to get the dirt moved and the roadbed in to finish the first loop on the big layout. I figure I have enough opportunities left to last many more years.
That was the bad news. The good news is that having the retaining wall and the slope make for a really enjoyable layout. The front of the layout is just over waist high and really let the visitors see the trains up close and personnal. The slope gives a great view of the layout.
The "rivers" and the topology makes for a really interesting scenic opportunities. Building up gives you a lot of control on what your world will look like.
Capt. Bob
I sent an e-mail to this guy through the forum and offered some pictures of my slope of ground level to almost two feet high , he never answered . Ben
I just read Ben's email and have responded. Pictures greatly appreciated!!
And thanks again to all for the responses I have received on this.
BennysRR wrote:Capt. Bob I sent an e-mail to this guy through the forum and offered some pictures of my slope of ground level to almost two feet high , he never answered . Ben
It's likely that someone new to the forum may not be familiar with the message system.
Keep in mind that using helper service can be a lot of fun and very prototypical. Ideally the grades should be less than 4%, but if planned correctly, oh what fun is possible.
So if you have room, this could turn out to be very rewarding operationally.
M. Gilger - President and Chief Engineer MM&G web
Web Site: http://mmg-garden-rr.webs.com/
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