Need help with Christmas layout

[aross97]

As a lifeling Lionel enthusiast, at the age of 36, last winter I put together my first layout as an adult.  It's a "twice around the tree" with a 45 degree crossover and a completely isolated siding.  The whole layout is 5'x4'.  It is made up of a frame of 1"x1"s with two cross beams and a .75" plywood deck is screwed to the top of the frame.   The deck is covered in white batting.  The whole thing sits on the floor and the tree sits in its stand directly atop the deck.  I drilled horizontal holes in the crossbeams to run wiring underneath.  

I intend to expand this year, including two trunouts and additional operating accessories.  Everything worked well enough last year, through some trial and error, but I wanted to get some advice on the following:

• Sound deadening: hemosote vs. foam board vs. cork vs. Flexxbed.  What is the best method of sound deadening?  I used Woodland Scenics Track-Bed last year and it looked horrible under my tubular track and was buckled around the O-31 curves.  It also did a poor job of deadening the sound.
• Wiring: what is the best gauge to use for supplying power to the track vs. powering the accessories?  
• Smoke: The main motive power on my layout is a no. 2025 prarie.  Last year I used Mega-Steam brand fluid, but was unimpressed with the output.  I only used about half a dropper at a time.  Am I using too much, too little, or would another brand be more effective?

[tinplatacis]

1. Foam board

2. I use 24 gauge with mine, any that size or larger will work great.

3. Too much. Way too much.

[rtraincollector]

Actually 24 guage is on the thin side most in here recomend at least 18 but 14 is better. 

[tinplatacis]

Yeah, the 24 gauge was inherited. Didn't see a point in junking it since it worked.

[Penny Trains]

Can't help with sound deadening, I like mine LOUD!!!    I prefer to use 18 gauge wire for most applications.  However I find that 20 or 22 gauge works fine for lighting or accessories without motors.  MTH smoke fluid is pretty good but I still use the same bottle of Lionel fluid that came with my first set.

Becky

[ADCX Rob]

aross97

• Sound deadening: hemosote vs. foam board vs. cork vs. Flexxbed.  What is the best method of sound deadening?

For something like your layout, covered with white batting, I use cut-pile carpeting close to white in color.

This is all on carpeting:

[lionelsoni]

Use wire heavy enough to carry safely the greatest current that your transformer can put out.  That's 14 AWG for 15 amperes (Z, ZW), 16 AWG for 10 amperes (KW),  18 AWG for 8 amperes (V), 20 AWG for 5 amperes (1033). 

[aross97]

Thanks for the quick reply!  So to clarify:

• Foam board.  I'll attach that to the deck, cover it in "snow" and lay the track right on top.  No Track-Bed or cork necessary, correct?  I'm assuming I still have to go through the foam board with the track screws, or is the foam board solid enough to hold the tracks in place by themselves?
• Wire: 24 gauge for both track and accessories?  I tink last year I used 16 for the track and 18 or 20 for th accesories.  Any opinion on soild core vs. stranded?
• Smoke fluid: Understood, half a dropper is way too much. Wil only  use a few drops from here on out.

[aross97]

I have a ZW, so you'd recommend 14 gauge wire.  Standed or solid core?  For both powering the track and accessories?

[8ntruck]

Re. Smoke Fluid - 6 or 8 drops at a time work well for me.

[Andrew Falconer]

You would need an Expanded Bead Polstyrene sheet or an Extruded Polystyrene Foam Sheet that is about 1 to 1 1/2 inch thick to deaden the sound.

 

[Andrew Falconer]

24 gauge wire is for accessory activation wires.

Track power wire for a small track layout would be 18 gauge.

[Andrew Falconer]

You will have to slowly run the loco for 30 minutes to allow the smoke unit to heat up and start to vaporize the excessive smoke fluid.

[aross97]

I picked up a few 2'x2' foam panels that are an inch thick.  Will that hold the track?  I'm having trouble finding screws that are thin enough to go through the holes in the ties of my tubular track and long enough to go through the foam board and bite the wood deck without going all the way through...

[LOCO_GUY]

Rob,

This is my layout before I knew what a layout was :-)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXNmPdFju94

 

[ADCX Rob]

LOCO_GUY

Rob,

This is my layout before I knew what a layout was :-)

 

 

Looks good from here!

[Penny Trains]

Solid core is OK if the wires will be permanently mounted but stranded is better all the way around in my opinion.

[Firelock76]

For smoke fluid I prefer JT's Mega-Steam.  It comes in different "flavors", for lack of a better term, but I prefer the coffee scent.  It really does smell like coffee!

And Loco-Guy, for someone who "didn't know what a layout was" you done really good!

[Andrew Falconer]

Hot glue squeezed in and around the ties can hold the track in place.

[lionelsoni]

The temperature rise of 18 AWG wire is about 4 times greater than 14 AWG for the same current.  A ZW transformer can put about 15 amperes through either size of wire before the circuit breaker trips.  The 14 AWG can stand that temperature rise; but the 18 AWG cannot.

Your trains and accessories won't draw that much current normally, but the overcurrent protection of your transformer's circuit breaker is not there for normal operation.  It's there for when something goes wrong, just like the circuit breakers or fuses in your house wiring.  The circuit breaker will protect you when the current tries to go over 15 amperes; but your wiring is responsible for safely handling all fault currents less than 15 amperes.  14 AWG can do that; 18 AWG cannot.

Solid and stranded wire are equivalent electrically.  Which to use is only a matter of which you prefer to work with.

[Andrew Falconer]

Which tranformers will be used?

Can you get 16 AWG or 14 AWG wires?

[KRM]

Andrew Falconer

You will have to slowly run the loco for 30 minutes to allow the smoke unit to heat up and start to vaporize the excessive smoke fluid.

 

Don't know what the heck you are running but if I had to wait 30 minutes to allow the smoke unit to heat up I would not bother to do it. Just turn it up and it will smoke even if the grand-kids have flooded it. All our post war will start right straight away. Some of the newer wants more power to get there but nothing takes 30 minutes to cook that we have.

[emdmike]

I also use carpet under my track to deaden sound.  Also the postwar smoke pellets are reproduced now and work way better in the old smoke units than any liquid and give off the proper scent IMHO.  If the smoke still is poor, the smoke unit itself needs serviced.  They can get pugged up with residue from years of use and the puffer piston cannot push air thru to make it puff out the stack.   Mike

[aross97]

     Testing, please let me knwo if this works...

[aross97]

Video test two.  Again, please advise if this works.

[aross97]

3rd time's a charm?