Advice regarding construction tools

[Anonymous]

Matt - thanks! I really appreciate all the advice and comments. Got two projects in mind to get started, first some cribbing then a concrete mountain (wood framing with chicken wire and cement soaked burlap). Should be interesting if nothing else.

Best,
TJ

[Anonymous]

Congradulations Skycat!

[Anonymous]

All - got the Hitachi C10FR... as expected no one knows of a zero clearance plate for it, however, found this tip for klutzes like me that lets you make a servicable zero clearance plate for ripping without having to be a master craftsman.

http://www.woodworkingtips.com/etips/etip020419sn.html

Best,
TJ

[Anonymous]

just got the Ryabi table saw two weeks ago and with the zero clearance i can make my owen sidding for the houses, and roof shingles for the coverd brige im working on now, very cheap table saw to get at home depot, and if you have a home depot card you can make payments on it, home depot is my home away from home im there every friday night getting something for the house that we are remmodeling in NW Pa.

[Anonymous]

My makita is an older one 8" to be exact I did a couple of years ago by this



It is an metal frame you drop your bench top saw into and has a much better fence! Also could be purchased later to breakup the expence.

Checkout Tool Crib of the North, I have ordered from them and they have great deals! no complaints about them from me.

[markperr]

If you can, try and find someplace that will let you turn the saw on and off. I bought a (Black and Decker or Shopmate) tablesaw at Home Depot. When I turn it on there is absolutely no "spin up" time as in some saws take a half-second to come up to speed. This monster goes from all stop to flank speed in about a half nano-second. Scares the bejeebers outta me every time. I'll be looking for a new one sometime this summer. As for saw type, i'd still recommend a table saw with a zero clearance insert. Keep the blade guard on and for heaven's sake, definately use a push stick. Also, raise the blade to just above the height of the stock you are cutting. This minimizes chance of kickback.

I didn't glue my last trestle, just nailed it with an air nailer. I use a Bostitch that handles everything from 5/8" to 2". Have had to do some annual maintenance on the bridge but no more that one would expect.

Mark

[Anonymous]

Home Depot carries a pretty nice Looking table saw made by Ryobi. It had a very nice looking and feeling fence and mitre gauge, and I beleivethe one i saw also had a zero clearance fence. The big plus is saw with the Ryobi was the smooth top. it would be good for small work. I have no experience with it at all, but when comparing it to the inexpensive Craftsman I bought a few years ago, it would have been a no brainer for me had it been available. The fence on my craftsman is vrtually useless for accurate work and the mitre gauge is the worst thing I've ever tried to use.

[cacole]

TJ,

I used the table saw to rip the cedar fence pickets and redwood bender board into the desired widths, and the compound miter saw to crosscut to length and for angle cutting.

The cedar fence pickets were not of uniform thickness, but generally ranged from 1/2 to 5/8 inches. I ripped them into square pieces for the bridges and trestle uprights.

The redwood bender board was ripped into 1/2 to 5/8 inch widths for the top and bottom beams of the trestle bents, and 1/8 inch wide pieces for the cross bracing and horizontal bracing between bents. Bender board is not of uniform thickness, either, since it appears to be pieces sliced off of the logs as they are being trimmed, so I wound up with some unusable scrap.

I coated everything with clear polyurethane before gluing it together.

For the trestle bents, I drew a pattern onto a piece of plywood.

[emipapa]

Skycat,

I am not a fan of inexpensive tools and I always say "YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR" but in your case you state that the tool or tools are for building model railroad buildings, bridges, trestles and the like. Have you checked out the HARBOR FREIGHT web site?? www.harborfrieght.com I think you will find many items within your price range and building model buildings, bridges, trestles and the like will NOT over tax the equipment.
Good luck and Happy Building.
Ron
[:)]

[Anonymous]

George - saw some of the Ridgid saws in my shopping and they are very nice. Problem is they are about double my price range. I won't bore you with my sad story but I'm trying to get into this hobby on the cheap <g>. I looked at the Craftsman low end stuff and I certainly agree that given a choice there are some things it's silly to try to save money on in the long run. Sigh, the Hatachi (direct drive) seems to have a solid fence so I think I'll give it a go and hope for the best (it also tilts so you can roll it on two wheels to move it around... something that will be handy for me since where I'll use it and where I'll store it are two different places). This "Wood" magazine sounds pretty interesting... think it would help a neophyte like myself on the basics?

Cacole - I was in Home Depot yesterday and did not see a Makita 10" saw... sigh, almost impossible to get any help whatsoever at either Home Depot or Lowes so it was just me looking at what was on display. Matt thinks highly of the Makita as well. If you built all of your trestle and bridges with it, it must be very durable indeed. What sizes of finished pieces did you do most of your construction 5/8? 1/2?

Best to all,
TJ

[ghelman]

Skycat,
I subscribe to "Wood" magazine and they just did a model by model look at mid priced tablesaws June/July 2005 issue). Their top choice was the Ridgid TS3650. It was listed for $570.00 US. The Bridgewood TSC10CL ($550.00 US) was runner up. I have a small craftsman and wish I had spent the extra money for a better tablesaw like the Ridgid. A good fence makes all the difference in the world. I have several other Ridgid tools and I like their quality.

Good Luck.

[cacole]

The Makita 10" table saw is the one I have, and it cost just slightly over $100 at Home Depot ($99.00 before taxes).

Yes, they are a direct drive -- the blade is attached to the motor shaft.

[Anonymous]

Matt, the Makita's I've seen online look very nice. Can't find any at the local stores (Home Depot, Lowes, Sears) and I'm not confident enough in what I'm doing to try mail-order for one. Hmmm, "motor is like a power saw turned upside down"... does that mean it's a direct drive (no pulley or belt)?

TJ

[Anonymous]

Skycat, should have mentioned mine is a Makita table saw , I like it because the motor is like a power saw turned upside down, it doesnt bog down what so ever, unless the blade is dull[;)] Had it over ten years no problems, the fence is alittle finiky though.

[Anonymous]

Cacole - Saw your site via a post in another thread and I was very impressed. Your long bridges look is something I want to incorporate into my layout hence my interest in "tooling up".

Matt - Looked at a number of cheapie table saws (all I can afford unfortunately) and none are very ZTTP friendly. My Web research (reading reviews) tells me the key to a happy sawing experience is a good "fence". Indeed there are after market fences that cost more than a lot of table saws! One saw touted for having a solid fence for ripping is the Hatachi C10FR so I think I'll go for that (just under $200). Down side is that the fence was the only good thing I found in the review. No ZTTP available that I can find, but that's true of everything I've looked at that's under $500. I like your idea of just making one and so I'll give that a try. These smaller saws with plastic housings are supposed to be screaming meanies so I'll have to work something out with my neighbors on the noise factor (no late night ripping up fence boards I guess <g>).

Craftsman has an electric brad nailer that drives 18 gauge brads in 5/8, 3/4, 1, 1 3/16, and 1 1/4 inch lengths. Looks like I'll go for that one as well.

First project is some cribbing... saw a tip from Jim Meagher about using bicycle spokes to anchor the cribbing... maybe can start this weekend.

Really appreciate all the advice, thanks all!

TJ

[cacole]

I built over 100 feet of trestleworks and bridges out of cedar fence pickets and redwood bender board. The tools I used were a table saw, compound miter saw, and air brad gun. I used gorilla glue and/or exterior yellow carpenter's glue.

This can be viewed at http://members.cox.net/cacole2

[Anonymous]

Skycat, The ZTTP is offered by many manufactures, check there web sites for accessories[;)]. I make my own out of scrap wood I always have lying around.

Most brad guns max out around 1 1/2 inches. So if all you do is bridge building etc and don't plan on using it all the time on other household projects Kevin's electric will probably do the trick without the added cost.

[ghelman]

Skycat,
The tablesaw is probably the best choice if your just getting into the wood working side of this hobby. However, both have their pros and cons. A fence for the bandsaw can be as simple as clamping a piece of wood to the table or they do sell them. I use the complete range of brads you have mentioned. It really depends on the project. Good Luck.

Kevin, I have heard about the construction glue, but, haven't tried it as yet. I plan to give it a go on my next project.

[Anonymous]

George, K, and Matt,

Thanks so much guys for chiming in.

I'll have to figure out if I'm up to building a "a saw fence" for the band saw. But based on K's and Matt's comments maybe I'd be better off with a table saw (to start with anyway)... keeping in mind I have no natural handyman tendancies - driving a nail with a hammer is an accomplishment where I'm concerned.

Matt, great tip on the glue, I'm creating a "how to" binder and I'll certainly record that gem (I'm a technical writer by trade). Ditto the tip on "zero tolerence throat plate" (ZTTP). Now, is a ZTTP a feature that is only found on some table saw models or is it something all table saws support and you purchase it as an accessory?

Regarding brads, seems that the key is gauge, length, and type. K uses electric and maxes out at 1 1/4 long brads... so what is the range I of brad lengths given most projects are using 5/8, 1/2, and 3/8 size stock? Is there a minimum and is 1 1/4 a good max?

What is the optimal range for lengths of brads that I should be looking for in a brad gun?

K favors a steel brad so it rusts thereby "gluing themselves to the wood." But Matt, you like an air power gun and seem to be saying I want to use galvanized brads/nails. Hmmm. Does a specific brand of brad gun have a better selection of brads or are brads generic (as opposed to proprietary)?

Best,

TJ

[Anonymous]

Carpenter's turn- Gorilla glue's activation time can be sped up by misting both surfaces with water first. I personally feel the regular construction adhesive holds better then the polyurethane stuff. To speed the cure time of construction adhesive stick and unstick the two surfaces a couple times to release the vapors from the construction adhesive.

Brad nailers- I myself use a Senco but any of the pneumatic will do just make sure you check the gauge of nails they shoot and if they are availible in galvanized.

I myself have gotten by with a tablesaw thus far. If you do use a tablesaw make sure you use a zero tolerence throat plate. The throat plate is the removable plate around the blade. A zero tolerence one would be a plate with no hole or slot through it. once installed you crank the blade up slowly with the saw running, this will keep your small strip wood from getting pulled down into the saw. I probably will purchase a bandsaw in the future though.

[kstrong]

I'm actually more a fan of the table saw for ripping wood for trestles and such. The band saw will work, but ONLY with a SHARP blade, (i.e. just out of the packaging.) Otherwise they tend to pull to one side or the other. The table saw is quicker and cuts straighter. If you can only afford one saw, though, go for the band saw and keep a supply of sharp blades handy. The band saw will come in far more handy in terms of other modelbuilding projects.

As for brad nailers, I've got a Craftsman electric nail gun that works fairly well, unless you're working with a dense wood, or don't have the ability to really hold the nail gun firmly against the work. (In which case you follow up with an old fashioned hammer...) I don't remember the model number off the top of my head, and it's not anywhere obvious on the gun. It handles 1 1/4" brads at the longest. It should be fine for cedar and redwood. I built a Howe Truss Bridge with this gun, and had no trouble.

I'm a fan of mechanical fasteners wherever possible, so I'd opt for the nail gun before breaking out the glue. The Gorilla glue George mentions is a "polyurethane" glue, of which there are a few different types. There's a version of the glue sold in caulking tubes called "PL Construction Adhesive." I've not used it personally, but the folks at Kamloops Junction (they do wood kits and buildings for outdoors) swear by it. The polyurethane glues have a long set-up time, though, so I'd be tempted to nail and glue if you wanted the strongest possible joints. Simply nailing the joints, however, seems to hold up very, very well. My dad's got a redwood trestle on his line that's been up for almost 20 years now, and we've never had trouble with nails popping out. Regular steel nails will rust with the moisture in the wood, essentially gluing themselves to the wood.

Later,

K

[ghelman]

TJ,
I have both a table saw and a bandsaw. Actually, I feel the table saw is better for close tolerances. I have used both. But, I like using the bandsaw for what you are suggesting. I acually bandsaw to the approximate size and then I pass the piece through my planer surfacer. You don't have to do that, I just like the finish you get. The bandsaw is also excellent for ripping very thin pieces for a lap siding look. Build a saw fence and you can rip pieces to size rather quickly. I use cedar and a glue that uses water to help activate. One name brand is Gorrila glue. My brad nailer is a Porter Cable (about $100.00 US). It has worked great for several years. Can't help on the electric nailer, I haven't used one.
Good Luck

[Anonymous]

Hey all,

Am looking for advice from more experienced hands on tools I'll need to acquire for trestle building and workworking associated with a backyard layout.

Since most of the stuff I'm contemplating building (trestles, bridges, etc.) require small lumber with the largest pieces being 5/8 x 5/8 and others from 3/8 to 1/2 I'd like opinions on whether ripping is best done on a table saw or a band saw (keeping in mind I have neither). I think the band saw is better for smaller tolerances but I see ripping fence boards as a tough trick more easily done on a table saw. What say ye?

For nailing... a brad gun of some type appears the way to go but the air guns seem to be a bit pricey from $80 on up to hundreds. Is one of the cheap electric staple/brad guns a viable alternative? Would love a specific make and model recommendation here.

Bridge-master.com site says they don't glue since redwood expands and contracts too much, but a lot of people on the forums seem to favor gluing AND nailing (brading?). Any thoughts on that?

Best regards,
TJ