wiring the 145 Gateman

[Anonymous]

I would like to know how to wire the Lionel 145 Gateman to the accessory side of the
CW-80 transformer using the Lionel FasTrack Activator Pack while keeping the whistle
button to sound the whistle.

Inner track is no.1 no breaks.

Middle track is track no.2

Outer track is track no. 3 has the breaks (insulated).

Gateman common terminal is terminal no. 1

Gateman solenoid terminal is terminal no. 2

Transformer track ?A? terminal goes to?

Transformer track ?U? terminal goes to?

Transformer access ?B? terminal goes to?

Transformer access ?U? terminal goes to?

Insulated (between the breaks) track section goes to?

[Big_Boy_4005]

[#welcome] to the forum.

Insulated rail connects to gateman solenoid.

Gateman common goes to power source on transformer. 12 - 14 Volts would be best.

Remaining wire on gateman goes to ground, for light. Outer rail or transformer ground are the same, which ever is easier.

[Anonymous]

Sorry big boy that didn't work.

[Big_Boy_4005]

Hmmm, that usually works. Let's back up a little.

Do you have the center rail of the track connected to A on the transformer?

U should be common ground to both A and B, and should go to the outside rails on the track. The special insulated track section is going to be the on off switch for the coil, and it needs to have U as it's source. When the train comes by, the wheels form a bridge bringing the ground connection to the insulated section.

This is why the terminal on the gateman that feeds both the solenoid and the light needs power from B.

The remaining connection is for the light, and needs a source of common ground (U), which can be taken from the outside rail (which should already be connected to U), or run back to the U post on the transformer.

I hope this helps to get it working for you.

[Anonymous]

Here is how Lionel said to do it.
Track A to inside rail.
Accessory B to inside rail.
Track U to center rail.
Accessory U to common on Gateman.
Insulated track to the light terminal on Gateman with a jumper wire from there to the solenoid.
This does work but my bell button works the whistle ( because the ground is to the center rail.).
I was hoping to find a way to wire it so the whistle button works the whistle. Now when you let off of the bell button the whistle stays on for a few seconds before going off.

[Big_Boy_4005]

Perhaps the problem is that I am not familar with the CW-80 transformer. In the days of the ZW the U post was the common, or so I thought. I recently discovered that some models of transformer have a different lettering scheme. All of this can make things very confusing.

So, Lionel says that A and B are the same, and track U and accessory U are the ones that are different. OK, that being the case, you should be able to tie A and B together at any point. Then, as you stated, track U should go to the center rail, and accessory U should go to the common on the gateman, as these are the two sources of power.

I'm not quite sure what you are calling the "inside rail". Track consists of 3 rails. The center rail carries the power. The other two rails are connected together electrically, in the case of Fastrack and regular O and 027, and are both commonly called "outside rails", regardless of orientation on the layout.

Let's just forget about the whistle and bell for a minute, and deal with the gateman. You want the light to stay on all the time, and the door to open when the train goes by, right?

Since we have determined that the voltage for the gateman is coming from accessory U, to make the circuit complete, we need to connect the light to a source of that common A B ground. You can take it from the transformer, or tap into the outside rail, it's all the same.

Finally, in order to complete the circuit for the solenoid, we need a source of that common A B ground. This time we want to use the insulated rail section. The fact that one outside rail is insulated from the other allows the wheels of the train to be the activator. The solenoid needs to be connected to the insulated outside rail.

The whistle and bell activators should have no connection to the gateman, and if you had them working correctly before trying to install the gateman, there should be no difference now.

You aren't trying to have the whistle blow automaticly are you? That is a stunt which may be able to be done, but complicates things greatly, and I am not the one to try to answer that.

[Anonymous]

Right now the light and the man only activates when the train enters the break (insulated section). A and B (power) are connected to the rail opposite the outside rail (the rail that has the break)
When the train enters the insulated section the wheels carry the voltage from the inside rail to the insulated rail (outside rail) between the breaks which is connected to the light/solenoid.
I am not trying to blow the whistle automaticly. I am just trying to get the whistle to blow when the whistle button is pushed.
I still believe the track A and accessory B are power and the U's are the ground. Its not a big deal and I really appreciate the help you have given me.
I have made a sketch in paint showing exactly how it is wired but I don't know how to put it in the forum.

[Big_Boy_4005]

It sounds like we are getting close here. I'm with you, that by definition, U should be the common ground, but we may have to take Lionel's word on this one.

You stated earlier that the wiring diagram showed a connection between the terminals on the gateman's light and solenoid. That clearly makes no sense to me because, if that was the case there would be no point in having seperate terminals for light and solenoid. No, they need seperate sources of ground. A source continuously on for the light, and switched via the insulated rail for the solenoid.

You are right, a picture is worth a thousand words. I can explain how to post them later. This should clear things up. Click on the image to enlarge it. Note, if you look under a piece of Fastrack, you will see a metal plate. That's the ground bridge.

I'll be back later, good luck.[:)]

[Anonymous]

All they did with the junper wire between the light term. and the solenoid term. was make the light and the man activate when the train is in the insulated section. The light is not on all the time.

[Anonymous]

Big--boy-4005,
I just tried your sketch. Result: The Gateman is working off of track power not accessory power when the train enters the insulated section. No light.

[Big_Boy_4005]

Maybe the trick is to try the gateman without the track, just make the connections to the transformer.

Connect accessory B to the common post on the gateman.

Take a lead from U, and touch it to the light, and it should light up. Now touch that same U lead to the solenoid, and the door should open.

Take a second lead from U, and make a connection to the light. Now the light should be on. The other lead from U, when touched to to the solenoid, should open the door, and not effect the light. That's it!!!

Ideally, we want the transformer ground to be on the outside rail. It sounds like we need to figure out the terminals on the transformer. Do you own a volt meter that can do low AC volts? The idea is to identify which terminals are the ground, and get that connected to the outside rail.

[Anonymous]

Although I'm pleased with the performance of my 2 CW-80's, I find the accompanying owner's manual lacking.

First off, on page 5 it states "attach one wire to lockon clip1 and connect to power terminal A" and "attach a secind wire to lockin clip 2 and connect to power terminal U". But, the figure below the text shows the wire from lockon clip 1 connected to the U post, and lockon clip 2 connected to the A post.

Furthermore, there are no instructions on how to connect the transformer with the use of insulated rails or the Fastrack Activator Pack to activate your gateman, semaphore, banjo signal, etc.

Through trial and error, here is what I found works for me in this scenario:
(NOTE: I'm using regular Lionel tubular track and am not familiar with Fastrack components)
a) attach wire from lockon clip 1 (center rail) to power terminal U, and attach a second wire from loclon clip 2 (outer rail) to power terminal A
b) attach wire from accesory terminal U to the gateman power clip
c) attach wire from outer rail of a NON-insulated track section to the light ; the gateman should now have constant lighting
d) attach wire from outer rail of insulated track to the gateman "action" clip; the light should stay on as the gateman pops out of his door as the train passes the insulated rail section

The accessory B transformer post does not connect to the track.

NOTE #2: by wiring the transformer in this manner, your "bell" button blows the whistle, and the "whistle" button sounds the bell. But this is the only combination of connections I've found that allows me to connect accessories using insulated rail sections as activators.

NOTE #3: I've found that the postwar 154 gateman, 252 crossing gate, and 151 sempahore are real power hogs and could cause your train to slow down or cause the transformer go into "fold-back mode" as the train passes over the insulated rail section, especially if you're running a lighted passenger train.

You might want to consider operating the gateman using a push button instead, while the train is not in motion. Just run a wire from the outer rail of a non-insulated track section to your pushbutton, and another wire from the pushbutton to the gateman activation clip. All other connections are exactly as described above, except for d).

One nice feature of the postwar 1033 transformer was that you could use the C post as a common accesory wire and use the B and C posts to operate your gateman light at 11v. and use A and C post for 16v to open the door.

I hope this helps and I haven't caused more confusion!

- Lou

[mcattardo]

In my limited experience, if the whislte & bell buttons are backwards, so is your wiring.

[Big_Boy_4005]

QUOTE: Originally posted by mcattardo

In my limited experience, if the whislte & bell buttons are backwards, so is your wiring.

[#welcome] to the forum. I would have to agree with with that assessment. It does sound like a simple polarity reversal.

Thanks for jumping in here Lou. From what you have said, it is pretty clear that the modern instructions are rather suspect. I desperately want Joncoy to get this thing to work, and I am getting a little frustrated, perhaps even more than he is.

By the way, when I was a kid, I couldn't wire the gateman either. It actually tested the limits of my father's talents, though he was a lawyer, and not very handy with things electrical. It ended up taking me a semester of electrical engineering to really grasp the concept.[;)]

[Anonymous]

Lou , Big Boy,
Thanks again for all of your efforts. I think I'll just live with the bell button blowing the whistle . Lionel said it won't hurt anything.
Anyone have an idea to get more smoke out of the 4-4-2 engine that came with my Winter Wonderland set?
Again thanks so much.

[Anonymous]

Believe me, I tried every possible combination to "correctly" connect the power terminals to the rails and still be able to use insulated rail sections to activate accesories, to no avail.

Anyway, Joncoy, did you achieve the desired results with my convoluted wiring scheme?

Just wonderin'.

Lou

[Anonymous]

Lou,
No it didn't work. The posting I made on Dec 05 at 00:55:54 is the way Lionel said to do it and it does work But the bell button blows the whistle.
Lionel had a time figuring it out also. I emailed them twice and what the said in the emails did not work either. I finally had to call them and thats when they faxed me a way to make it work. The did it with power where we were trying to do it with ground. Thanks again.