Converting 2 rail track so it can be used for either 2 or 3 rail equipment

[cruikshank]

This club we are taking over has 2 loops of three rail and two loops of 2 rail.  (90% of the members have 3 rail, so we would like to convert over to 3 rail where there is now two rail, but still have the option of running 2 rail.  Last night one of the members experimented with running a piece of nickle silver wire down the center of the track, and tested a 3 rail Camelback engine.  It ran great. He also pushed a string of hoppers around using the good old o5o method. Again it worked.  We thought there would be flange problems but it seems not.  Has anyone had success laying a third rail on 2 rail track to run Lionel type equipment.  It would be so much easier than pulling up all the two rail which is nicely ballasted and re-laying 3 rail gargraves.  There is also a nice cabinet full of classic 2 rail engines, several from Frank Ellisons Delta lines.  So it would be nice to be able to flip a switch and run those.  What problems can you foresee.  Thanks again,  Dave

[lionelsoni]

Before David Vergun (FJ and G) began using two rails with battery power, he customarily removed the center rail from tubular track and replaced it with copper wire.  Perhaps he can advise you.

I'm a little surprised that you didn't find a gauge problem.  American O-scale track is laid to the correct gauge for the American 1/48 scale ("Proto 48"), which is a little narrower than the 1 1/4 inches used for toy trains.  Could it be that your two rails were actually intended for two-rail operation of trains with Lionel-style wheels?  That's how the scale modelers started back in the twentieth century and would explain why you didn't have flange problems.

[FJ and G]

"Has anyone had success laying a third rail on 2 rail track to run Lionel type equipment."

 

 

and on code 148 2-rail as well (Lionel will run on code 148 but nothing smaller)...

 
I wish you success and hope you are not hounded by any more of these rail problems...

[Anonymous]

I wish you success and hope you are not hounded by any more of these rail problems...

Photo Caption:
"Hey you with the camera!  Yeah you!  Remember me?  I'm your 'bestfriend', you know the guy you used to toss ball with, wrestle on the ground with?  Run those trains once more and you'll be chasing me trying to get that engine back!"

[palallin]

I'm a little surprised that you didn't find a gauge problem.  American O-scale track is laid to the correct gauge for the American 1/48 scale ("Proto 48"), which is a little narrower than the 1 1/4 inches used for toy trains.  Could it be that your two rails were actually intended for two-rail operation of trains with Lionel-style wheels?  That's how the scale modelers started back in the twentieth century and would explain why you didn't have flange problems.

Sorry, Bob, but no, it's not.  American O scale uses the 1.25" gauge.  A small group of intrepid folks do employ the correct gauge--they call themselves Proto48 modelers--but they constitute only a small fraction of US O scale.

 I have done some experimenting, but It's my conclusion that one must begin with hand-laid track.  In fact, my experiments have centered around laying the senter rail slightly off-center to use as dual-gauge O/On30.  My intent was to use old Atlas snap track, but I found a serious need to solder around switches and so forth, and I don't want to have to work so hard to protect my plastic ties. 

So long as the rail is Code 148 or bigger, the track will handle Modern Era flanges easily.  Code 125 will handle most but not all, though spikes are the problem.  Postwar O needs at least Code 148, and prewar needs bigger yet.

[lionelsoni]

So 1 1/4 inches still rules.  I had the impression that the scale modelers had progressed through Q gauge (1 3/16) to proto 48.  But you say it has been a minority movement all the while?

[palallin]

Yep, still a minority.  In fact, a small one.  It had been gaining ground, but the recent surge of RTR 2-rail O by Atlas, Weaver, et al. has ballooned the 1.25" gauge segment.  Interestingly, there yet remains a tiny fragment--probably not a half dozen guys--devoted to 17/64" scale. . . .

[underworld]

So long as you have the different power supplies isolated...so both can't get turned on at the same time!!! I've got some gauge 1 3-rail trains. For some of the track I have GarGraves 3-rail, for another part I have some Lionel G track that I got for a bargain and put in a center conductor. Since the Lionel G track was for DC operation...everything is isolated and could be used for 2-rail DC or 3-rail. I don't have any 2-rail DC locos yet but I do have the ability. It will be much cheaper (and easier) for you to convert than to replace.

Good Luck!!!

  

underworld