Radio controlled Shay

[ambrose]

 Hi, I am new to this forum. Been doing O scale toy trains for 60 years and now building my first garden railroad. I am looking for a RC battery powered Shay (any roadname) to use on a logging operation (inspired by the Roaring Camp & Big Trees Railroad in Felton Ca. ) built on a steep hillside with 6 switchbacks. I  need to have remote control of the couplers, speed, and direction. Mostly will be doing car set out, spotting, and switching at a log float terminal at the bottom of the hill.  Keeping track clean will be near impossible so rail based DCC or power is not practical.  Is it likley that I can find a engine "off the shelf" and ready to go or am I going to need to build one ? Any insight regarding a complete unit or the components to assemble one would be appreciated. I would prefer not to have a trailing car carry the power cell.

[cabbage]

I do that there are several radio controlled "Shay" locomotives out there... However I am not sure that any of them have automatic couplers controlled by the user(?) The people to talk to are "Remote Control Systems" of Australia. They have a USA East Coast and West Coast dealerships.

 regards

 ralph

[kstrong]

Nothing "out of the box" that comes ready to go (though you may find a used one on ebay from time to time.) However, any of the R/C systems will allow you to control the speed and direction as you need. See my current "Garden Railways Basics" column on advanced control for more information on those. You're going to have to install whichever system in the locomotive (or pay someone to do it for you). There won't be any trouble fitting the R/C and batteries in any of the commercially available Shays from Bachmann or Accucraft (especially the 3-truck versions.)

The fly in your ointment will come in terms of the automatic coupling. That doesn't exist off the shelf. I've been toying with the idea myself, using an HO coil switch machine (a la Atlas) and something like the smoke unit control on the Aristo-Craft Revolution R/C system that's designed to handle the higher current draws of such devices. The idea would be to somehow link the arm of the switch machine to the lift bar on the coupler, then trigger it remotely through the smoke unit interface and one of the function keys. It hasn't gone beyond the idea phase at this point. The issue isn't so much the mechanics, but the practicality relative to operations. I do prototype switching on my railroad, and more often than not, I'm setting out cars coupled to other cars, so I'd be able to use the automatic feature maybe half the time.

As an alternative, I'd perhaps look at going with Kadees and using their magnetic uncouplers they make for large scale. They work exactly like their small-scale cousins. That way, you can remotely uncouple whatever car you need to, not just at the locomotive. 

Later,

K

[Greg Elmassian]

You should be able to buy the MTH electric uncouplers, and they will mate with Kadee couplers also. You can run them with a small relay from a function output.

Some people have also modified Lionel couplers, but the MTH is ready to go.

Train-Li also has a DCC remote uncoupling option, the last one I saw did hook and loop, but the knuckle one is coming or here now, contact Axel at Train-Li.

Regards, Greg

[TonyWalsham]

One of the big advantages of using Digital Proportional (DP) R/C control systems for speed and direction control is you can also use the spare channels to drive ultra small servos to "pull the pin" for uncoupling.

Because DP R/C systems can operate multiple functions at the same time you can uncouple and accelerate away at the same time.

DP R/C systems are very low cost and will do pretty well everything the more expensive R/C systems can do including controlling sound functions

[Greg Elmassian]

 There are DCC decoders that will do servos.

Since you are asking about a system that is wireless from the throttle to the loco, one way to do this is use a DCC decoder connected to an Airwire receiver. The Airwire receiver will supply up to 3 amps to it's "DCC output".

Not to start a competition, but modern sound systems can have up to almost 30 separately controllable sound functions. There isn't an "model airplane type" RC system that I am aware of that will do 30 functions PLUS all the functions of motor control like separately settable acceleration and deceleration.

This is not a competition, but in terms of the sheer number of different features available, (if you need/want them), there is no comparision.

So, in terms of basics, like bell, horn and a FEW functions, you have many options. When you start adding functions, or doing fun stuff like adding coupler control and more stuff, you will run into limitations in a "model airplane" type system... 

Again, I will stress, you may not need or want all these functions, but I'm responding to the "will do pretty well everything"... to me everything is a BIG word... and not accurate when you consider the entire range of what is possible.

Regards, Greg

[TonyWalsham]

Greg is right.

There are no R/C systems using stick radios that can do 30 sound functions.

If 30 plus sound system triggers are what is desired then you will indeed need to get into the DCC based R/C systems. 

If however, proper Digital Proportional speed control, positive direction set, directional constant brightness lights and 4 x sound triggers is enough then Digital Proportional R/C offers the lowest cost, longest range and smoothest control of all R/C systems.

Greg wrote.  ........PLUS all the functions of motor control like separately settable acceleration and deceleration.!!

Others may consider having the ability to separately set acceleration and braking a big deal. I don't. Especially when, with Digital Proportional speed control, you can actually control the braking and acceleration rates as you are operating.  No need to set CV values you are stuck with until you change them again.
With Digital Proportional speed control, simply set the speed you wish to get to and then release the brakes progressively to achieve the acceleration rate you want.  It is constantly variable in real time.  Not something you have to set in CV's.
For variable braking simply apply the brakes and reduce the speed to what you want it to be.  The brakes can be applied variably using the brake control.