Lionel Catalog tidbits

[johnandjulie13]

Hello All:

1. For some reason, my three year old son loves the UPS train set.  What is the attraction?  It is not very colorful.  He is already asking to get the set for next Christmas (the UPS set has now surpassed his desire to get a blue comet set).
2. There was a thread a couple of weeks ago regarding CTT's review of the NASCAR sets.  I was in my LHS a couple of days ago and they had several of the expansion packs on display.  I was impressed with the race cars that ride on the flat cars.  The detail and color are extremely well done.  I can now see why these are attractive to NASCAR fans.  If they had a Richard Petty, David Pierson or a Cale Yarborough, I would have immediately bought one.
3. Harry Potter, NASCAR, Polar Express and Thomas the Tank Engine.  Lionel appears to have several "franchises" on which to base not only train set sales, but also future add-ons (e.g. Mavis and James being added to the Thomas line this year). Add these to the Christmas and Halloween themed products and Lionel appears poised for growth over the next several years.

Regards,

John O

 

[Joe Hohmann]

Hello All:

1. For some reason, my three year old son loves the UPS train set.  What is the attraction? 

The kid has good taste...the brown is rich yet subtle. I like tuscan PRR passenger cars. Joe, retired Graphic Designer

[johnandjulie13]

Hello Joe:

I hope that's the case.  However, I am a big PRR fan and there is no shortage of tuscan red on my layout.  Yet, he still likes the UPS set.

Regards,

John O

[jefelectric]

Could it be that the UPS set is one of the few things in the Lionel catalog that he has seen in real life.  Most of the items in the catalog other than the other items you mentioned above were long gone when todays kids were born.

[ChooChooMan2]

Perhaps he is to be a future UPS driver or employee.

Jeff

[Signals]

1. For some reason, my three year old son loves the UPS train set.  What is the attraction?

Hello John,

Perhaps he is attracted to the truck that comes with the set. 

[riverrailfan]

 

Brown Truck=New Train

[Signals]

 Brown Truck=New Train

 

Well, I didn't quite mean it that way, but now that you mention it... 

[Andrew Falconer]

In the new K-Line Catalog there is a SuperStreets UPS Delivery Van.

Andrew

[Anonymous]

I would like the UPS set also!! But I, think you understand why.

There are a diesel, caboose and centenial car in the 2006 vol.2 catalog. They should be here in a couple of months!!

UPS is an icon just like Lionel. UPS turns 100 years old this year.

[laz 57]

Maybe his calling in life?

laz57

[Anonymous]

The strong attraction to that set is indeed probably due to the truck on the flat-car.
Kids see the potential play-value in something like that.
As a kid myself in the 70's, I remember wanting the Tyco HO Piggyback trailers because they came with a truck to pull the trailers. Kids don't see that a similar flatcar with vehicle could be added to any O gauge set for under $30. I would try to point that out before deciding on a set.
That said, the UPS set is pretty cool looking. It has a very business-like look to it.
Good luck,
Mike

[brianel027]

John, aside from some of the explanations given towards the vehicle, I can offer one more which I have mentioned in the past. For the better part of a decade I went to shows with a portable layout that was detailed enough to hold the adults interest, but very much geared towards beginners/families/kids.

There was no doubt was so ever that kids showed a very strong interest and excitement about current road name trains. It wasn't even close, nor a contest. No PRR or NYC loco generated the visable ooohs, ahhhs and excitement from the kids than a Norfolk Southern all black diesel or a all blue Conrail diesel. I'd put a colorful Lehigh Valley loco on the layout and the kids would ask for the all black Norfolk Southern loco to be run instead. The REASON is this is what kids are likely to see today and they relate to that. I even have a NS steam loco. Kids don't see steam today, but they sure recognized the slanted NS logo on the tender and would exclaim "that's like what we saw today on the train."

Today's real rail rolling stock is mostly an affair of mostly non-descript austere minimal markings/colored cars. But locomotives are another story. Canandian National, Canadian Pacific Railway, Kansas City Southern, Norfolk Southern, CSX, BNSF, Conrail and Union Pacific all have very distinctive color schemes and for the most part, eye-catching graphic locos that were designed to be easily remembered. The horse logo of the NS is a true kid pleaser. And it was amazing all the analogies kids came up with for the Conrail "Wheels-on-Rails" logo. Little girls called it a "rainbow."

Remember, in this advertising media conscious age of television and visuals, that companies spend big dollars to come up with simple easily remember logos and trademarks, and it works! This includes the railroads who hire advertising agencies and designers to come up with graphic logos that will be easily recognized and remembered having only been seen for a flash of a moment. Penn Central with the P-C, Chessie System with the sleeping kitten, Rock Island with THE ROCK, CP Rail with the mountain logo, Burlington Northern with the large BN... and the modern examples go on.

Yet for some unexplained reason, Lionel ignores these roads (save for UP) on starter set items. I personally think this has been one of the biggest mistakes Lionel (and K-Line) have ever made. The lost sales can't be measured. I can't tell you how many times people asked where they could buy the locos I had painted myself. Many thought they were uncataloged Lionel or K-Line items, and on occasion someone would offer good money for some of my items right off the layout. I foolishly sold one once and regretted it immediately and never did that again, regardless of the amount of money. Lionel wants to sell trains to new comers and kids, yet they ignore the roads that will kindle the interest in trains on starter items. High end scale pricey items come in the most current of today's roads... one would think with the buyers of those products being older, we'd see FP-40's, Dash 8's and Dash 9's, SD90MACs and so on issued in only old hat roads like Nickle Plate Road, Pennsy, C&O, B&O, Great Northern, Wabash, and NYC.

Lionel could very easily make up some post-merger sets that would offer the visual excitement of hitting on today's rail lines while still paying tribute to some of the past ones. The Great Northern Glacier RS-3 set could have easily been a BNSF set with the same exact logo paint scheme. I think the train companies are making the mistake of short-term marketing to grandpa's (who may buy the train set) without giving the recepient (the grand-son) a connection to the trains of today.

It might make no sense to some due to the austere color scheme, but on a comparison between any train set roadname made in the past 16 years, my Nofolk Southern beat them all in popularity with kids. NYC and PRR couldn't come close in the exictement from the kids, nor could the colorful Lehigh Valley, Reading or Jersey Central. Even the Penn Central was more popular with kids than the NYC or PRR. I wondered why, but realized from watching the kids that they liked the big P-C letters and thought it was cool how they were combined.

Yet PRR and NYC are the two most frequent roadnames on affordable starter products and train sets. Hmmmm. Grandpa's roads may sell the sets to Grandpa, but current roads will help build the future interest from the next generation that Lionel CEO Calabrese says he wants.

The one and only postwar old hat paint scheme that generated any comparable excitement to Conrail and Nofolk Southern was the Santa Fe warbonnet scheme. And kids around my parts don't see that one too much, but that one got kid's attention. That was the only exception. Guess that one was the most popular train for good reason!!! The War Bonnet scheme could compete with Conrail and NS.

Of course, needless to say, whimsical operating cars (like the Giraffe car or Aquarium car), Disney and Warner Bros. items and novelty roads of the like always grab attention. I have some custom made Sesame Street cars that got a lot of attention from mothers and very young kids.

[johnandjulie13]

Brianel:

You may have a point.  My son certainly recognizes the UPS logo.  While I am a PRR and NYC fan, I agree that these should not be the starter sets Lionel markets to new hobbyists.  Starter sets should be CSX, UP, BNSF or NS (even CP or CN would be okay).  I think Lionel is doing an excellent job in expanding their marketing breadth.  But while they may generate additional revenue with NASCAR, Harry Potter, or Polar Express sets, it is questionable whether the purchasers of those sets become repeat buyers.  If Lionel (and others) offered starter sets with trains that kids see every day I believe: i) more sets would be sold; and ii) you would generate repeat buyers as more kids would move down the funnel and become hobbyists.

As for my son, when I asked him today if he wanted the UPS set for Christmas he responded that he would rather have the Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer set (from MTH).  Well, he only has 10 months to make up his mind...

Regards,

John O 

[Anonymous]

I agree with Brian's assessment: Kids go for things they can identify with in some way, just as many old timers in the hobby did fifty or so years ago when we were kids.  There are exceptions, of course, but breaking away from the time-worn Pennsy, NYC, UP, and ATSF liveries in the lower-end offerings would be a good move for these manufacturers if they truly want to attract more kids, and by default their parents, to spend more on train sets and individual items as an entry to the hobby in the future.

[pbjwilson]

Amtrak. When i take my son to the hobby shop he gravitates toward anything Amtrak. Its what he sees rolling through town. What happened to the Amtrak sets? Does MTH make them anymore?

Cant agree with you guys more. Would love to see starter sets with current roadnames. Even the GP-20's in modern roads would work.

[Andrew Falconer]

The new BNSF paint scheme looks like it belongs on starter set equipment.

Andrew

[Andrew Falconer]

BNSF current scheme conventional sets for the younger train enthusiasts.

Sets at a lower price range.

These are sets with the logos and colors introduced by BNSF Railway in May 2005.

Standard O Scale set. Plastic Body Cars with Die-Cast Trucks.

BNSF SD70MAC Conventional with Train Sounds.

BNSF ACF Center Flow 2-Bay Covered Hopper. Plastic Body version. Gray Body with Orange & Black graphics.

BNSF Standard O 40' Gondola. Black Body.

BNSF Modern 50' Boxcar in Oxide Red.

BNSF Three-Bay Open Hopper with mineral load. Oxide Red with White Graphics.

BNSF ACF Center Flow 3-Bay Hopper. Plastic Body Version. Oxide Red with white Graphics. End of Train Device.

Traditional O Gauge Set

BNSF GP38-2

BNSF 2-Unit MAXI-STACK Intermodal Car with BNSF and J.B. Hunt Containers.

BNSF Two-Bay Open-Top Hopper. Aluminum body. Orange & Black Graphics.

BNSF Hi-Cube Boxcar. Oxide Red.

BNSF Gondola with Covers. Oxide Red.

BNSF Waffle-Side Boxcar with End Of Train Device.

Lionel has to make these two BNSF Sets as soon as possible, at an affordable price, to appeal to the modern audience.

Andrew Falconer

[johnandjulie13]

Hello Andrew:

Great suggestions!  I see this engines run near my house every day.  They would make ideal starter sets.  The goofy color scheme has to be attractive to younger kids.  I think your two hypothetical sets would sell better than a PRR or NYC starter set, at least here in the midwest.

Regards,

John O

[RXRon]

Just playing  with  ya... but  remember the old  joke  about  the "milkman" or "postman" or  now UPS man?  Maybe  it's in his blood.

[Andrew Falconer]

UPS has a NASCAR racing team.

http://racing.ups.com/

Lionel is making both UPS and NASCAR sets.

For the 2007 Volume 2 there has to be a UPS and NASCAR set in the final stages.

Jerry would not miss that opportunity.

Andrew