Why shouldn't I connect Lionel log dump accessory to aux. terminals on CW-80 transformer?

[Anonymous]

I have a Lionel Penn Flyer set with expansion pack that includes a log dump car activated by a remote uncoupler.  The owner's manual explains how to rewire the remote uncoupler to be used with auxiliary power supply (instead of running on main track power, as originally configured and installed) so that it can be activated even when track power is off/down, but it says NOT to power this using the aux. accessory terminals on the CW-80 transformer.  Does anybody know why?  Thanks.  (A newbie who doesn't want to destroy the kids' train set before THEY do!)

[phillyreading]

cgzg,

The Lionel CW-80 is a very tricky transformer to wire correctly from, sometimes the wires need to be switched from the proper terminals example power is the accessory power and accessory is the track power.  What I suggest doing is to replace the transformer with a larger one, something that can handle at least two trains at once and has accessory power.

Lee F.

[jimhaleyscomet]

Or less expensive, I pick up a 30W or 40W transformer and run the accessory from a separate power supply after you get the two in phase.  Old K-line sets had a small transformer that can be picked up cheap on ebay, online, or at a train show.

Someone who knows better than I has figured a work around for this if you only want one transformer.

 Jim H

[Anonymous]

cgzg,

According to several posts on the OGR forum, Lionel recently begain shipping a revised version of the CW-80, which, I think will eliminate the cautionary advice in the instructions for the dump car and track. So, the first question is, do you have an old one or a revised one? Thus far, no one seems to know for sure how to tell from the date on the bottom of a transformer, but if you bought your train set/transformer in late '06 or early om '07, you MAY have a new one.

It has always been difficult to write clearly about the CW-80. If it is true that there is a revised version out there, it becomes even more difficult, as what is right for the older ones may be exactly wrong for the revised ones.

The only way I know how to tell whether your transformer is an old one or a revised one is to do a "continuity check" across the A and B posts of your transformer, using an ohmmeter, with the CW  unplugged, and nothing connected to any of the terminals. If The ohmmeter says there is zero resistance across the A and B posts, you have an old one, and must use the workaround if Lionel approves. If the ohmmeter says you have infinite resistance across the A and B posts, and zero resistance across the U posts, you have one of the revised ones, and perhaps can ignore the caution against using the accessory posts. (Emphasis on PERHAPS.)

If you have one of the old (non-revised) ones, there may be a very simple workaround that won't cost you a dime, other than for a phone call to Lionel Technical Service department. It involves using the A and B posts as "common" or "ground". (They are in fact tied together electrically inside the OLD CW-80's.)

Then you can use U-under-A as the power lead to the center rail of the track, and U-under-B to power the accessory. Do not connect the U posts together. The whistle/horn and bell buttons will be reversed by this new hookup scheme, but you can easily re-label them with a Dymo tape or whatever you have around the house.

Now, having said that, what I STRONGLY suggest you do is call Lionel customer service and ask them what to do. First, confirm which model you have: older or revised. This is critical. If its an old one, ask if the workaroud is valid. If it's a revised one, ask whether the caution (prohibition) in the instrucions for the dump car and the uncoupling/operating track still applies. Either way, heed their advice.

In other words, don't just take my word for it, OK? I don't want you to damage critical parts of your kid's train either.

So, the short answer to the original question takes two parts: 1. If you have an old (original) CW-80 the proposed hookup will not work and might damage something; 2. If you have one of the newly revised ones, MAYBE you can.

Please post back and let us know what Lionel tells you, so we can all learn something.

[lionelsoni]

An accessory transformer does not need to be in phase with the track-power transformer, although there is no harm in getting them into phase.  However, comparing the phase by the lamp-or-voltmeter-between-transformer-outputs method between a real transformer and a CW80 will not produce the expected null when they are in phase, but just a dimmer lamp or lower voltage.

[Anonymous]

Update:  I performed (described above) continuity check on transformer posts, results suggested I have a NEW cw-80.  I called Lionel tech service, they had me check code at bottom right of sticker under transformer (mine has code G0406).  They said this is in fact a new cw-80 and I CAN use it to power the log dump car.  THANKS VERY MUCH for all your help.  In pre-web days I would have been sunk.  P.S>:  I decided to get a separate transformer (used Lionel accessory transformer on ebay)  since I can tell I'll be pushing the cw-80 to the edge by the time I hook up all the fun stuff I (uh, I mean the kids) will eventually want.  Thanks again.

[jimhaleyscomet]

CBZG,

Please keep us informed on your experiance with the new CW-80.

Jim H 

[Anonymous]

The advent of the newly revised CW-80 has been long-awaited and is very promising news indeed.