::UPDATED:: Critique of my bridge/tunnel idea please...

[nalts]

Hey all-

I've been doing some serious landscaping. I finally got around to starting my retaining walls. I thought of the idea of running two tunnels through one section and I'd like some opinions on the idea.

My main retaining wall is made up of larger boulders. From the left going right, it comes out about 20 feet from the house. The wall is about 4 feet high.

My idea from here (left to right) is to have a five foot section of 12" pipe for a tunnel.

Continuing right I was thinking of an "open section", possible a bridge that spans a small pond with waterfall coming off the retaining wall.

Next, I'd add another pipe to create another tunnel.

My questions to you are, does this make sense? Anyone out there do a layout similar to this? Any suggestions to make things go smoother?

Thanks in advance for your time.

Sincerely,
Chris

Edited for spelling.

[Anonymous]

Hi Chris,
Access mate, that's the main thing with tunnels, if something happens you need to be able to get at it to put it right. When you put a hole in the ground something will think it will make a nice home and that's when something happens because they've had a dig round or brought in half a ton of straw. Have a go Chris, the best way to learn is by doing.
Enjoy,
Kim
[tup]

[Anonymous]

Chris,

Have to go with Kim on this, the access hatch so you can work in it if need be.
Did you test out the tunnel with rail, ballest and a car?
If you want to carry any (if this is correct wording) intermobal container cars there 11" if I remember last.
I would call a shop I know and ask them about hight of tallest car/s or engines.
Charles Ro Supply 1-781-321-0090

My brain is sun dried right now.....

[kstrong]

Makes sense to me. At 5', access shouldn't be a concern so long as there's enough space between the tunnel entrance and the pond for you to safely stand/stoop/reach in without getting your feet wet. Doesn't have to be much, perhaps 1' or so would be sufficient. With good landscaping, I think a bridge over a pond between two mountains will be quite a focal point. Go for it.

Later,

K

[nalts]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Bluebonnet - 71

Chris,

Did you test out the tunnel with rail, ballest and a car?

Unfortunately, I don't have any track, rolling stock, ballest or anything. Just a bunch of ideas in my head and on paper.

QUOTE: Originally posted by Bluebonnet - 71


If you want to carry any (if this is correct wording) intermobal container cars there 11" if I remember last.
I would call a shop I know and ask them about hight of tallest car/s or engines.
Charles Ro Supply 1-781-321-0090

I will do so. Thanks for the number.

Edited to add: I made a phone call to a local train store. He suggested that 12" would be plenty of space for anything out there right now.

[nalts]

QUOTE: Originally posted by kstrong

Makes sense to me. At 5', access shouldn't be a concern so long as there's enough space between the tunnel entrance and the pond for you to safely stand/stoop/reach in without getting your feet wet. Doesn't have to be much, perhaps 1' or so would be sufficient. With good landscaping, I think a bridge over a pond between two mountains will be quite a focal point. Go for it.

Later,

K

k-

Thanks for the reply. I didn't figure access would be too bad, since the pipes are only 5' long. Thanks for reminding me about access space on the pond side. Me thinks I would have gotten wet with the way I had it laid out. [:0]

I have the Bobcat for a few more days. I hope to get the tunnels laid out today. If so, I'll get some photos for all to see.

Thanks for all the suggestions so far. Keep 'em coming if anyone else has anything to say.

Chris

Edited for spelling...Again!

[Anonymous]

PICTURES!!! please?

remember that you won't be able to utalize all 12" of space in the pipe, the track and whatever you use to secure it will take up 1-2" and then the cars are square on top and the pipe is rounded, when you put a square peg in a round hole, you can't take advantage of all the space. I'd say that you have about 10.5", not 12" but I think you'll still be able to squeeze those intermogals in there.

[nalts]

My wife lost/misplaced the digital camera. It will be a few days before I can get any pictures. I took a look at the pipe again. I think the smallest is 12" diameter and the largest 14" diameter. I'll have to double check in the morning. Either way, I should be okay.

Thanks,
Chris

Edited for error.

[kovacjr]

Well a better way to form the tunnel if to use cinderblocks so you can cement it all together and use 12"x6"x2" blocks for the caps, also gives you the ability to make access holes using sprinkler valve boxes which have different heights and sizes and can be glued to the cement block for a watertight seal. Use the portal of your choice and you have a strong and inexpensice tunnel. 14" flex drain is not a cheap material and its difficult to work with in a 12" opening after adding the ballast and track.
Just my 2 cents
~Jay

[Anonymous]

I say go for it man! you have it under control [tup]

[Anonymous]

Hi nalts
The only things to remember are access then does the largest train you know of fit through it does good.
Now make the internal Diameter of your tunnel bigger you train buddy will bring some thing bigger that won't fit.
you can hide the elephant sized hole with a removable tunnel mouth
to catter for the mosters that visitors may bring.
regards John

[nalts]

QUOTE: Originally posted by kovacjr

Well a better way to form the tunnel if to use cinderblocks so you can cement it all together and use 12"x6"x2" blocks for the caps, also gives you the ability to make access holes using sprinkler valve boxes which have different heights and sizes and can be glued to the cement block for a watertight seal. Use the portal of your choice and you have a strong and inexpensice tunnel. 14" flex drain is not a cheap material and its difficult to work with in a 12" opening after adding the ballast and track.
Just my 2 cents
~Jay

Jay-

Thanks for the suggestions. I already have the pipe as it was free (the best kind). Unfortunately this isn't flexible pipe. This may make my third longer tunnel a bit more difficult. I do plan on using a sprinkler valve cover for an access hole on the longer tunnel, just haven't gotten that far yet.

I'll take your ideas into consideration. Thanks again!
Chris

[nalts]

QUOTE: Originally posted by John Busby

you can hide the elephant sized hole with a removable tunnel mouth
to catter for the mosters that visitors may bring.
regards John

John-

That'sa what I thought would work, but since this is all new I wasn't sure.
Thanks!

[nalts]

Hey all-

I finally have my retaining walls mostly complete. Here's what I eventually did. Retaining wall out of boulders with an area for a "large drop" waterfall. To the left of the waterfall is a 4' long tunnel. I will eventually build steps over the tunnel to walk "into" the layout.

To the right of the tunnel will be a bridge over the pond created by the waterfall. To the right of the pond, the train will make a curve to the burm/mountain with a 5' tunnel underneath.

I also plan to have another tunnel running through a mountain with stream further down the line.

Now all I have to do is figure out the exact layout of my track. Guess I'll have all winter to do that!

Thanks for the ideas!
Chris
------------------

Front Retaining Walls
Under Construction:
http://snakeriverranch.christian.net/images/house/garden_train/garden_train.html

[d4fal]

The links don't seem to work for me. Clearance and access in the tunnel is your most important issue. Second is the durability of the tunnel. The post about the irrigation access is a great idea. The bridge over the pond? I'd say making it run around the back of the pond instead with possibly a couple trestles that you can watch from across the pond. On a calm day, the site of your train running across the pond being reflected will be well worth it. If the pond is very deep, the bridge could be a problem (especially if you live where the pond would freeze).

[nalts]

QUOTE: Originally posted by d4fal

The links don't seem to work for me.

Oops. Sorry. Try here. I'll also update above.
http://snakeriverranch.christian.net/images/house/garden_train/garden_train.html

QUOTE: Clearance and access in the tunnel is your most important issue. Second is the durability of the tunnel. The post about the irrigation access is a great idea.

I think I have these areas covered. I should be okay.

QUOTE: The bridge over the pond? I'd say making it run around the back of the pond instead with possibly a couple trestles that you can watch from across the pond. On a calm day, the site of your train running across the pond being reflected will be well worth it. If the pond is very deep, the bridge could be a problem (especially if you live where the pond would freeze).

In my first pond mentioned above, the water is/will be coming off my wall like a waterfall into the small pond. The train will run in front of/over this pond. I think I could use this idea in another area further down the line.

Are you saying the trestle would be in the water? That would look nice. Thanks for the thoughts.

Chris

[Anonymous]

Hi Chris, it has been nearly five months since this post on the Forum. I have been following with interest the progress and decisions you have made. Did you opt for two tunnels and a causeway/trestles across the pond? I wouldn't know where to begin with driving pilings for trestle work under the pond's surface. That begins to sound like real work and more than basic your "Construction 101." Chris, I am having a problem picturing the waterfall coming off the retaining wall into the pond. How are you feeding the water [garden hose, spigot, other] over the retaining wall into the pond? How will the pond handle possible over-flow from the falls? Sorry I have more questions than helpful answers. It sounds like a really challanging plan. Best of luck, T.D.K.

[nalts]

Hey Ted-

Just checking into the forums for the first time in a long time. Not sure where you are but it's the middle of winter here in Minnesota, USA. It's been about 50° F recently, but I won't be able to get outside and do any real digging until April. It's just too muddy until then. I'll try and answer your questions below.

Thanks for your interest.

Chris

QUOTE: Originally posted by Ted D. Kramer

Hi Chris, it has been nearly five months since this post on the Forum. I have been following with interest the progress and decisions you have made. Did you opt for two tunnels and a causeway/trestles across the pond?

Yes, the plans still call for a pond with two tunnels on either end. See pictures here:
http://snakeriverranch.christian.net/images/house/garden_train/garden_train.html

It's hard to tell, but in picture #100_2663.JPG and #100_2664.JPG, these are the two tunnels, partialy burried under dirt. The pond will be between them. They aren't in a straight line, though. From left to right the train will have to take as hard right to enter the first tunnel, comout over the pond, with waterfall behind it and then take another right to enter the second tunnel. I hope that makes it a bit more clear. I'll have better pictures once the snow melts.

QUOTE: Originally posted by Ted D. KramerI wouldn't know where to begin with driving pilings for trestle work under the pond's surface. That begins to sound like real work and more than basic your "Construction 101."

Not sure if I have too, I guess we'll have to see.. The pond will be about 4-5' wide at that point. I may just build a little berm or island to handle any middle trestles. Again, not sure what will happen here.

QUOTE: Originally posted by Ted D. KramerChris, I am having a problem picturing the waterfall coming off the retaining wall into the pond.

See above post. In picture #100_2663.JPG, there is a flat rock that you can sort of make out. It is inline with the corner of my porch. That is where the water will fall.

QUOTE: Originally posted by Ted D. Kramer How are you feeding the water [garden hose, spigot, other] over the retaining wall into the pond?

I plan on making a complete water garden. So far, I have some 1.5" PVC run under ground in a few places. I didn't complete that hookup before the ground froze.

After the water leaves the upper pond I'd like it to run down a river to a secondary pond near a "mountain" I want to build. From there it runs down another river over another wall into a larger pond that will sit within my sunken, walkout patio. Sound confusing? It does to me too.

QUOTE: Originally posted by Ted D. KramerHow will the pond handle possible over-flow from the falls?

Not sure yet. Hopefully, if I do it right, any over flow will head on down the stream. At least that's the plan.

QUOTE: Originally posted by Ted D. KramerSorry I have more questions than helpful answers. It sounds like a really challanging plan. Best of luck, T.D.K.

Thanks for your interest. I'll probably have more answers as I go along.
Chris

Edited for spelling...

[Anonymous]

Sounds Intersiting, I plan to build a tunnel under my stream (might have to temp devirt during construction) and bridge infront of my falls, keep us posted. I plan construction this spring (after thaw down here in Iowa)

[Anonymous]

I’ve used a NEW large soil pipe and about a quarter up on the inside I have levelled molten cork. And about a quarter down from the top I have cut off (tricky) so I could nail down my track and get in if I needed to

But every morning I have a camera car that I drive around to see if there is any unwanted creatures or leaves ect… (the camera car has a light on top it usually wakes up these hedhoges any way)

[Anonymous]

I read with interest about your tunnels. I haven't laid any track yet but I did install 2 tunnels 14 inches in diameter under my water fall and under a set of steps. I think yours will work out well. What are you using under your track as a base? I have herd concrete with footings are the best so there is no heving from the winter thaw.(I live on long island)I did not put anything down yet and was thinking about crushed bluestone (like what would go down as a driveway) and tamping it. any suggestions. I am not new to model railroading but I am to garden railraoding.