Lionel 42" path remote control switch help

[Anonymous]

First a little background of my setup.
I'm using a Lionel CW-80 transformer, diesel engine from the '80's with 7 freight cars behind it and an old 0-27 manual switch. Everything works great with this configuration.

I recently purchased a new Lionel 0-27 42" remote-control switch. I replaced the old manual switch with this new one. I have this new switch setup with the 2 insulator pins on the control rails like it shows in the manual. The train runs good until it crosses this new switch . I run the train from going from the single side past the split where I can then backup the train off the main line. The train starts sparking more than it normally does and the green light on the transformer starts flashing and shuts down the train. Once the train passes this switch it is ok again. I do notice arching marks on the new switch. One thing I did notice is that if I have the train going in the opposite direction (going from the side with the split toward the single side) it goes pass the switch with no problem.

Any ideas?

Thanks,
Dave

[Anonymous]

Hi Dave,

Mine did that Same thing! I found you could do this. On the control rails, Tape them up totally with duck tape or electrical tape.

I can provide pictures if you need to see what I am talking about.


Why its doing this, The control rails in Lionel switches are always On, so when the train passes it complete's the circuit, but with time and dirty wheels, those rail tend to spark and it "Jumps" to the center rail and causes the transformer to short out.

By taping the rails up, you are basicly disabling the non de-railing feature of these switches[xx(] but its the only I found to get reliable operation on my layout.

[Anonymous]

Yeah, the Lionel O27 based switches always had that problem, even on some of the O27 switches I had.

Oh, and [#welcome] to the forum trainmans2! lad to have you aboard....be sure to visit the Coffee Pot thread to intorduce yourself.

Chris

[lionelsoni]

I have never observed this problem in many years' experience with O27 switches. I have never used a CW-80 "transformer" either.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the suggestions. I think I'll try disabling the non-derailing feature and see what happens.
Dave

[phillyreading]

Welcome to the forum Dave!
From what I know about 027 switches the Lionel brand has the most problems. Have you considered going to K-Line 027 42" switch? It fits right in with Lionel track, no pins or other things to use to make it work, also the solenoid is more low profile which allows for longer passenger and freight cars to go thru without problems.
Is your layout new? Do you have alot of 027 track?
For more realism you may want to look into GarGraves track and switches and Ross Custom switches, gives greater realism and more flexibilty to the track system. The GarGraves track matches up with 027 pretty well with just adapter pins, O gauge tubelar
needs adapter pins and shims under the GarGraves track to mate properly. Also you won't have the sparking issue with GarGraves track and switches. One more thing about GarGraves track and that is all rails are insulated from each other unlike Lionel& K-Line track & Williams track.
Lee Fritz

[1666Columbia]

Hello,

     I believe that I'm having this same problem.  For me, it only happens when the train is going from the turnout to the stright part of the switch.  The sparks occur in the center of the switch on the inter outside rail of my Right hand 42" 027 Lionel switch.  If I go slow the train will stop.  I see my Amp metter dance when the train is passing though the switch, but in this this one direction.  I am I have the same problem as mention in this thred?  I called Lionel and they never heard of this problem.

Thanks 

 

 

[lionelsoni]

I'm pretty sure this has nothing to do with the control rails.  Something is touching the fat center rail, probably the backside of a wheel.  Look for evidence of arcing on the sides of the center rail.  You might find that a wheelset has too small a gauge.

[otftch]

I have eight of these switches(042) and have not had this problem.They work fine and probably have less sparking than my 027's.I'd check your wheels to see if they are guaged correctly.I run through them both ways and even have one slaved to a switch on top of my layout so the reversing loop underneath is always straight when the train goes into the loop.I had a derailment here once in a while and cured it that way.

                                                                                   Ed

[USNRol]

I had a similar problem running my Polar Express Berkshire through 027 lionel switches.

 

 I found that either the non-flanged drivers would short to the fat middle rail at the red arrow (when on the turn-out) or the wide collectors on this loco would short to the corners of the swivel rails at the blue (out)and green (through) locations.  I fixed this by placing small pieces of scotch tape (only a temporary Christmas layout) on just the locations mentioned to stop this.  These problems should be less pronounced on your 042 switches, but I would not be surprised if this is affects those switches as well.  I do not believe your control rails have anything to do with your problem.

There are other locomotives with gearing just inboard of the wheel flanges that will almost always contact the fat center rail on any lionel 027 switch shorting the track.

 CW-80:  Has very low tolerance for any shorts or sparking anywhere on your track.  The overload protection circuitry is very fast acting I've found compared to my PW V model which you could arc-weld with before the short circuit protect feature activates.

Hope this helps,

Roland 

[USNRol]

these forums are weird...  tried and tried to get the pictures to work right....finally found that by clicking in the dead white space to the right of each thumbnail the full size image could be brought up!  Anyone have annny tips?

Roland

[1666Columbia]

Hello,

     I performed some more testing.  I discovered that the short or spark only occurred with my Williams all metal bottom box cars.  I can run a Lionel Post-War Switcher and standard cars throught the switch fine.  I did stop the spark thanks to this forum.  I placed electric tape where the spark was occuring on the outer rail.  Now I can run Lionel and Williams car through this switch.  Thanks!!!

[dochooter]

I have a lot of sparks from one of my Lionel 042 switches as well.  Trains go through OK and the transformer does not short out (Z-4000).  Should I care?

[Anonymous]

USNRol,
You are using Image Shack, as am I and I have the same problem... when you copy and paste the [URL][IMG] reference remove the [URL] tags and then remove the .th from the image name.  The software here will handle the rest.

Brent

[ADCX Rob]

Like this:



and:



Rob

[USNRol]

Thanks Both!  I went up and was able to fix my post.  Appreciate the tips!

roland

P.S.  Glad the thread starter has been able to fix his problem

[USNRol]

Wanted to Bump this thread back to the top so Swipesy could reference it for his "Replacement Switches" thread.

Hope it helps, sounds similar to me...even the same loco.  Strategic placement of electrical tape was a miracle for me!

Roland

[traindaddy1]

1666Columbia: Sounds like you talked to the same Lionel Tech to whom I have spoken. Talk to the train people on this forum for the correct information and help. All the best.

Rob & Roland:  Thanks for the clear photos and your insight.