Oldest 3-rail companies still extant?

[FJ and G]

My guess would be Lionel. But I don't know which of the other toy train companies is next oldest. Can't be Marx anymore because the Marx name no longer exists. My guess (in order--want to keep it to locomotive makers):

Lionel 1902?
Williams 1965?
Weaver
K-Line
MTH
3rd Rail
Atlas

There's also a European maker I can't recall the name. May have left one out?

[jimhaleyscomet]

Hasn't the Marx train name been purchased by someone who now makes reproductions? I know it is not the same Marx company, but Lionel is not the same company it once was either.

Jim H

[1688torpedo]

Hello Dave ! You may be thinking about Marklin in Germany. The oldest American Company would be Carlisle & Finch of Cincinatti, Oh. Even though they no longer manufacture toy trains they preceded Lionel by about Ten Years and are still in business today...................Keith

[FJ and G]

torpedo,

Completely forgot about Marklin, which in fact makes 3-rail trains in HO that are outstanding!

[Dave Farquhar]

The Lionel of today isn't the Lionel that started in 1900. Lionel Corporation stopped making trains in 1969, became a toy store company that had a moderately successful run for about a quarter centurty, and went under in the early 1990s. Lionel trains progressed from MPC in 1969 to LTI in 1985-86 and then to Lionel, LLC in the early '90s. So I have a hard time calling Lionel an old company.

Marx went under in 1978 or so. It's been revived several times but it's a shell of its former glory. Marx Trains has changed hands twice and Marx Toys has changed hands more than that.

As far as the oldest U.S. O gauge manufacturer today, it's probably either Williams or Atlas. I don't know when Atlas started; Williams started in 1969 or 1970 if I recall correctly. K-Line started in the mid 1980s when Lionel was just emerging from the MPC era.

Marklin is the granddaddy of them all, having started up its line of trains in 1891, and it wasn't a new company even then. Marklin was a maker of dollhouse accessories that was looking to expand and wanted something for boys that could be bought and then accessorized year after year like a dollhouse. Train layouts were what they came up with.

[palallin]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Dave Farquhar

The Lionel of today isn't the Lionel that started in 1900. . . . . So I have a hard time calling Lionel an old company.

Then very few companies are "old": Few businesses--especially non-private comapnies--resemble themselves of twenty years ago, much less 105. A business is a name, and how many other names from 105 years ago are still around at all?

As an aside, though C & F did early work in 3-rail, the trains for which they are best known today were 2-rail. . . .

[IRONROOSTER]

American Flyer pre WWII was O gauge. The name is still in use even though it's now S gauge and 2 rail, of course Lionel isn't the original company anymore either.

What about Hornby, don't know if they still make O gauge but the name is still around.

Enjoy
Paul

[Dave Farquhar]

QUOTE: Originally posted by palallin
Then very few companies are "old": Few businesses--especially non-private comapnies--resemble themselves of twenty years ago, much less 105. A business is a name, and how many other names from 105 years ago are still around at all?

You're right. Brand names that have lasted 100 years or more are indeed rare. Companies that have lasted that long are even more rare. But there is a distinction.

Many old companies have changed their lines of business, sometimes substantially--IBM is a good example--but there's an uninterrupted line of succession and ownership that Lionel doesn't have. J. L. Cowen's company existed in parallel with the Lionel division of MPC and then with LTI.

Lionel is a very old brand, but Lionel, LLC is a relatively young company, whether you start counting its lifetime at the point Richard Kughn bought the Lionel product line from General Mills or at the time Kughn sold controlling interest in the company and Wellspring took over its management.

[Chris F]

Here's what my resource books have listed:

1915 - Lionel introduced O-gauge trains.
1918 - American Flyer introduced O-gauge trains.
1972 - Wiliams Reproductions started reproductions of Lionel Standard Gauge trains.
1980 - Weaver Models produced first O-gauge models (2-rail?).
1983 - Williams Reproductions concentrated on O-gauge; sold Standard Gauge tooling to Mike Wolf.
1985 - MDK (K-Line) started production of O-gauge trains using dies obtained from Marx.
1993 - MTH started O-gauge product line.
1994 - The original Lionel Corporation dissolved after bankruptcy.
1997 - Atlas started producing O-gauge trains and track.

[Anonymous]

Marklin of Germany is the oldest. Founded in 1891.
Lionel, 1902
The Edmond-Metzel maufacturing Co., founded 1907, renamed itself in 1919 to become the American Flyer Co. introduced their line of electric trains the same year.
Louis Marx Co., founded in 1919. First Trains produced in 1938.

[IRONROOSTER]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Chris F

Here's what my resource books have listed:

1915 - Lionel introduced O-gauge trains.
1918 - American Flyer introduced O-gauge trains.
1972 - Wiliams Reproductions started reproductions of Lionel Standard Gauge trains.
1980 - Weaver Models produced first O-gauge models (2-rail?).
1983 - Williams Reproductions concentrated on O-gauge; sold Standard Gauge tooling to Mike Wolf.
1985 - MDK (K-Line) started production of O-gauge trains using dies obtained from Marx.
1993 - MTH started O-gauge product line.
1994 - The original Lionel Corporation dissolved after bankruptcy.
1997 - Atlas started producing O-gauge trains and track.

Atlas also produced some track, engines, and cars in the 70's. The engines and track were 2 rail, but the cars were advertised as being able to also run on O27 track and couple to Lionel.
Enjoy
Paul