The OOOOOOOOOOOOPS department

[Anonymous]

Oh the dreams!!!![:D] All I can say is "Eat your heart out, fellows"!!![:-,]
Eighteen days of 7 1/2" and 2' gauge. The WT&B, Largo, Manatee, Ridge, Atlantic and Tradewinds, so many this next month I can't remember them all![swg][swg][swg]

There's that old saying, if I can remember it right.

Those dreams at night in the dusty recess's of the mind, are just dreams.
But he who would dream in the daylight, with open eyes, is a dangerous man,
for he may act on those dreams to make them reality.

Get them eyes open, and start acting on those dreams![swg][swg]

[vsmith]

I certainly agree with Bob.

If I had room for a 7 1/2" gauge 4-8-4, tender, and a string of cars and all the track radius required for that, I wouldnt even bother with that ride on stuff --- cause that would mean I certainly had enough room for a FULL SIZE 18" or even 24" gauge 0-4-0 feild lokie and FULL SIZE cars!

If I had that kind of land I would build a replica of one of my favorite Coronado RR 20" baby gauge Porters or a 24" gauge 8 ton Porter and a Full Size 20" or 24" gauge Class A Climax, a replica SR&RL passenger car and long caboose to boot!

[tangerine-jack]

Your a sick man, Bob. Sick.

I just bought an LGB caboose off of Evilbay for $6.00. Yes, $6.00. The smoke stack was broken so nobody bid on it but me. I don't know if that is indicative of any trends or not, I just thought it was odd. BTW, that was the first piece of LGB I ever bought! The quality is about par with everything else on the market, and the construction is reasonably strong, but I can't see where it would cost twice as much as USAT new. It certainly doesn't strike me as the Holy Grail of garden trains.

On another note, I would buy LGB and find some way to justify the cost, IF they made something I wanted to buy. I really don't care for running the European locos (even though I like the way they look) and the US style equipment still has that unmistakable Euro flair and is priced out of my means.

Oh well, the future is on the way and who knows what it will bring!

[Capt Bob Johnson]

I was looking more in the 2 foot guage, like the amusement park stuff!

Hey, get my fat tail on that dinky 7 1/2" stuff and I'd need a skateboard under each cheek! (Bet that brings a wierd picture to mind!)

[Anonymous]

The Florida Winter Meets are about all month in Feb. I'm looking forward to running at Ridge in Dundee. They are out in the middle of nowhere, so it's very dark at night. They have a full operating signal system, tunnels, grades, the whole bit. I love hitting the top of the hill and seeing the lights of the signaling system all over the track, and trains moving around the track. It's a trip. 18 days of riding trains!!!!! Oh boy!!!!

[Curmudgeon]

The barstock track has far better adhesion then the other forms I've used and seen.
We used to have two 5-acre outfits within a town or three from me.
All gone now.
Nothing like bombing along on a Mike at 0001 hours with a string behind you, operating signal system, pitch dark.......

[Anonymous]

Marty, and Capt Bob,
The 7 1/2" gauge is not necessarily that expensive. I have less in my loco, riding car, and caboose than alot of people have paid for one G scale loco. Total is $2400. The expensive part, as in G scale, tends to be the track, although even that can be done faily reasonably. Alot of people use what is called Groovy Track, which is steel flat bar notched into 2x2's. It comes out to not much more than brass G scale track. If you have metal working skills, you can build switches cheaper than G scale, too.

[RhB_HJ]

QUOTE: Originally posted by vsmith
Hi Dave

Saw something this last weekend at a GATS here that really goes to illustrate what you said . Guy had an original, still in box 1968 LGB starter set, guy also had an old handwriiten tag on it for sale price of $900. It was crossed out with another price of $600 below it, the $600 price was also crossed out and a "bargain sale" price of $200 was what he was asking for it. Yep! the bottom has fallen out of alot of that market.....still can't afford most of it.[;)]

Vic,

Those are the opportunities I'm looking for, but only on very specific items which fit my railway and era.
I have never collected and I doubt I will start at my age!

I always have a chuckle when I see people bidding on eBay to at "the new price from the dealer" or even higher. They really need to do more reading and a bit of comparison shopping!

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Curmudgeon



I think one of the things that has taken away from the "aura" of the myth was the China move.
When you paid $120 for a German (was it a 3180..) yellow D&RGW passenger car, even at TrainWorld, and now Chinese ones are less than $72.....I've talked to outfits who specialize in LGB, and older LGB....they don't buy collections anymore, as they can't get rid of what they've got, even new in the box....the bottom fell out of the colector lgb market several years ago, it seems.I have a whole bunch of brand new in the box cars and an engine or two.
Not a bite.
Original 2018D, 20+ years old, in the box, original German yellow D&RGW passenger cars, a whole bunch of beer reefers, not a bite.

I put 30 cars out for sale on New Years at the operating session.
Out of 15 LGB, one sold (a pair of flats), but a whole bunch of the USA cars went.

Not complaining, as I ain't into collecting, but I watch what's happening and really wonder.

Yes, the stuff runs good.
Yes, it HAD an "aura" about it.
Yes, some is now made in China.
Yes, the price has dropped.

But, the competition is really making inroads.
Oh, well.

Hi Dave

Saw something this last weekend at a GATS here that really goes to illustrate what you said . Guy had an original, still in box 1968 LGB starter set, guy also had an old handwriiten tag on it for sale price of $900. It was crossed out with another price of $600 below it, the $600 price was also crossed out and a "bargain sale" price of $200 was what he was asking for it. Yep! the bottom has fallen out of alot of that market.....still can't afford most of it.[;)]

[bman36]

HJ,
I think the reason railroadingman asks if you are for real is because he thinks we are all actually dead. [;)] He did say this forum is dead. Maybe he is interested in the afterlife? Why else post or comment for that matter? Interesting topic BTW. We should build a layout in a house of mirrors. Then no matter how you look at it, it would be to scale. All of it. 5, 10, 15, 20 or even 30 foot rules would apply! [:o)] OK..enough. I'm tired...it was a long ride this time in the Mc Rig. Later eh...Brian. [|)]

[RhB_HJ]

Hi Walt,

QUOTE: Originally posted by grandpopswalt

It seems pretty simple, if you are a #8220;scale#8221; modeler, meaning that you are concerned with the correct ratio of the model to the prototype#8230;#8230;.. then stay away from LGB.

Not really, there are some items that are pretty close, there are some measurements that rate "Excellent". But the "fun" starts when one would like to find out what scale it is in order to determine if it will fit with other makes. Few of us are rich enough to buy in order to find out if it goes with the rest.
AND that is the big difference, Aristo tells us their standard gauge stuff is 1:29. It's right there in the catalogue, Bachmann tells us if it is 1:20.3 or 1:24, USAT tells us that it is 1:29.

Not withstanding Jack Lynch's (Marketing Manager LGBoA) comment

QUOTE: Bucksco
Posted: 07 Jan 2006, 22:16:17
HJ,
Remember- It's going to be "G" gauge- not "G" scale!

here is what LGB has to say on the subject

QUOTE:

In 1968, Wolfgang and Eberhard Richter created something unique: LGB, the world's first model railroad for indoors and outdoors. Today, LGB still stands alone, far above conventional toy trains:

LGB is big. The letters "LGB" stand for "Lehmann Gross Bahn" or "Lehmann's Big Train." LGB trains are G-scale (generally 1:22.5) - four times larger than conventional HO-scale trains (1:87).
LGB trains are easy to put on the track, even for kids. Details on LGB trains are big enough to see and strong enough to withstand frequent handling. But you can fit a full circle of LGB track in space less than 1.3 meters (51 inches) wide.

Yes, sure! Generally 1:22.5 scale.....hmmmmmmmm and what scale is the rest??

QUOTE: I think what#8217;s happening is that the hobby is maturing and more people are becoming #8220;serious#8221; about it. That inevitably means a more critical look at scale fidelity. There are now enough suppliers of true-to-scale equipment, both NG and standard, that the rivit-counters (no disrespect meant) no longer have to settle for what is being offered by our German cousins.

But it makes no sense to abuse LGB for continuing to do business as usual. They#8217;ve been very, very successful and have a huge loyal following. It would be foolish for them to start changing strategy at this time.

Well, "abuse" it isn't. It is simply a matter of pointing out that what they say they deliver and what they deliver are not the same. And with the scale confusion that is being created no one is served, least of all the consumer, who never knows if it will or won't "fit".
While I'm on the "Soapbox" it has always puzzled me why reviews of any model railroad items wouldn't mention if the applicable scale is clearly marked on the packaging. Of course that lack of information is especially annoying in Large Scale!

QUOTE: As we all know, Large Scale railroading is a mess. Two scales (1:29 and 1:32) representing standard gauge and three scales (1:24, 1:22.5, and 1:20.3) representing Narrow Gauge. And almost all the manufacturers in any of those scales are taking great liberties with scale fidelity as well. So to suggest that LGB is the only culprit in the scale infidelity game just isn#8217;t fair. BTW, I don#8217;t own a single piece of LGB equipment primarily because I think it#8217;s a little overpriced and because I am somewhat sensitive to correct scale proportions.

Walt

Correct! And it won't improve unless the customers let the manufacturers and dealers know what their opinion is on the various issues.
I recommended to one dealer here in the Great White North to display an AMS stock car and the LGB equivalent side by side. As an illustration how much toolmaking methods and production methods have improved.

BTW I have quite an array of very carefully selected RhB items from LGB, along with some more of their "stuff" which gets kitbashed. But I buy exactly what will fit my railroad for the era I model and the bulk of it used on eBay or used from dealers.


PS Before "railroadingman" asks; yes, I'm real! [}:)][;)][:D][:D]

[grandpopswalt]

It seems pretty simple, if you are a “scale” modeler, meaning that you are concerned with the correct ratio of the model to the prototype…….. then stay away from LGB.

I think what’s happening is that the hobby is maturing and more people are becoming “serious” about it. That inevitably means a more critical look at scale fidelity. There are now enough suppliers of true-to-scale equipment, both NG and standard, that the rivit-counters (no disrespect meant) no longer have to settle for what is being offered by our German cousins.

But it makes no sense to abuse LGB for continuing to do business as usual. They’ve been very, very successful and have a huge loyal following. It would be foolish for them to start changing strategy at this time.

As we all know, Large Scale railroading is a mess. Two scales (1:29 and 1:32) representing standard gauge and three scales (1:24, 1:22.5, and 1:20.3) representing Narrow Gauge. And almost all the manufacturers in any of those scales are taking great liberties with scale fidelity as well. So to suggest that LGB is the only culprit in the scale infidelity game just isn’t fair. BTW, I don’t own a single piece of LGB equipment primarily because I think it’s a little overpriced and because I am somewhat sensitive to correct scale proportions.



Walt

[Anonymous]

"The F7 question is easily answered"



Click on the picture and it will open in intended size that can be read.[;)][:)]

Thanks for posting this HJ, my evil eye and wooden ruler was a lot closer that I thought when I looked those locos over.[;)]

Have Fun: Jeff [8D]

[RhB_HJ]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Marty Cozad

Man!!! A working man is out earning money and look at this thread grow.
What was the topic again???
Capt. If I was not into G ,,"gauge" as much i may have tried ride-on trains at this house.

naaaaa,,maybe not.

Hey Marty,

I was doing ski-hosting most of the day, then attending a meeting (more skiing) and couldn't believe it when I got home.

Oh yeah, the original topic!?! Something to do with the easy confusion generated by the changing scale messages from LGB.

Of course Jack L has a job to do, but getting all those crossed messages from the past straightened out won't be easy. [:)][:)]

[Bucksco]

Sure did! Thanks Colin!

[RhB_HJ]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Bucksco

HJ,
Remember- It's going to be "G" gauge- not "G" scale!

[swg][swg][swg]

Hmmmmmmmm, yes of course! [:)]

RhB equipment: 1000mm: 45mm = 22.22 (according to NEM 1:22.5)

We shall take that into consideration. [;)][:)]

[tmcc man]

Jack, did you get my email? I know I will try to head there again over the summer.

[Bucksco]

HJ,
Remember- It's going to be "G" gauge- not "G" scale!

[RhB_HJ]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Bucksco

.....................................................

I do not argue- just attempt to inform (that's my job!)

Jack, [;)][;)]

The same here, just a slightly different message.[:D][:D][:D]

I have a 30340 "C2012" on the way and since it is supposed to set "new standards" I will pay close attention.
I'm also in the lucky position to have a copy of the original drawings for that car. Sooooo as your buddy Dave B would say "Stay tuned!" [;)][:)][;)]

[RhB_HJ]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Curmudgeon

Ah.
I wonder what scale the F-7's are........length, width and height.

Amazingly, the new Lehmann-type stuff is referred to as the "LGB-Toy" line.

And, yes, both those guys are for real.

TOC

Hi Dave,

The F7 question is easily answered



Click on the picture and it will open in intended size that can be read.[;)][:)]

BTW when I do reviews/comparisons I have a rating system that goes like this



No, I don't count the rivets, most of what I measure is more modern than that anyway. But three different scales for length/width and height get certainly noted.
I also noticed that on one forum they are busily comparing the Genesis to some of the other diesels.
That's jolly good, but have they never heard of vernier, height gauge and prototype dimensions! The way it works, one takes the proto dimension divides it by the model's dimension and voilá one has the scale. Oh yeah, to save a lot of errors I recommend using millimeters as the measuring units. Imperial fractions are a bit tricky.[:D][:D][:D]

[RhB_HJ]

QUOTE: Originally posted by railroadingman

Is this guy for real?

Yep, and with a whole lot more info in the profile than you do.

[;)][:D][:D][:D]

BTW this may interest you; apart from posting on fora regarding a few scale discrepancies and other finer detail, every once in a while I design a track plan for someone who would like a particular theme but is a bit restricted for space.

The last one I did - just as a favour to show what could be done - looks like this



Would you believe it, it is an American proto layout and the intent is to run USAT and Aristo equipment, but best of all this is to happen in Germany
!?!. This particular Large Scale modeler is interested in proto operation and uniform scale. Of course I did several different variants on the theme.

Just a small indication that there are a "few people" to whom scale matters. [;)][;)][:D][:D]

[Capt Bob Johnson]

I thought about the 2' stuff, but when you look into it thecost of trackage to just run around the edge of 30 acres means you hafta be a movie star or own a computer software company up in the Seattle area!

Turk,
that looks like a Morania or Bouchard there astern of you!

[Marty Cozad]

Man!!! A working man is out earning money and look at this thread grow.
What was the topic again???
Capt. If I was not into G ,,"gauge" as much i may have tried ride-on trains at this house.

naaaaa,,maybe not.

[Bucksco]

Thanks Colin!

[tmcc man]

Jack, in Shwencksville, PA (spelling?) there is a railroad like that that I wen to. I had a blast. I will see if I can get some info on it.

[Bucksco]

I should have a pretty major LGB thing going on in Orlando around mid-April.
I'll keep you posted!

The ride on trains look really cool- I've always wanted to try that.

[Anonymous]

Buckso,
I'd love to, but,,,,, you live north of the Arctic Circle (Interstate 10). Brrrrrrrrrrr......[:D][:D]
The only way I go north of the Artic Circle is if someone is paying me, "Very well"!![:D]
But if you come down here where there is civilized weather, bring your trains. We'll even go crank up the 7 1/2" gauge and ride that around.......or maybe even the 2' gauge!


And there definitely ain't no fiddly bits to break off of them...[:D]

[Bucksco]

You can come over and play with my trains anytime Capt_turk!

[Anonymous]

I like LGB! It's tough, it works near every time. It's plenty close to scale for the twenty foot rule.
I know if I catch someone in "MY" garden railroad with a scale rule, I take a "Yardstick" after them. [:D] That's after I sick the Doberman on them.[(-D]
All my fine scale stuff stays in the house on the shelf cause it's too blasted expensive, and got "way" too many fiddley bits to break off, to risk having some kid trip over an expensive engine, or have one take a dive off the track. The LGB stuff takes a lick'en, and keeps on tick'en.
You can't tell the difference after a few bourbon and cokes anyway!!!
[(-D][(-D]