TMCC Problem = Confused

[dougdagrump]

At the club layout today one of the other members had a problem with one of his C&NW GP-7's that had everybody scratching their heads.
The line was being powered by a Z-4000, so he could switch from conventional to TMCC control when changing motive power. The GP, TMCC equipped started acting kinda goofy so an aux-1 #0 reset was tried, to change. Set switch to program for the other reset squence no improvement. But here is the strange part, the cab-1 would control speed & direction but no horn or bell, the hand held Z-4000 remote wouldn't alter speed or direction but it would operate the horn.
Any ideas ????????
[%-)] [%-)] [%-)] [%-)]

[MartyE]

Sorta sounds like it's acting as a second unit in a lash up. Maybe? But that doesn't explain the conventional issue. That is a weird one.

[dougdagrump]

Marty, That was my first thought when the horn wouldn't operate initially, so I had him do the "clear lashup" sequence, no luck. That's what prompted the two reset attempts.

[Roger Bielen]

Try going back and doing a reprogram on the engine, the instructions are usually at the end of the instruction book. If not try the TAS, or Lionel, websites. My Lionel Hudson started acting up two days ago, taking off at full speed, slowing, taking off, no response, etc., good thing I had a long passenger consist attached. A reset hasn't helped. I haven't taken the time to reprogram yet but that'll be my next step. All other engines run fine, no blinking headlight.

After reprograming, if still having problems I'll open the engine and check for a loose board or antenna connection or see if I may have used too much smoke fluid and wet something that shouldn't be. Trouble shooting can be a pain but you need to check one problem at a time.

[wrmcclellan]

Doug,

I agree with Roger on doing the complete reprogram sequence of the loco. Try the manual for the instructions or you can go to Digital Dynamics or Lionel's websites:

For DD, go down to TIPS and HINTS and click on the link to the reset procedure.

http://www.digitdynam.com/tech.html

Lionel also has this info under their Customer Service section FAQS area:

http://www.lionel.com/ForTheHobbyist/GeneralTipsAndFAQs/InstructionstoRestoreTMCCfunctions.pdf

Code for the GP7 is 5.

TMCC locos can get lost every once in a while if the loco derails or encounters a spot on the layout where some arcing occurs on the rollers. The voltage spikes can cause the TMCC memory to get lost.

Regards,
Roy

[trigtrax]

It sounds like your horn is working in conventional mode while your speed and direction is still controlled by TMCC. For a test I would use another working engine under TMCC and see if the horn can still be activated by conventional means. It won't help your problem but it might give the techs some insight into what's going on.

[Anonymous]

How did you switch to "conventional"? You should have powered down the Command Base. Disconnecting the antenna doesn't always have the desired effect.

[Roger Bielen]

I reprogrammed and cleaned my Hudson today to see if I could solve my problem. Checked to make sure the antenna wasn't grounding out, no indication of not picking up the signal, headlight stays solid. I guess you know where I'm going, its still acting up[banghead]

The strange thing is it'll give me the "surging" and response problem when "cold" but work ok after fooling with it for several minutes. All my other engines are ok, the lights blink when they should on the base station and TPC400. I guess a trip to the shop is in order, maybe its a receiver board starting to go.

Isn't this hobby fun?[%-)]

[wrmcclellan]

Roger,

Take the shell off and remove the can motor and see if the armature shaft turns freely.

[dougdagrump]

This thing had everyone scratching their head and going hmmmmmm.
Chuckn, We didn't switch the loco from TMCC to conventional, it's a big layout in a public venue so to be kind to these expensive toys every hour or so we swap out locos to give them some down time.
Trigtrax, Tried one of my TMCC loco's and it did not behave as the other did, ie. MTH handheld would not activate horn.
Roy/Roger, We tried the reprograming procedure and it didn't help.
Maybe he can find something at home when there is time to really look into it .
Still [%-)]

[Anonymous]

A TMCC loco will only operate in command mode if it see's a command base signal (aka you can not turn off TMCC from the loco's stand point). When in command mode, the horn/whitle buttons on a conventional transformer should have no affect on the loco. It should only respond to commands from the CAB-1.

If you were to power up a TMCC engine BEFORE the Command base is active, it will revert to conventional mode until track power is cut. Once this happens the engine will "listen" for the command base carrier signal when power is re-applied. If it catches a signal within .2-.4 seconds, it will go into command mode and will not respond to conventional controls.

[dougdagrump]

chuckn, That's what had everyone so confused, it was PARTIALLY responding to both.
TMCC = speed and direction
MTH handheld = Horn

[Anonymous]

If a Command Base is out of "tune" some of the commands will not be addressed properly to a loco. Before you send the Engine in for repairs, test it on a different Command Base. The Z-4000 signals may have been interpreted as noise/commands and resulted in the horn blowing. There are some potentiometers in the Command base that can be adjusted, but this is no something that is recommended for end users. You can go from a mildly sick Command Base to a totally non functional one..

[Roger Bielen]

Roy, I've turned the motor by hand when I had the shell off to check for excess smoke fluid build up and loose boards. Everything physical seems ok. It ran fine till a couple of days ago. When I bring it over to Memory Station he can try it on the store layout and see what happens, if a board he usually has spares on hand.