putting traction tires on postwar engines

[Anonymous]

I'm sure this has been asked or tried before, but I'm too tired tonight to be effective with the search button....

so, can a typical postwar steamer handle a homemade traction tire?

In other words, if I wanted more traction can I just add traction to one or all of the drive wheels?

[Buckeye Riveter]

CTT Magazine had an article about this subject over a year ago. I don't remember the date, but isn't there an index to CTT articles somewhere on this site?

[underworld]

I think so long as you can find a tire to fit, it should be fine.

underworld

[:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]

[eZAK]

Two things to keep in mind.

If you add a tire to an ungrooved wheel you will raise the hight slightly creating a wobble.
Replacing the whole wheel with a grooved one might be an option.

If you add tires to Two or more wheels you run the risk of loosing you ground.

[Big_Boy_4005]

I agree with Pat, replacing the wheel or modifying it to accept the tire is the key.

The magazine index link is up at the very top of every page, next to the Trains.com logo.

[Anonymous]

You could get a extra wheel and take it to a machinist to get a groove gouged out on the lathe to accomodate the tire.

[Anonymous]

i installed traction tires on my 736 bershire-it ran for about 5 loops before the tires started to come off- the engine ran and pulled better but without the grove on the wheel, you will have problems keeping the tires on-best way is to remove the wheels and machine the grove into the wheel.

[Anonymous]

thanks, I have access to a lathe, so perhaps I'll grab my safety glasses and give it a try.

[lionelsoni]

The wheels are sintered iron. Be sure that you can machine that. You might want to experiment on a scrap wheel first.

I believe that the splines were first cut into the axles, then the axles pressed into the wheels, cutting splines into the wheels in the process. Although the wheels are not precisely quartered, the same wheels must go back onto the same axle, since the rotation angle between the axle and the wheels was not controlled. So keep track of your wheels after you pull them. (This is the voice of experience.)

The 2-6-4 version of the 2026 had wheels of different diameter. The middle, blind drivers were bigger. You could put traction tires on the rear drivers of that locomotive without any machining and still get all the wheels on the rails at the same time. Even if the locomotive you're dealing with isn't a 2026, its wheels or entire motor may be interchangeable with the 2026's.

I would try adding weight first.

[iguanaman3]

The CTT article recommended glueing the tires on with super glue after cleaning the wheel with alcohol. On steamers you would do the 2 rear wheels. I haven't tried it though.

Neil

[spankybird]

I believe our own Ben10ben once offered the idea of adding masking tape on the wheels to impove the traction. The tape is thin enough not to raise the engine too much and addeds the need traction.

Just trim the tape to the width of the wheel. let us know how it works.[;)]

tom

[Buckeye Riveter]

Tom, the 3M Company makes so many varieties of tape that I bet one of their products would be perfect.

[Anonymous]

Since real trains use sand to increase traction and decrease breaking, I wonder if we could do the same. If you attached a fine grit sandpaper to two wheels wouldn't it both add traction and clean the track?

I probably won't try, but it's something to ponder.

[brianel027]

Well gang, I have mentioned the idea several times in the past of using either 3M Traction Tape or a good quality electrical tape for traction tires on locomotive wheels that are not grooved. You will still have some slippage (on a steam engine this is nice) but it does improve traction. I know, I've done it for years now, but I do this with locos with AC open frame motors.

I've done some extensive experimenting with traction tires on locos with truck mounted Mabuchi DC can motors. For starters, these motors can be very inconsistant in operating speed even at the exact same voltage. I removed the trucks with motors, wired them to themselves, and put a bunch on the track with straight DC current and watched what happed. Speed can vary greatly.

I have removed traction tired on some locos entirely, like with my Lionel Industrial Switchers. Since the circuit boards have been pulled from them, I had room to add a great deal more weight. I called Lionel and spoke to a tech no longer there and he told me the can motor in the Industrial Switcher is the same identical model used in many steam engines with die-cast shells, so I figured the Ind. Switcher could handle the extra weight. And they pull like champs now.... they will now pull 15 cars with die cast trucks, though that's pushing the motor and I don't normally operate like that.

On the other hand, I have pulled traction tires off K-Line S-2's to find they needed them back on. Although some run better with a traction tire on each motorized truck and some don't. K-Line has made their locos with the grooved wheels in every possible combination. I have found (as Lionel MPC figured out) that the traction tires seem to work best (esp. on dual motored locos) if they are on the same side of the locomotive, regardless of whether they are on both trucks or not.

I've also experiemented with altering dual motored locos into single motored ones. Again, some very inconsistant results. It certain does reduce pulling power, though it can reduce some of the "growl" noise the locos inheritantly make. My K-Line Budd Car for example, was altered to be a single motor unit so I could motorize one of the dummy units for my nephew's layout. You don't pull long trains with Budd Cars anyways. Though after I weighted my nephew's Budd car, it'll pull 6-10 cars depending on the weight of the cars and how many have roller pick ups (increased drag).

Part of the problem I have found with the recent lower end Lionel single truck mounted can motored engines is that they have very little additional weight. The plastic frame of the RS-3 makes matters worse. These engines do pull poorly as is out of the box and need either the second motor or some added weight.

Boy did I get going there. Anyways, try cutting a good brand of electrical tape on a clean piece of glass with a metal straight edge and razor blade. You can overlap the tape a little... it doesn't make that much of a difference.

[Anonymous]

Back in 1948 I received my first Lionel, a single motored non-Magnetraction 2332 GG1. Needless to say I was not very satisfied with its pulling power, especially with the 30%+ grades I used.

I somehow got the idea to put standard masking tape on all the wheels of the power truck, since I still had 14 wheels for ground pickup.

The tape would last about a month with a lot of running taking place. It would get very gummy and black in color from all the oil on the rails.

That engine would climb a 45 degree grade easily and would snap the cars apart with its instant acceleration!

Thos were the days!

Tony

[martinden]

I've used tape on a 2056 steamer for years. (This is the 1952 non-magnetraction version of the 2046/646). The engine struggles somewhat to handle four postwar aluminum coaches; with tape on one wheel, it's not a problem.

I've got masking tape on it now, but plastic tape (3M or whatever) works a little better. I have not had good luck with electrical tape -- it seems to stretch, and something about the adhesive allows the tape to shift more than the other kinds. I'd avoid it.

First, clean the wheel tread with mineral spirits or rubbing alcohol (not as good, but OK). Cut the tape to about the width of the tread and long enough to overlap a little (maybe 1/4 inch?) when it goes around the wheel. The tape seems to stick better to itself, and thus lasts longer. Possibly other people might be more sensitive, but I've never noticed bumping or roughness from the overlapped tape.

Put the tape on one or both back wheels. One wheel gives me enough traction; I'd guesstimate something like a 40-50 percent increase with tape on one wheel. Two wheels gives a little more.

In my experience the tape lasts quite a while. Hard to even guess number of hours. I have a number of engines, so I don't run the 2056 all the time, and I have temporary layouts (extended holiday set-ups lasting several months, plus sometimes an interim layout for several months between holiday layouts), but I don't have to replace the tape every year, so I don't consider lifespan to be much of an issue.

In general, it seems to me that there's nothing critical about any of this -- width, overlap, kind of tape, and so forth. Trying it is not a big deal -- the tape is cheap, and it's easy to remove if it doesn't suit you. (Unlike machining a groove into a wheel, etc., etc.!)

[yellowducky]

I still go for a dab of Wahl hair clipper oil on the track.