Vertical separation between levels in an O layout

[Anonymous]

I'm planning a new O layout for the day when our new addition's done & I can begin cutting lumber & laying track.

I'm planning to put a small categorization yard & a small engine yard above a hidden staging area. I'm going to keep the yards about 24" to 30" or so deep (at least along one of the walls), in order to minimize how much of the room these area occupies. The yards are going to look as if they're on top of a hill overlooking whatever I decide to put below them (and shows).

I plan to put the yards on top of a piece of 3/4 inch plywood. I'm not yet sure what I'm going to use to keep the plywood from falling down. The book "How to Build Model Railroad Benchwork" recommends using 1x3s or 1x4s; I'm thinking 2x2s would be just as strong in this application & take up less vertical space.

The question I have is what's the minimum clearance I need to keep between the top of the rails on the lower level & the bottom of the supports for the upper level? I'm probably going to use Gargraves track, but i think I'll be OK if I plan for Lionel O profile track. The lower level, being hidden, probably won't have any road bed, either, which cuts down on the height a little bit.

Thanks!

Tony

[Anonymous]

I'm planning a new O layout for the day when our new addition's done & I can begin cutting lumber & laying track.

I'm planning to put a small categorization yard & a small engine yard above a hidden staging area. I'm going to keep the yards about 24" to 30" or so deep (at least along one of the walls), in order to minimize how much of the room these area occupies. The yards are going to look as if they're on top of a hill overlooking whatever I decide to put below them (and shows).

I plan to put the yards on top of a piece of 3/4 inch plywood. I'm not yet sure what I'm going to use to keep the plywood from falling down. The book "How to Build Model Railroad Benchwork" recommends using 1x3s or 1x4s; I'm thinking 2x2s would be just as strong in this application & take up less vertical space.

The question I have is what's the minimum clearance I need to keep between the top of the rails on the lower level & the bottom of the supports for the upper level? I'm probably going to use Gargraves track, but i think I'll be OK if I plan for Lionel O profile track. The lower level, being hidden, probably won't have any road bed, either, which cuts down on the height a little bit.

Thanks!

Tony

[Anonymous]

Hello, Well I was told to leave 7 inches between the top and the bottom layers so it clears all the various manufacturers cars

[Anonymous]

Hello, Well I was told to leave 7 inches between the top and the bottom layers so it clears all the various manufacturers cars

[lionelsoni]

The tallest prototype equipment now is 20'2 above the railhead, which would be 5.04 inches. However, an electric locomotive, like a GG1 or EP5, with pans up, needs about 5 1/2 inches. If you could resolve always to keep the pans down, you should be safe with 5 1/4. Otherwise, I would go with 5 3/4 or 6. Seven inches seems like a bit much.

Bob Nelson

[lionelsoni]

The tallest prototype equipment now is 20'2 above the railhead, which would be 5.04 inches. However, an electric locomotive, like a GG1 or EP5, with pans up, needs about 5 1/2 inches. If you could resolve always to keep the pans down, you should be safe with 5 1/4. Otherwise, I would go with 5 3/4 or 6. Seven inches seems like a bit much.

Bob Nelson

[Anonymous]

Bob:

Thanks! Maybe I'll "split the difference" & go with 6.25", just to be safe.

I just got my new issue of CTT yesterday & I started reading "Cadillac Layout, Bargain Price" article. Given that there's going to be a construction project going on in my home, maybe I can use a few of the "rejects" in my own layout when the dust has settled...

Thanks again!

Tony

[Anonymous]

Bob:

Thanks! Maybe I'll "split the difference" & go with 6.25", just to be safe.

I just got my new issue of CTT yesterday & I started reading "Cadillac Layout, Bargain Price" article. Given that there's going to be a construction project going on in my home, maybe I can use a few of the "rejects" in my own layout when the dust has settled...

Thanks again!

Tony

[lionelsoni]

An overnight thought:
Get another 1 1/2 inches of height reduction by eliminating the framing entirely from the upper level. Support it with threaded rod (1/4 or 5/16 inch) from the lower level, with the rods placed wherever they don't interfere with the lower trackwork, are over the strong points in the lower level's structure, and are needed to keep the upper level rigid. Drill through the lower level and attach the rods solidly with washers and nuts above and below. Drill through the upper level, but put the threaded rod only part-way into the hole from below, with a washer and nut. Fill the hole on top with Plastic Wood or cover it with scenery.
An extra benefit is that you might be able to lift off the upper level pieces intact to work on the lower-level track.
It might be tricky to align the holes, top and bottom. You could use an electrician's drill, which is a couple of feet long, to drill both holes at the same time.

Bob Nelson

[lionelsoni]

An overnight thought:
Get another 1 1/2 inches of height reduction by eliminating the framing entirely from the upper level. Support it with threaded rod (1/4 or 5/16 inch) from the lower level, with the rods placed wherever they don't interfere with the lower trackwork, are over the strong points in the lower level's structure, and are needed to keep the upper level rigid. Drill through the lower level and attach the rods solidly with washers and nuts above and below. Drill through the upper level, but put the threaded rod only part-way into the hole from below, with a washer and nut. Fill the hole on top with Plastic Wood or cover it with scenery.
An extra benefit is that you might be able to lift off the upper level pieces intact to work on the lower-level track.
It might be tricky to align the holes, top and bottom. You could use an electrician's drill, which is a couple of feet long, to drill both holes at the same time.

Bob Nelson

[Anonymous]

Bob:

I just re-read your "overnight thought." What I think you're saying is that 3/4" plywood should be plenty stiff to support the weight of the yard, the scenery, and of the cars on the yard. Then the threaded rod gets spaced every x inches or so near the outside edges to support the top level. The yard essentially sits on top of the threaded rod, correct?

I like it. And it would make it possible to lift up the top level (all 20 feet of it), though I'd have to build it in sections to make it manageable.

I still need a way to get at the staging track from underneath to get my "12 inch to the foot" hand (or should I say paw) in there in the event of a derailment....

As for drilling the holes for the rod, I think I could get away with putting the upper level plywood driectly on the lower level & drilling through both from the bottom up.

Thanks!

Tony

[Anonymous]

Bob:

I just re-read your "overnight thought." What I think you're saying is that 3/4" plywood should be plenty stiff to support the weight of the yard, the scenery, and of the cars on the yard. Then the threaded rod gets spaced every x inches or so near the outside edges to support the top level. The yard essentially sits on top of the threaded rod, correct?

I like it. And it would make it possible to lift up the top level (all 20 feet of it), though I'd have to build it in sections to make it manageable.

I still need a way to get at the staging track from underneath to get my "12 inch to the foot" hand (or should I say paw) in there in the event of a derailment....

As for drilling the holes for the rod, I think I could get away with putting the upper level plywood driectly on the lower level & drilling through both from the bottom up.

Thanks!

Tony

[lionelsoni]

Tony,

I wouldn't even restrict the rod locations to the edges. You can get quite a few inches of very solid cantilever with that heavy plywood. I would scatter them more-or-less uniformly, wherever it looks like they might be needed and where they don't interfere with the lower-level trackwork.

Of course, you said that this was a completely new layout; so matched drilling with the plywood pieces together is certainly the simplest way. However, you may need to add or move a rod or two after it is built.

[lionelsoni]

Tony,

I wouldn't even restrict the rod locations to the edges. You can get quite a few inches of very solid cantilever with that heavy plywood. I would scatter them more-or-less uniformly, wherever it looks like they might be needed and where they don't interfere with the lower-level trackwork.

Of course, you said that this was a completely new layout; so matched drilling with the plywood pieces together is certainly the simplest way. However, you may need to add or move a rod or two after it is built.

[Anonymous]

Bob:

Yep, you're right. I've got a 3/8" spade bit that's about 12" or 13" inches long that I use for running coax through walls & floors when I'm putting in a new TV. That should do just fine for drilling holes for 1/4" or 5/16" threaded rod.

Thanks for the idea. I'll keep it in mind (for 2 years)

Tony

[Anonymous]

Bob:

Yep, you're right. I've got a 3/8" spade bit that's about 12" or 13" inches long that I use for running coax through walls & floors when I'm putting in a new TV. That should do just fine for drilling holes for 1/4" or 5/16" threaded rod.

Thanks for the idea. I'll keep it in mind (for 2 years)

Tony