Ahh...good info Bob. I will be searching for some evidence as to how the newer F3's are set up.
Roland
All the postwar F3s, whether with horizontal or vertical motors, were the same size; and that size was very close to scale. So it seems very unlikely Lionel would make any later F3 longer than that.
What differed between the horizontal- and vertical-motor versions was the location of the truck center bearings. On the prototype, these would have been centered on the trucks; but, on the Lionel models, they were offset. In the horizontal versions, the offset spaced them farther apart, which caused the middle of the carbody to move farther to the inside of a curve than the prototype would. The vertical versions had the spacing offset the other way, closer than the prototype, resulting in less overhang to the inside of a curve. So, if there is a problem with running modern Lionel F3s on O27, it probably has to do with whether the center bearings have moved again since the later postwar years.
Bob Nelson
The 2343 PW F3 you see in my avatar clears all my 027 switches both PW 1122's and their modern equivalents. It has dual laydown motors on the 2333-20 frame. The tank just brushes the switch machine sometimes...does not cause any movement in the cab and has never caused any derailments and still has yet to leave a mark on the fuel tank so It's not rubbing very hard if at all. No extra clearance tho.
So I'm thinking my PW F3's are worst case...as the newer models appear to be shorter? and definitely no longer.
Thanks for the info...after stumbling around the internet I was able to find good evidence that this is a late model F3 as palallin pointed out in the first response...definitely very indistinguishable from the subsequent F7's from EMD. So I guess then, it might be safe to assume that since a postwar F3 can negotiate 027 curves and switches this version must also be able too. Seam like a good bet?
This is a very good source for information: http://www.railpictures.net/
And, oh btw, the grills and the internals were the difference. http://www.answers.com/topic/emd-f7
Celebrating 18 years on the CTT Forum.
Buckeye Riveter......... OTTS Charter Member, a Roseyville Raider and a member of the CTT Forum since 2004..
Jelloway Creek, OH - ELV 1,100 - Home of the Baltimore, Ohio & Wabash RR
TCA 09-64284
The EMD F7 was a 1,500 horsepower B-B Diesel-electric locomotive produced between February, 1949 and December, 1953 by General Motors' Electro-Motive Division. Final assembly was at GM-EMD's La Grange, Illinois plant. Although originally promoted as a freight-hauling unit by EMD, the F7 was also used in passenger service, where it set a new standard for performance and reliability hauling such trains as the Santa Fe's El Capitan.
A total of 2,366 cab-equipped lead A-units and 1,483 cabless booster B-units were built. The F7 was the fourth model in GM-EMD's highly successful F-unit series of cab unit locomotives, and was, prior to the introduction of the EMD SD40-2 freight unit, the best selling Diesel-electric locomotive of all time. Many F7's remained in service for decades, as railroads found them economical to operate and maintain, however the locomotive was not very popular with the train crews who operated and worked on them, due to the fact that they were extremely difficult to mount and dismount, and it was also nearly impossible for the engineer to see hand signals from his ground crew without leaning way outside the window. As most of these engines were bought and operated before two-way radio became standard on most American railroads, this was a major point of contention. In later years, with the advent of the "GP" type "road switchers", F's were primarily used in "through freight" and "unit train" service where there was very little or no switching to be done on line of road.
The F7 can be considered the zenith of the cab unit freight Diesel, as it was ubiquitous on North American railroads until the 1970s (longer in Canada). The F7 design has become entrenched in the popular imagination due to it having been the motive power of some of the most famous trains in North American railroad history.
The F7 replaced the F3, differing primarily in internal equipment (mostly electrical) and some external features. The F7 was eventually succeeded by the more powerful but mechanically similar F9.
I'm not much of a diesel spotter, but IIRC the tall fans + Screen side vents make this unit a late version of the F3. I may well be wrong, but that's what I seem to remember.
That said, it is NOT the old postwar version of the F3.
Has anyone contacted Lionel about this? This picture depicts an F7 Diesel doesn't it? So I wonder if the picture is wrong or the description is wrong. I'd love to pre-order this diesel as long as I'd end up recieving what's pictured and not an F3 (Which I have already)
Also this is the engine (the F7 like in picture) I wanted to run on 027 curves and asked about in another thread...I think it'll run on 027 curves and it just says "minimum radius 031" because its from Lionel's "Standard "O" offerings.
I'll try contacting lionel myself as well; i've heard it's not impossible to get a response.
Thanks,
Pages 82 - 103 Standard O Diesel Locomotives
Sante Fe F3 A-Unit
Conventional F3 and SD40T-2 Diesel Locomotives
These new diesel locomotives offer the scale-size and detail of Lionel Standard O with electronics geared toward the operator who prefers traditional transformer-only operation, plus non-powered units for easy double-heading.
Gauge: Standard OMinimum Curve: O-31Dimensions: Length: 13"(6-34521) $264.99
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