DCC vs Train Engineer

[Anonymous]

Does anyone have experience with the Basic Train Engineer from Aristo-craft? Can it be used with a battery power supply? Can the receivers be purchase individually from the controller? I’ve seen the cost online for just under $60, and all I need is a simple speed control for one Loco at a time.

Carl

[Anonymous]

Oh, I need to clarify my last statement:
I said the radio-receivers had some horror stories, well I meant the ON-BOARD first and second batch of Rx's.

The ON-BOARD system I really know very little about. I was very interested in it when it came out but people that owned the receivers said they did not work right (this was back in the late 90's). Hopefully Aristo has rectified the problems. I'm certain that Aristo as a company would service anything that didn't work right.

Regards,

Tom M.

[Anonymous]

OH! Here is my beef on the Aristo TE:

I purchased the original TE in 1994. It was a 5 amp unit that hooked to your DC power supply. the radio link would send from the Tx to the Rx that was hooked up to the power supply and regulate the voltage going to the tracks. It worked superbly, although I could only operate two separate blocks of tracks (you needed an additional Rx to operate the 2nd).

That Aristo TE was ingenious back then, because radio control for large scale was NOT CHEAP and I only paid $119 for that setup! Again, it was just another way to control the power to the track via dc current.

One thing I didn't like was the "buttons" as much as I like a "knob" control. But most people don't seem to mind button control. The Aristo TE's are built quite well, they can take a beating. I dropped mine many times, a couple times on rocks. However one day it broke and I sent it back to aristo and they fixed it for free. Great service!

I highly recommend the TE standalones. I have heard some horror stories over the radio-receivers, I must caution you about those though.

Cheers,

Tom M.

[Anonymous]

Take a look at the CVP DCC radio receiver system...via a Adobe PDF file.

http://www.cvpusa.com/doc_center/r5+March2004+airwire.pdf

Very nice, but unfortunate that we already shipped 3 locos off to LGB for decoder install! Oh well. Something to at least look forward to down the road. I like the fact that it is NMRA compliant, it is the first non-proprietary radio receiver for large scale! Way to go CVP!

Of course there are other solutions, like Lenz having decoders that can run over paper. I bet decoder technology in general from most of the major firms will become much more reliable, even for outdoors. Surely LGB will make an investment in more reliable large scale digital (they are starting to catch up now, which I believe will continue on until they have a system worthy of the price).

As for dirty tracks, I have no qualms about buying a LGB track cleaning engine. Those beasts are just too cool. While I am saving for it I can clean the tracks with a LGB block.

Tom M.

[Anonymous]

The above advice is great, I would like to add my .02 to the bucket:

Your first question about control systems should
coincide with what your railway is to accomplish for *YOU*.

For example, indoors I have a large scale layout that I want completely digital with animation,lights,and highly detailed scenes.

But I am currently designing an outdoor layout
and all the bells and whistles may not be necessary for me outdoors. Do I need lots of animation and lighting because I probably won't be operating it at night much. Its really tough to say that "DCC is a must for outdoors" when you take in the extra measures needed for reliable current, power supply protection, risks of damage by lightning or other natural hazards.

Outdoors even simple block-controlled (automated) circuits could take the place of something more sophisticated (digital). It all depends on what I am going to spend my time on most: switching the locos and cars around, having the trains just run in circles, having helpers up grades (in which I would need a consist controller), or changing engines at a remote station.

You've kinda got to figure out all this first, then research the control systems available that will match your operations. I know very well that battery power/radio control is a very reliable way to run the pike. However, I'm not too thrilled about the radio receivers being incompatible with my indoor DCC setup, changing and recharging batteries,etc.. So far I still have the idea of DCC outdoors, but like the other guy said, one size (control system) does not fit all garden railways, even if your indoor layout suits you fine.

I will be looking into that DCC system by CVP that has battery controlled receivers...that would be the ticket!!

[RhB_HJ]

QUOTE: Originally posted by grandpopswalt

There seems to be some confusion and disagreement regarding how Train Engineer works. Is the signal sent to the loco through the rails or through the air (radio).

Grandpopswalt

pops,

It can be either.
TE can work with an onboard radio receiver (needs to be carefully installed to get good results) with battery running power. Or the above can be done but using a constant voltage track power.

Or the TE is used like any other conventional throttle i.e. it controls the throttle which then sends a PMW voltage to the track.

DCC applies a bi-polar DC signal to the track, command stations intended for LS usage have adjustable voltage output, some in steps, others infinitely variable with a trim-pot.

The advantage of DCC is: you have choice, there are many different mfgs for the components which allows you to mix and match to get the best system possible for your particular requirement.

With anything that uses a proprietary mode like the TE or other makes, you are tied to whatever the mfg produces.

BTW there are some good R/C set-ups for DCC as well.

[grandpopswalt]

There seems to be some confusion and disagreement regarding how Train Engineer works. Is the signal sent to the loco through the rails or through the air (radio).

Grandpopswalt

[Anonymous]

75mhz onboard Tain Engineer Works
I USE IT WITH ARISTO AND USA TRAINS

[Anonymous]

I've spent a great deal of time researching this subject as I sell both types. Basically speaking, what is right for one person may not be the best choice for you. So the answer to your question is: What suites your conditions and asperations of and for your RR is the best choice. One size does not fit all. Contact a dealer and explain what you expect your RR to do, weather and soil conditions, pets and pest, budget, and on and on. There is no best choice for everyone. You should probly fill in your profil a bit more, let folks know a little more about yourself. Details help answering your question.

[vsmith]

I have a Basic Train Engineer (BTE) set up and I think its great! It allows me to follow the train around and operate the train while being right next to it. I only run one train at a time and have blocks to isolate different trains so only one operates at any time. For that the BTE works great. I never had DCC so I cannot say if there is any advantage over it.

[Anonymous]

I made the same error that CACOLE did when I first read the literature on the train engineer. I thought you needed the track controller to use the system but that is not true. If you put a battery and a Train Engineer reciever in the engine and are very careful to electrically isolate the wheels from the motor you can run the train from your hand held transmitter over any track even if the track has current running in it. I use both the Train Engineer and LOCO Link control systems. I like both of them. The Train Engineer is a little easier to install in a NEW Aristocraft train. the new trains are setup so that all you have to do is plug in the reciever and through a switch to battery control. I have installed the batteries in a trailing car (Coal car, Box car or flat car) This allow me to switch in a new battery out in the yard when the power fails 100 feet away from the charger.

[Anonymous]

Has anyone come up with a typical wiring diagram or schematic for battery power and radio control? Lots of people use it but it must be able to be "installed" rther easily.

[BudSteinhoff]

The TE is not DCC.
The track receiver controls power to the track thru the hand held transmitter and is normally used to run 1 train per track. The loco needs no modification.
The other option is on-board receivers which are installed in each loco and controlled by a hand held remote.
They are both transmitted and received thru the air not the track.
I run 16 loco's all with on-board receivers and controlled by a remote handheld transmitter .
I have run up to 10 trains at one time on the same track.
Each is controlled individually.
Gets a little hairy with that many at one time.
DCC has its advantages but I enjoy my remote controlled set up.
Bud

[cacole]

I have no experience with the AristoCraft Train Engineer, but from reading about it in their catalog, the biggest difference seems to be that the TE sends its command signals through the track, so track power is a must. With DCC, you can use on-board battery power and never have to worry about dirty track. Aristo claims that dirty track can never interfere with the TE's command signals, but that's only half the story -- dirty track can cause a locomotive to run erratically or stall completely, regardless of the TE. TE seems to be a form of DCC, albeit not compatible with other DCC systems. TE can support up to 10 engines. If you use TE and someone visits your layout and brings their own engine that is not TE receiver equipped, it won't operate on your layout. The same holds true for DCC -- if you are using DCC and someone visits who doesn't have a decoder-equipped locomotive, they can't run it on your layout -- especially if you are running radio control and battery power. On the other hand, if you are running radio control and battery power, their locomotive(s) will run on your layout if you also have a power pack connected to the track that they can use. So now that we're all thoroughly confused, I'm going to use the AirWire 900 being developed by CVP products, which is a wireless DCC system that uses battery power in the locomotives. Using this, I will be able to take my train anywhere and run it, regardless of what the other people use, even on plastic or wood rail, or just on a bare floor with no track at all.

[Anonymous]

Is there any advantage to DCC over Aristocraft Train Engineer?