FM TRAINMASTERS

[G BEAR]

Hello everybody,

Years ago I had one or two Williams FM TrainMaster Diesel Locomotives.  They are now with a good friend.  I really love these Williams diesel locomotives.  I'm looking at getting the Southern Pacific, Reading and the Norfolk & Western TrainMaster from Williams.  I know that the Southern Pacific ran their TrainMasters in passenger service from San Jose to San Francisco well into the 1970s.  My question is this - Did the Reading and the Norfolk & Western ever use their TrainMasters in passenger service and if so how were they used, for just commuter service or for longer distances.  Thanks for any and all feedback. 

G BEAR

God Bless

[sir james I]

I have seen pics of the Reading with passenger cars but don't know if the N & W used them for passenger service.

[Firelock76]

I hit the archives here at the Fortress Firelock to try and find an answer to your questions, so here it goes.

Yes, the Reading did use Trainmasters on passenger trains. I found a picture of a Reading Trainmaster on the point of the "King Coal" in Shamokin PA in 1956.  I don't know much about the "King Coal" but with a name like that it doesn't sound like a commuter run, sounds like a passenger train that covered a respectable distance.  If Reading used them on name trains it's probably safe to assume they used them on commuter runs.  "Never say never" is my motto.

On Norfolk and Western passenger runs, probably not.  The N&W got their FM's when they purchased the Virginian Railway.  The Virginian FM's were built as freight haulers, not passenger units.  The N&W used GP9's as passenger locomotives, but again, I'd never say never.  Anyway, it's YOUR layout, do what you like!

Now I've got a "bad-news, good-news" situation.  The bad news is Williams isn't producing FM Trainmasters anymore!  The good news, "Trainworld" (www.trainworld.com) is showing Trainmasters in inventory both in Reading and N&W markings, so all isn't lost yet, but I wouldn't delay.  Once they're gone, they're gone.  Check the website.

[rtraincollector]

G bear if Southern in black would do you I have power and dummy basicly test run only if you would like contact me at [e-mail] and put trains or something like that in the subject. 

[G BEAR]

Hello James (sir james l)

Thank you for taking the time to reply to my question.  I had the Williams READING trainmaster, wishing I had kept it.  Thank You.  

G BEAR

God Bless

[G BEAR]

Hello Firelock76

Thank you also for taking the time to reply to my question.  I'll be getting the READING and the N&W along with the SP in Sept. & Oct. from trainworld.   Western Depot also has the Williams TrainMasters on their website.  I'm also going to check with my friend to see if I can get the TrainMaster(s) back from him, doesn't hurt to ask.  Thank you.  

G BEAR

God Bless

 

[G BEAR]

Hello rtraincollector

I'll send you an e-mail.  Thank you.  

G BEAR

God Bless

[Firelock76]

You're very welcome G Bear!

[lionelsoni]

Eight of the Reading's 17 units had steam generators; none of the Virginian's 25 units did.

[G BEAR]

Hello Bob

Thank you for sharing the information on the Reading and the Virginian's Trainmasters.  

G BEAR

God Bless

[Firelock76]

One last thing G Bear.  I assume you asked the questions you did concerning Trainmasters as you want to stay as prototypical as possible on your layout?

I just remembered something, for prototypical operation of Trainmasters run them short hood forward.  Back in the old days that's how road crews preferred to run them, the OP engines were very "fumey" and those diesel exhaust fumes would drift into the cabs nauseating the crews if they were run long hood forward.

Certainly there are photos of Trainmasters running long hood forward but that's not how the crews ran them if they could avoid it.

[robmcc]

That's correct. Although as you said, there were some exceptions especially with Southern and N&W. They both preferred to run everything long hood forward for years, long after most railways adapted the short hood forward operation. To this day, I wouldn't be surprised if I saw a NS ES44 running long hood forward!! :D

[lionelsoni]

Southern Train Masters were designed to run short-hood forward.

I wouldn't think that the crews would have any choice of direction, since the railroad specified the controls with they ordered the locomotive from Fairbanks-Morse.

[G BEAR]

Firelock76, robmcc & lionelsoni

Thanks to each of you for the additional information.  I have found some MTH Premier 70' Madison Passenger cars on their website for the Reading RR.  They would look really nice behind a Williams Reading FM TrainMaster.    I'll have to increase the size of my carpet layout, going from 0-36" curve size to either 0-48" or 0-60" curve size.  

G BEAR

God Bless

[robmcc]

Well just to throw another curveball (I've got the ball game on in the background), some Trainmasters were initially ordered long hood forward and later converted to short hood forward operation. For instance, Canadian Pacific's Trainmasters were like that. I have photos of the same unit as delivered with the' F' marking on the long hood and a few years later the 'F' marking on the short hood. In fact, CP had 4 units for passenger service with a full width short hood to house the steam generator. They had to run those units long hood forward. As Firelock said, I'm sure the engineers were sick of being gassed, so they were converted. Lots of examples on railpictures.net of Trainmasters on various railroads running both ways. Either way, they were an awesome locomotive.

[lionelsoni]

You can still buy the engine:  http://www.fairbanksmorse.com/engines/opposed-piston-model-38/

[Firelock76]

lionelsoni

You can still buy the engine:  http://www.fairbanksmorse.com/engines/opposed-piston-model-38/

 

Oh, it's not that the FM opposed piston engines weren't any good, they were, they just weren't very good for railroad use for a variety of reasons.  In addition to nauseated head end crews shop crews hated the opposed-piston engine as well.  It was a pain in the neck to work on. 

An awesome locomotive just the same.  Thing is, Lionel, MTH, and Williams have had a lot more success with it than Fairbanks-Morse ever did!

[G BEAR]

Southern Pacific had one advantage regarding the TrainMaster locomotives.  Those locomotives that were assigned to the S.F. Bay area for the commute pool had a good deal in that there were plenty of Navy-trained OP mechanics in the Bay Area, due to the proliferation of naval facilities in the area.  The OP engine used, was originally developed for the US Navy, for its diesel-electric submarines. 

I got this info. off of the following website:  espee.railfan.net/sph24-66.html 

G BEAR

God Bless

 

[Firelock76]

G Bear, you got me thinking.  I can't prove this, but I wouldn't be surprised if the railroads rapid shift from steam to diesel in the post World War Two era was helped mightily by all those discharged diesel mechanics, trained courtesy of Uncle Sam.

A ready-made work force, all set to go.

[G BEAR]

Firelock76

G Bear, you got me thinking.  I can't prove this, but I wouldn't be surprised if the railroads rapid shift from steam to diesel in the post World War Two era was helped mightily by all those discharged diesel mechanics, trained courtesy of Uncle Sam.

A ready-made work force, all set to go.

 

Firelock76, We had two Home members and their wives living in our building who served in World War 2.  After they left the military they went to work on the railroads.  Your point makes perfect sense, they had the skill set and it would be an easy transition.  

G BEAR

God Bless