Just Out of Curiosity

[brianel027]

Well Mike, that gang at OGR is a very devoted group of die hard train guys. Nothing wrong with that either. The demographic of this hobby is well known: older men who tend to be a little wealthier and have the time to devote to not only the trains, but talking about them. Hence the emphasis on the scale end of the hobby on OGR... it's an accurate reflection of what this demographic of the hobby is interested in.

I think the group that frequents here is a little more diversified (just my guess) and not as entirely into the scale end of the hobby (my observation from posting here for the past year). There's absolutely nothing wrong with any aspect of the hobby. But as an 027 traditional-size non-digital control operator, I just feel more comforatable here.

As Pastor Dave at my church says (in so many words) "If you don't like what you are getting out of this church, there's nothing stopping you from looking for another. But if you like what you see here, know that you are welcome."

That's a pretty darn good philosphy for the hobby too. For example, I don't buy MTH products. But for no other real reason than A) they are too big and B) I don't locomotives with extra electronics. BUT I'm still glad MTH is around. If they'd make some smaller stuff and make some locos with just the motors and maybe a horn, I'd take a good look. Until that day though, I look elsewhere.

So it is with the train forums too. For me, there's no name calling and no right or wrong... just what feels right for me. What feels right for someone else maybe an entirely different story.

[lionelsuperotrack]

Hello - If OGR has 5000 members (listed on their site) why would you suggest CTT's site is not as polulated? If anything would think it would be more....larger circulation, more diverse format, etc......

Best, Mike

QUOTE: Originally posted by Ogaugeoverlord

Big Boy, couldn't really tell you how many of our subscribers post here - my impression is that it isn't a lot - however, from our last web survey, of those responding, 93% were subscribers, of the 7% who didn't subscribe, 50% bought tha magazine at a hobby shop, news stand, or book store; while 41% apparently didn't subscribe or buy the magazine. Go figure on that one.

[Big_Boy_4005]

Thanks Bob, interesting numbers.

[Bob Keller]

Big Boy, couldn't really tell you how many of our subscribers post here - my impression is that it isn't a lot - however, from our last web survey, of those responding, 93% were subscribers, of the 7% who didn't subscribe, 50% bought tha magazine at a hobby shop, news stand, or book store; while 41% apparently didn't subscribe or buy the magazine. Go figure on that one.

[Anonymous]

I think this ia A David & Goliath situation, OGR has it's focus on one specific area Detail & fine scale modelling in O. This forum is connected to all aspects of the train hobby & train Industry. If you go back 10 years & look at the published layouts you would have to have a lot of dough to even think of building them. Now a simple & realistic 4 X 8 layout or a small Christmas display can be a centrefold. Shows you why competition is good & how lucky We are to have the choice's we have to share in the wealth of information from the World's greatest hobby & the World's greatest people Steve (north of the 49)

[Big_Boy_4005]

OK, I'm shocked!!! I did a little digging and found out that 198 members registered today (Saturday) alone. Of those 198 new members, 6 of them made a post. At least one of those posts was on CTT.

Also, in the last month, system wide, over 2300 different people made at least one post.

[Big_Boy_4005]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Ogaugeoverlord

The number we find of use is the number who have signed up for the toy trains e-mail newsletter, but since I don't have anything to do with the newsletter, I couldn't tell you what that number is. I'll ask Erik Monday.

I hadn't thought of that as a measuring tool Bob. By that standard I am 3 people.[swg] Well, not really, I'm just part of 3 seperate counts.

I suppose there are a fair number of people who sign up for the newsletters and never post. Conversely, there are some who don't sign up for newsletters, but do post. I suspect that the nonposting newsletter recipiants are the larger of the two groups. The two groups cancel each other out in the count, but the result is still pretty accurate and fair. It's what you have to work with.

As long as we are talking numbers, if it's not too much to ask, what percentage of subscribers participate online? I'm thinking it is pretty small. 25% ?

[Bob Keller]

The number we find of use is the number who have signed up for the toy trains e-mail newsletter, but since I don't have anything to do with the newsletter, I couldn't tell you what that number is. I'll ask Erik Monday.

[Roger Bielen]

I too am a member of both forums but find that I spend the most time over here and just do a quick browse of OGR. I think what has turned me off on OGR's forum is the constant bickering over which brand is better and the personal "attacks". Here it seems is where the "real" people hang out, those who enjoy the hobby for the "toys" and are not extreme rivit counters. It's a more hanging around the hobby shop crowd.

[lionelsuperotrack]

Brian - Most eloquently put. I see your point and understand your view point. I do go to York but my children are grown and out of the house. It is just wife, Charley (our English Springer Spaniel) and me. We have that extra disposable to spend.

That all being said my interest still runs toward the unusual.

Very best, Mike

QUOTE: Originally posted by brianel027

Mike, I too am registered over at OGR. I have no bone to pick with them and do once in a while go over and read. But the main emphasis over there is very obviously on the recent full-scale direction of the hobby. Sure, there are some traditional guys who post there as well as some 027 guys. BUT the main emphasis on any given day is towards the more expensive scale side of the hobby - a side of the hobby I cannot afford and therefore don't have as much interest in.

Keep in mind, as Big Boy said - numbers are deceiving. Folks with families, kids, other obligations may not have the time (or interest) in posting as much as some of us folks do. Bear in mind too, there is an HO scale forum here, and HO scale dominates the train hobby world in both numbers or modelers and sales. The 3-rail hobby is a drop in the bucket compared to HO.

Or to put the numbers in another spin, the vast majority of 3-rail modelers I personally know are traditional sized modelers who do not post regularly on either forum, run with 027 or tubular 0 track, will never spend more than $300 for an engine (absolute tops - and it has to be something they REALLY want!) and run without TMCC or DCS. Yet, by looking at the catalogs and forums, my numbers are utterly upside down.

Think of it another way (as far as numbers go): Do the majority of 3-rail modelers attend the YORK show (this is not an attack on YORK folks) even once a year, nevermind twice a year? The importers all say they go to YORK and listen and take notes over what train buyers want. Which means a possible minority of the 3-rail hobby are influencing what gets made.... but it is a probably minority that can obviously afford to spend the money... and money talks.

Putting the numbers another way: both Lionel and MTH in the recent past have said they have had very strong starter set sales and sales of starter set related items and locos. Yet what is the vast majority of newly tooled product coming out? Not starter set stuff... one might think if sales are so strong in this area, maybe it might be time for a modern less-than-scale proportioned equal to the old Alco FA once included in so many starter sets?

I guess I suffices to say, numbers are not everything (except to accountants [:D] ).

[Anonymous]

The OGR forum is extremely moderated and censored to the point of absurdity. If you read a thread at 4 PM today, there's a good chance you won't find it at 5PM. It's OGR's forum and they obviously can do as they wish, but I can tell you that their management of the forum has offended many people. It use to be the "go to" forum for O gauge information and discussion but it's not anymore. The CTT and MTJ forums are lot more user friendly and reasonable with regards to moderation. I also agree with brianelO27 about OGR being much more hi-rail oriented. I think that's the way they want it.

[brianel027]

Mike, I too am registered over at OGR. I have no bone to pick with them and do once in a while go over and read. But the main emphasis over there is very obviously on the recent full-scale direction of the hobby. Sure, there are some traditional guys who post there as well as some 027 guys. BUT the main emphasis on any given day is towards the more expensive scale side of the hobby - a side of the hobby I cannot afford and therefore don't have as much interest in.

Keep in mind, as Big Boy said - numbers are deceiving. Folks with families, kids, other obligations may not have the time (or interest) in posting as much as some of us folks do. Bear in mind too, there is an HO scale forum here, and HO scale dominates the train hobby world in both numbers or modelers and sales. The 3-rail hobby is a drop in the bucket compared to HO.

Or to put the numbers in another spin, the vast majority of 3-rail modelers I personally know are traditional sized modelers who do not post regularly on either forum, run with 027 or tubular 0 track, will never spend more than $300 for an engine (absolute tops - and it has to be something they REALLY want!) and run without TMCC or DCS. Yet, by looking at the catalogs and forums, my numbers are utterly upside down.

Think of it another way (as far as numbers go): Do the majority of 3-rail modelers attend the YORK show (this is not an attack on YORK folks) even once a year, nevermind twice a year? The importers all say they go to YORK and listen and take notes over what train buyers want. Which means a possible minority of the 3-rail hobby are influencing what gets made.... but it is a probably minority that can obviously afford to spend the money... and money talks.

Putting the numbers another way: both Lionel and MTH in the recent past have said they have had very strong starter set sales and sales of starter set related items and locos. Yet what is the vast majority of newly tooled product coming out? Not starter set stuff... one might think if sales are so strong in this area, maybe it might be time for a modern less-than-scale proportioned equal to the old Alco FA once included in so many starter sets?

I guess I suffices to say, numbers are not everything (except to accountants [:D] ).

[Big_Boy_4005]

Mike, I think that is a big part of it. I have subscriptions to 3 of the 5 publications represented here, which is a clear indication of my broader interest in trains.

I'm not particularly fond of the software being used on the OGR forum, or the way it is organized. It has a different feel, like shopping in a different grocery store.

I actually spend more time on the MR forum here, even though I do 3 rail O exclusively. There are also issues of personality clashes, and moderation policies, which I perfer not to discuss further, as they are only a source of trouble and bad feelings.

Trains.com is my one stop forum shop. I don't do any others anymore. That's just me.[:)]

[lionelsuperotrack]

What don't you like about the OGR forum? Is the scale to limiting for your interests?

Very best, Mike

QUOTE: Originally posted by Big_Boy_4005

To expand on what Doug has said, the 175,000 figure is deceptively large. It includes a large number of of people who never post a single word, people who have no interest in toy trains, people with double or more identities, and so on.

The active unique members for THIS forum in any given month is probably less than 500, and many of them are members of the other forum. The core group of regulars is under 200.

As for the OGR forum, I am a registered member, but I don't go there anymore. Keep in mind that OGR only repersents people in O scale. Trains.com includes all scales, and prototype, and represents 5 publications. Apples and oranges if you ask me.

P.S. Members are not sorted by interest here, they are all equal and lumped together. My figures are an educated guess based on experience.

[IRONROOSTER]

Also, each person can read and/or respond to more than one forum here. I have read and responded to all of the forums here.

Checking the member list, 983 have posted one or more times in the last week (Sun 31 JAN - Sat 5 Feb:1507EST). That covers all forums. Don't have anyway of knowing how many read without posting.

Enjoy
Paul

[Big_Boy_4005]

To expand on what Doug has said, the 175,000 figure is deceptively large. It includes a large number of of people who never post a single word, people who have no interest in toy trains, people with double or more identities, and so on.

The active unique members for THIS forum in any given month is probably less than 500, and many of them are members of the other forum. The core group of regulars is under 200.

As for the OGR forum, I am a registered member, but I don't go there anymore. Keep in mind that OGR only repersents people in O scale. Trains.com includes all scales, and prototype, and represents 5 publications. Apples and oranges if you ask me.

P.S. Members are not sorted by interest here, they are all equal and lumped together. My figures are an educated guess based on experience.

[cnw1995]

There's a heck of a difference between registered users and 'regular' users - for example, there are only 3 people browsing this now - on OGR, it's more like 30...not that OGR is more popular, just different - it is not one section of a larger whole, I too would be curious about how many CTT registrants there are - I don't think the login is sorted that way - though you can express a preference for scale. In other words, your registration here lets you go everywhere, not just the CTT forum. BTW, I love the mini-videos of the trains that have been reviewed.

[lionelsuperotrack]

QUOTE: Originally posted by eZAK

Here is a guess;

175,000 members divided by 6 forums = 29,166

Hopefully the CTT moderator will post the exact number. I would think in the 3500 registered user range.

Mike

[eZAK]

OR, As it says at the bottom of the main page.....

*3*

[eZAK]

Here is a guess;

175,000 members divided by 6 forums = 29,166

[lionelsuperotrack]

OGR shows they have 5000 registered members in their on-line site. CTT shows over 175,000 members within their multitude of on-line forums. Is there any way to find out how many are a member of this (Toy train operating and collecting) forum? Just out of curiosity.

Very best, Mike

The History of Lionel "Super O" Track
( http://www.tcamembers.org/articles/operating/supero/index.html )

Lionel_SuperO_Track Yahoo Group
( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Lionel_SuperO_Track/ )