Material to use to insulate a rail

[Anonymous]

I'm trying to install a crossing gate on my layout. I installed fiber pins on the inside rails on a section of track both before & after the gate. Basically, what I thought was the right procedure was to have the gate activated while the train was still approaching the "crossing" and have it go back up after it had gotten some distance away, like the real things do.

Of course, I forgot that the two outside rails are electrically connected, so my crossing gate stays on all the time. It's a good thing I wired a toggle switch in there!

Anyway, what kind of material should I use to insulate the inside rails so I can make this thing work? I just can't replace sections with insulated rail sections because some of the track in the "block" are curved.

Thanks!

Tony

[Anonymous]

I'm trying to install a crossing gate on my layout. I installed fiber pins on the inside rails on a section of track both before & after the gate. Basically, what I thought was the right procedure was to have the gate activated while the train was still approaching the "crossing" and have it go back up after it had gotten some distance away, like the real things do.

Of course, I forgot that the two outside rails are electrically connected, so my crossing gate stays on all the time. It's a good thing I wired a toggle switch in there!

Anyway, what kind of material should I use to insulate the inside rails so I can make this thing work? I just can't replace sections with insulated rail sections because some of the track in the "block" are curved.

Thanks!

Tony

[Algonquin]

Hi Tony,

I have a lot of insulated rail on my layout. I started by using the insulaters from old lionel track which worked well until I ran out of old track. Then, a gentleman named Allen W. Miller suggested I use the covers from matchbooks. These work great. I cut the matchbook covers into pieces the same size as the lionel insulators. Then I folded them around a piece of track to form them into a U-shape. This helps them stay on the rail as they are set back into the tie. I then tested each section to ensure the rail was insulated.

Regards,

Tim Pignatari

[Algonquin]

Hi Tony,

I have a lot of insulated rail on my layout. I started by using the insulaters from old lionel track which worked well until I ran out of old track. Then, a gentleman named Allen W. Miller suggested I use the covers from matchbooks. These work great. I cut the matchbook covers into pieces the same size as the lionel insulators. Then I folded them around a piece of track to form them into a U-shape. This helps them stay on the rail as they are set back into the tie. I then tested each section to ensure the rail was insulated.

Regards,

Tim Pignatari

[lionelsoni]

I have always had enough leftover center-rail insulators from scraps of cut-up track that I have never had to make an insulator. I would think that ordinary pasteboard would do. However, http://www.silogic.com/faq4.htm advises that "These are easily made from a piece of index card covered by a layer of electrical tape. Firmly press the rail back in place with the insulators underneath. Be careful not to puncture them."

The insulated rail will be slightly higher than the others. If you look closely at the ties, you will see that the tie is deformed under the center rail to make room for the insulator. So you may want to shim the resulting track to remove the cant. On the curves, I would exploit this by insulating the inside rail to create a reverse superelevation, since toy trains tend to derail on the inside in a "clothslining" fashion.

Another thing to be careful about is the corrugation in the rail and the tabs that hold the rail to the tie. They are omitted in the center, to avoid puncturing the insulation. I would flatten them out with some stout, squarenosed (linesman's) pliers before reinstalling the insulated running rail.

I have a (long-term) plan to insulate an entire main line for block signals. I have thought of screwing down the track with two screws in each tie, then cutting the ties in two between the screws. Whether this would be easier or harder than insulating the rails, I don't know.

[lionelsoni]

I have always had enough leftover center-rail insulators from scraps of cut-up track that I have never had to make an insulator. I would think that ordinary pasteboard would do. However, http://www.silogic.com/faq4.htm advises that "These are easily made from a piece of index card covered by a layer of electrical tape. Firmly press the rail back in place with the insulators underneath. Be careful not to puncture them."

The insulated rail will be slightly higher than the others. If you look closely at the ties, you will see that the tie is deformed under the center rail to make room for the insulator. So you may want to shim the resulting track to remove the cant. On the curves, I would exploit this by insulating the inside rail to create a reverse superelevation, since toy trains tend to derail on the inside in a "clothslining" fashion.

Another thing to be careful about is the corrugation in the rail and the tabs that hold the rail to the tie. They are omitted in the center, to avoid puncturing the insulation. I would flatten them out with some stout, squarenosed (linesman's) pliers before reinstalling the insulated running rail.

I have a (long-term) plan to insulate an entire main line for block signals. I have thought of screwing down the track with two screws in each tie, then cutting the ties in two between the screws. Whether this would be easier or harder than insulating the rails, I don't know.

[Anonymous]

Tim & Bob:

Thanks, guys! I knew this was the place to ask!

I think I'll try the index card technique. I'll let you guys know how it works out.

Tony

[Anonymous]

Tim & Bob:

Thanks, guys! I knew this was the place to ask!

I think I'll try the index card technique. I'll let you guys know how it works out.

Tony

[Anonymous]

OK. I'm about ready to jump out of my skin.

I took out the sections of track that I intend to insulate. I insulated the inside rails on all of these pieces using a sheet of black construction paper I stole from my kids. I used a multimeter to make sure that the inside rail on all of the sections were electrically isolated from the other two rails.

Unfortunately, two of these sections are the actual feeder sections for the two loops. That is, these are the sections that I soldered wires to in order to electrify everything.

Now, for some reason, when I put the multimeter on the two outside rails for these two sections, I still get a tone, indicating there's a circuit. Hell, when I test the center rail against any of the other two rails, I get a tone. This is baffling, because I made sure that I didn't get any tones when I put everything together.

After putting everything back together, the trains still run fine over these tracks. Yet it seems I have some kind of short, if I am to believe the continuity test. And why would that lie???

I've also noticed that my crossing gate doesn't work any more. I'm wondering if I killed it with a wiring error.

This is a short description of the wiring I've done. Remember, this is a two piece layout that uses two transformers.

1. A black wire goes from a black binding post to the outside rails of both loops.
2. A wire goes from a red binding post to one side of two SPDT Center Off switches.
3. Another wire goes from that post (actually, from one of the SPDT switches) to a red banana plug. This plugs into a banana jack in the other half.
4. A black wire goes from a black banana plug to the other side of the SPDT switches. Again, the black plug mates with a black jack in the other half.
5. Two red wires leave the center connector on the SPDT's, each going to the center rail on a different loop.

In order to add the crossing gate, what I did was add a new binding post for the acessory power. A green wire goes from the binding post to one side of a SPST toggle switches. Another green wire goes from the other side of the SPST to one terminal on the crossing gate. A black wire goes from the other terminal on the crossing gate to the inside rails on the insulated section of track.

Unless I'm missing something, there should only be a circuit for the crossing gate when a train is on the insulated section & the on-off switch is in the On position.

Is this wiring plan correct? If it is, then I must have a short some where, and I might have to rip out all of the wiring & start again. I'm NOT looking forward to that!

Any ideas, guys?

Tony

[Anonymous]

OK. I'm about ready to jump out of my skin.

I took out the sections of track that I intend to insulate. I insulated the inside rails on all of these pieces using a sheet of black construction paper I stole from my kids. I used a multimeter to make sure that the inside rail on all of the sections were electrically isolated from the other two rails.

Unfortunately, two of these sections are the actual feeder sections for the two loops. That is, these are the sections that I soldered wires to in order to electrify everything.

Now, for some reason, when I put the multimeter on the two outside rails for these two sections, I still get a tone, indicating there's a circuit. Hell, when I test the center rail against any of the other two rails, I get a tone. This is baffling, because I made sure that I didn't get any tones when I put everything together.

After putting everything back together, the trains still run fine over these tracks. Yet it seems I have some kind of short, if I am to believe the continuity test. And why would that lie???

I've also noticed that my crossing gate doesn't work any more. I'm wondering if I killed it with a wiring error.

This is a short description of the wiring I've done. Remember, this is a two piece layout that uses two transformers.

1. A black wire goes from a black binding post to the outside rails of both loops.
2. A wire goes from a red binding post to one side of two SPDT Center Off switches.
3. Another wire goes from that post (actually, from one of the SPDT switches) to a red banana plug. This plugs into a banana jack in the other half.
4. A black wire goes from a black banana plug to the other side of the SPDT switches. Again, the black plug mates with a black jack in the other half.
5. Two red wires leave the center connector on the SPDT's, each going to the center rail on a different loop.

In order to add the crossing gate, what I did was add a new binding post for the acessory power. A green wire goes from the binding post to one side of a SPST toggle switches. Another green wire goes from the other side of the SPST to one terminal on the crossing gate. A black wire goes from the other terminal on the crossing gate to the inside rails on the insulated section of track.

Unless I'm missing something, there should only be a circuit for the crossing gate when a train is on the insulated section & the on-off switch is in the On position.

Is this wiring plan correct? If it is, then I must have a short some where, and I might have to rip out all of the wiring & start again. I'm NOT looking forward to that!

Any ideas, guys?

Tony

[lionelsoni]

Tony, you did move the feeders from the two insulated sections to the other side of the track, didn't you?

If what you are calling "construction paper" is what I think it is, I would not choose it as an insulator. It is pretty weak stuff, like heavy newsprint. I would use pastboard or Tim's matchbook suggestion.

[lionelsoni]

Tony, you did move the feeders from the two insulated sections to the other side of the track, didn't you?

If what you are calling "construction paper" is what I think it is, I would not choose it as an insulator. It is pretty weak stuff, like heavy newsprint. I would use pastboard or Tim's matchbook suggestion.

[Anonymous]

Bob:

When I originally wired everything, I soldered black wires to both outside rails & connected them both to common. Then, when I started this wiring project, I clipped the wires from the inside rails & connected them to the gate.

Here's what I think I'm going to do. I'm giong to go out & buy some card stock of some kind & paint it black. Then I'll pull up all of the sections, including the feeder sections (I'll clip all three wires). I'll make sure everything is insulated before I put anything back.

While I've got the feeders out, I'll make sure that there are no shorts in the rest of the wires. When all of this is done, I'll put everything back & reconnect everything & check for shorts again. If everything's still good, then I solder. I'm going to go sparingly with the staples & make sure that no staple breaks the insulation on any wires.

Does the wiring for the gate sound right, assuming there are no shorts?

Tony

[Anonymous]

Bob:

When I originally wired everything, I soldered black wires to both outside rails & connected them both to common. Then, when I started this wiring project, I clipped the wires from the inside rails & connected them to the gate.

Here's what I think I'm going to do. I'm giong to go out & buy some card stock of some kind & paint it black. Then I'll pull up all of the sections, including the feeder sections (I'll clip all three wires). I'll make sure everything is insulated before I put anything back.

While I've got the feeders out, I'll make sure that there are no shorts in the rest of the wires. When all of this is done, I'll put everything back & reconnect everything & check for shorts again. If everything's still good, then I solder. I'm going to go sparingly with the staples & make sure that no staple breaks the insulation on any wires.

Does the wiring for the gate sound right, assuming there are no shorts?

Tony

[lionelsoni]

Yes

[lionelsoni]

Yes

[Algonquin]

Hi Tony,

I found an easy way to paint the insulators black. I use a black permanent marker. You can find wide tipped ones at craft and office suppy stores. The ink from the marker dries in a few seconds and leaves a dull black finish.

Regards,

Tim Pignatari

[Algonquin]

Hi Tony,

I found an easy way to paint the insulators black. I use a black permanent marker. You can find wide tipped ones at craft and office suppy stores. The ink from the marker dries in a few seconds and leaves a dull black finish.

Regards,

Tim Pignatari

[Anonymous]

Success!!

On the way home from work last night, I stopped off at Staples & picked up some black poster board. It's really a lot more material than I needed, but it was the right color & it was a lot heavier / thicker than the material I was using previously.

Then, last night, I took up all of the sections I want insulated, and I even unsoldered & clipped the wires on the feeder sections. I removed the inside rails & re-insulated them. I make sure that all sections were insulated with the multi-meter before I put them back.

I then went & tested the track sections left on the half of the layout on which I was working. I eventually removed almost every section & they all tested fine. However, when I tested the 022 switches, I found a circuit between the outer rail & the center rail. The switches are currently drawing their power from the track, so I THINK this is caused by the circuit that powers the light bulb. Can someone confirm this?

When I put the sections back together, I tested each piece to confirm that the inner rail was still insulated. I found that I had soldered one of the feeder wires a little too close to the metal tie and that the bare wire would touch the tie when the section went back into place on the layout. I put a piece of electrical tape on the tie near the feeder wires & this fixed that problem.

I was able to run the trains fine on both loops last night and I was able to measure the expected voltage on the wires for the crossing gate when I had a train in the area with the insulated rails. It seems that everything's working fine now. Thanks everyone for your help!

Now what I have to do is wait for the new crossing gate to arrive & mount it. Or maybe I can try to fix the one I have.....

Tony

[Anonymous]

Success!!

On the way home from work last night, I stopped off at Staples & picked up some black poster board. It's really a lot more material than I needed, but it was the right color & it was a lot heavier / thicker than the material I was using previously.

Then, last night, I took up all of the sections I want insulated, and I even unsoldered & clipped the wires on the feeder sections. I removed the inside rails & re-insulated them. I make sure that all sections were insulated with the multi-meter before I put them back.

I then went & tested the track sections left on the half of the layout on which I was working. I eventually removed almost every section & they all tested fine. However, when I tested the 022 switches, I found a circuit between the outer rail & the center rail. The switches are currently drawing their power from the track, so I THINK this is caused by the circuit that powers the light bulb. Can someone confirm this?

When I put the sections back together, I tested each piece to confirm that the inner rail was still insulated. I found that I had soldered one of the feeder wires a little too close to the metal tie and that the bare wire would touch the tie when the section went back into place on the layout. I put a piece of electrical tape on the tie near the feeder wires & this fixed that problem.

I was able to run the trains fine on both loops last night and I was able to measure the expected voltage on the wires for the crossing gate when I had a train in the area with the insulated rails. It seems that everything's working fine now. Thanks everyone for your help!

Now what I have to do is wait for the new crossing gate to arrive & mount it. Or maybe I can try to fix the one I have.....

Tony

[lionelsoni]

I think you are right about the lamp in the switch.

[lionelsoni]

I think you are right about the lamp in the switch.

[Anonymous]

Bob:

There's an easy way to test the theory: yank out the light bulb. I'm sorry I didn't think of this last night! I'll give that a shot tonight. Given that everything seems to work OK, I'm reasonably certain that yanking the light bulb will get rid of the "short" between the outer & center rails.

Tony

[Anonymous]

Bob:

There's an easy way to test the theory: yank out the light bulb. I'm sorry I didn't think of this last night! I'll give that a shot tonight. Given that everything seems to work OK, I'm reasonably certain that yanking the light bulb will get rid of the "short" between the outer & center rails.

Tony