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Power Cord Repair

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  • Member since
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Power Cord Repair
Posted by Mike C. on Monday, September 3, 2018 5:29 PM
I am in the process of repairing the power cord on this transformer. Basically I am cutting out the damaged section of the old cord from the plug end to within about 4 inches of the connections on the transformer. The existing original wall plug and cord is the old style non polarized type. The two internal conducting wires inside the cord are not color coded. Both of them are black with ribs, so I cannot determine which is hot and which is neutral, or if it even matters.
I bought at Lowes Hardware Store a power cord with the newer conventional white, black, and green conducting wires inside the cord. Does it matter which white and black wire goes to the appropriate wire on the transformer?
Thanks very much for the help!
Mike
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Posted by Sturgeon-Phish on Tuesday, September 4, 2018 11:06 AM

 

I don't think it would matter, but for the time when you would mix this transformer with another you would need to match the polarity of the other non-polarized plug to this transformer.  If you could find a non-polarized plug it would be better.  Also, when replacing cords if you take the new leads and solder them internally where the existing cord attaches it would make a better repair in my opinion.

 

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Posted by cwburfle on Tuesday, September 4, 2018 11:31 AM

If there is a green wire, then it sounds like you got a three wire cord set with a grounded plug. Do yourself a favor and get the correct cord set: Two wire, unpolarized.

It also sounds like you are planning to splice the new cord onto the old one. That is something I would never do.

What brand/model transformer?

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Posted by rtraincollector on Tuesday, September 4, 2018 12:08 PM

Like other have said, Do the whole cord. Also I don't use, I find better cords at big top stores but some just buy one of those $2 or less exstention cords with the 3 outlet at the end and cut the end off and use that. Even family carries these. 

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Posted by TrainLarry on Tuesday, September 4, 2018 1:11 PM

Use a proper cord. Do not endanger yourself or others with a spliced cord.

Here is a supplier of Lionel transformer cord replacements.

 

Larry

 

 

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Posted by BigAl 956 on Wednesday, September 5, 2018 11:30 AM

Mike C.
I am cutting out the damaged section of the old cord from the plug end to within about 4 inches of the connections

First, that is a bad idea. Replace the entire power cord. Do not try and splice in a section.

Second, all line cords, even from that era, were marked. One lead in the original cord was ribbed or otherwise marked with a raised ridge. Today that translates into the ground or wider plug on a polarized plug.

Messing with transformers can have disaterous consequenses. If you do not feel you can dissasemble the transformer to properly solder in the correct replacement cord you should have a pro do it.

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Posted by TrainLarry on Thursday, September 6, 2018 10:54 PM

With the older postwar transformers, there is no hot or neutral, so that the new wire can be soldered in any way.

 

Larry

 

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Posted by Choo Choo Charlie 001 on Friday, September 7, 2018 7:26 PM

The new two wire plugs probably have a fater blade for the white common and thinner blade for the black hot.  If you use set a plug you will not be able to phase the transformer with another transformer.  To phase with another transformer you may have to file the fat blade to allow turning the plug to go in either hole of the socket or wall outlet.

Charlie

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Posted by NNJRailfan on Wednesday, September 26, 2018 12:15 PM

Basic question:  assuming "in phase" means both transformers would alternate the current in same direction through each transformer, what would happen if they were not in phase and both transformers were used simultaneously?  Would they short out the transformers, just weaken the current or something else?

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Posted by lionelsoni on Wednesday, September 26, 2018 1:48 PM

I would take "in phase" to mean that the voltage put out by one transformer (relative to the common terminal) has the same polarity as the voltage from the other transformer, that is, that they are both positive at the same time, and both negative at the same time.

Having the outputs in phase makes the voltage between them equal to the difference between the two.  Having them out of phase makes the voltage between them be their sum.

"In phase" is good for running trains if there is any possibility of a train's accidentally connecting the two voltages together when crossing between separately powered blocks.  "Out of phase" is good otherwise, because the currents in the common tend to cancel each other and reduce the voltage drop.

Bob Nelson

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Posted by NNJRailfan on Thursday, September 27, 2018 8:40 AM

Can you please provide an example of a setup where it would by to your advantage to use two out-of-phase transformers?

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Posted by lionelsoni on Thursday, September 27, 2018 10:54 AM

 

Sure--one transformer powering the track and the other powering accessories, with the two transformers' commons connected together.

It is particularly advantageous (both electrically and construction-wise) for the various accessories to make the common connection to the closest outside rail, rather than a "home run" to a point closer to the transformers, to get the longest voltage-drop cancellation.

This situation is the same as the power wiring to American houses.  There are three wires--white, which is the grounded common, and red and black, which are each 120 volts, but out of phase.  Because all the return currents from loads powered from the red and black wires combine in the white wire, the red and black currents cancel each other.  So, in the worst case, the white wire needs to carry no more current than the other two.  In the best case, the currents cancel completely, causing no voltage drop at all in the white wire.

If the red and black wires were in phase, the return currents would add together and, in the worst case, amount to double the red and black currents.  This would require a white wire with 2.5 times the metal of the red and black wires and would about double the voltage drop.

Bob Nelson

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Posted by Michael6268 on Thursday, September 27, 2018 1:41 PM

Not sure how electrical Savvy he is, but you might have lost him with the 240 volt analogy as most people are more familiar with 120 volt household wiring which makes up the majority of their circuits. 

 

 Basically when in phase,  the worst case scenario could be you're doubling or more,  the current out through the common. Out of phase, you're evening it out. You of course can't do this when it comes to the track wiring unless you're certain your locomotives aren't going to enter another track phased differently.

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Posted by lionelsoni on Thursday, September 27, 2018 6:10 PM

True, but there are layouts with independent loops, that can be advantageously powered out of phase.

I once worked with an engineer who was educated in India.  He thought that the different voltage and frequency in the US were the whole story and that I was putting him on about out-of-phase outlets.  I had to take him outside and show him the transformer on the pole with 2 wires in and 3 wires out.

Bob Nelson

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