im starting my layout this weekend and i want to know how to keep the track in its place without the track sinkin in the dirt what can i use. my idea was wood about the size of the track but what is better or should i just lay it and be done with it what type of ankers or tie downs can i use. and the sub floor
Dig a trench about 4 inches wide and 3~4 inches deep. Wrap the trench with weed cloth and fill with gravel (quarter inch minus, crusher fines). Mound up with crusher fines, lay the track and ballast with more crusher fines. The weed cloth is not so much for the weeds but to keep the gravel from migrating into the soil. When done correctly this will keep the rails in place for years, with occasional re-ballasting.
Tom Trigg
I agree, try it and see if it works for you. Many people think that their track needs to be bolted down to something, and it's not always true.
I know a guy who felt it had to be rigid. He made a foundation that would not move (and this applies to wood or concrete) and secured the track to it with screws, tightly.
The natural expansion and contraction soon started ripping the ties around the screws, and sometimes pulling the ties from the rails.
The next "logical" step was (as he was advised) to remove the screws from the rails to let them slide.
The expansion still gave him kinks and gaps in the rail.
Then he added gaps in the rails so expansion would not kink the rails. That seemed to work but when the rails shrank (contracted) then the gaps were no longer evenly distributed.
Then he added sliding rail expansion tracks. That helped but he still got gaps where he did not want them.
Finally he gave up, free floated in ballast and everything was fine.
So, try the free floating first. If it does not work, you have lost nothing, and you can try something else.
Regards, Greg
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Let it float. I used 3" of 3/8" granite chip (avoid smooth pea gravel) with rail clamps. It will also make it easier to alter or expand in the future. And I run DCC in temps between 15-100 degrees with almost no rail maintenance aside from cleaning. The big mistake I made was using that black plastic landscape edging it looked great at first but the ground is now rejecting it even though I used 1' tent stakes. I shall be removing all edging and adding 5" of rock from rail edge to allow lawnmower wheels to roll on with mower motor on slow.
Toby
I used PT wood for a long time It warped rotted and floted in the rain Plus it was noisey. I switched to concert blocks 3X7 last year when I rebuilt my RR. I am not done with the rebuild I still need to add dirt and rock to backfill the raised track I did this because my RR sits in a pit. Follow the instructions given above free floting is the way to go.
Dave
The head is gray, hands don't work , back is weak, legs give out, eyes are gone, money go's and my wife still love's Me.
As an added thought, see the thread "Gravel Glue" http://cs.trains.com/trccs/forums/t/159524.aspx
We had an indepth discussion about "glue"ing the ballast in place. A few othe the others have started using the "Stabalizer" and I've only heard positive comments from them. I love the stuff.
The Home of Articulated Ugliness
Okay, first off: You are laying the track on the ground right? You could also make a raised RR-your choice (raised RR are usually used by live steamers). If track will be layed on the ground remove all mulch, wood chips, etc. that is where the track is going. You may need to do some trenching if the elevation of the land changes drastically. Lay your track back down and pour your choice of ballast onto the track (I use 89 granite- it is a little large but is readily available here in Florida, and looks pretty good. But the bottom line is never use pea pebbles!). Go all the way around your layout, then level the track to the best of your ability. Touch up the gravel, clean the track and give it a test run. You may want to go around with a watering can and wash your gravel/ballast. It washes away some of the dust and helps the rock settle into it's new home. Just don't use a hose to do this process-it is too forceful. In a weak or two (maybe more- 'ya never know) you should have a solid base for your layout
Question: What type of track are you using?
Have Fun!
If you can float your track (as described above), that's certainly the easiest way to go about things. You definitely want a solid foundation beneath your track. Just sitting the track on top of loose gravel or dirt is not a "solid foundation." That's probably the biggest "mistake" people make; they just lay track on the ground without any solid support beneath it, then wonder why their trains derail as the track twists and dips. I had a floating track for 5 years up in the snow belt, and my spring maintenance consisted of pouring new ballast and a little re-leveling to combat frost heave. Not a lot of work by any measure.
Having said that, there are circumstances where you will definitely want to have your track anchored by one means or another. This does not mean the track has to be rigidly attached to the ground at all points, but just held in place periodically to keep things from moving around. Do this if your railroad is in an environment prone to intrusions by feet (animal or child) that don't quite understand the notion of "tread lightly." That little bit of resistance to being pulled up and out of the ground will save you a ton of headache having to reset your track every time you go to run.
Anchors can be any number of things. I use a spline of 1/2" PVC electrical conduit under the track, and screw the track to this every 2' or so. The PVC is held in the ground by 3/8" rebar, likewise every 2' or so. Others sink redwood or pressure-treated posts into the ground every so often, and just screw the track to that. Synthetic woods would probably work better these days, since they're less prone to rot.
Later,
K
Just a quick addition to Kevin's comments. If you choose to sink PTL 4"X4" posts to anchor your track, be sure to thoroughly seal the cut ends. Even though PTL posts are rated for ground contact, they will rot if not sealed because the preservative does not completely penetrate the wood.
Walt
I have a similar quandary. The first edition of the Whiskey River and Canby (wife won't let me call it the Worn Rusty and Corroded any more) I cut pieces of Trex to lay the track on. Since I handlaid aluminum without a rail bender, just laying it on crushed rock wouldn't keep it in place. Cut the ends of the Trex at whatever angle fit close to the curve and used short 1 to 2 ft sections. Splined them together with plastic and spiked them down with foot long pieces of PVC pipe. A lot of work but you could dance on them without moving the rail.
I moved and am about to rebuild the WR&C. I noticed in the Oct '09 Garden Railway Basics article (p 18) that it appeared the track was fastened to PVC pipe or conduit. Wonder how that works? Any thoughts?
grandpopswalt … Even though PTL posts are rated for ground contact, they will rot if not sealed because the preservative does not completely penetrate the wood. Walt
Walt is dead on with this point. Cut PTL is no longer PTL. I get a preservative from Home Depot that I use to preserve the cut ends. I use the stuff on most every piece of wood that I have in contact with the ground. Neighbor and I were working on trees out front of our houses, both had been in place for 9~10 years. We had to fight and do some digging to get that 3-inch tree pole out of the ground. The pole on his tree came out by a two-finger pull. The difference was "Copper Green" has protected my stuff.
jtrostI noticed in the Oct '09 Garden Railway Basics article (p 18) that it appeared the track was fastened to PVC pipe or conduit. Wonder how that works? Any thoughts?
That's mine. I put it down in 2005, and it's proven quite effective. I've got a few areas where the frost wants to push the track out, but those are areas where I didn't use rebar to hold the PVC in the ground, but used those long green garden stakes instead. They don't hold to the ground for beans over the winter. So far, I've just pushed the track back down and re-ballasted, but I think this spring I'm going to pull the loop out and replace the stakes with proper rebar, lowering the track back down to the original height in the process. (My bridge sits around 1/2" above the pier right now.)
As I mentioned above, the PVC isn't so much for solid support under the track, but to just provide some basic support to hold the track in place to protect it from things that go "bump." The advantage of using the PVC pipe is that you can use it to lay out nice, smooth curves.
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