6026 whistle Tender with the 2013 Polar express Berk

[KRM]

What do you guys use to clean your track?

 I got some hard to get to places. 

I was pulling the postwar 6026 whistle Tender with the 2013 Polar express Berk and the whistle would go off crossing switches and blow all the way up the incline. Any ideas?  Dirty track?? It does not do this behind the 736?????

 

[TrainLarry]

 Momentary loss of power to postwar whistles/horns due to dirty wheels/pickups/track will cause them to blow randomly.

Clean the wheels, roller pickup and track with hardware store naphtha.

If you do not have a track cleaning car, perhaps a rag dampened with naphtha can be pushed around those hard to get at places with a long stick.

Larry

[KRM]

Thanks Larry, I will clean the track but still wonder why it is just fine behind the Postwar 736????

[TrainLarry]

The only thing I can think of is a difference in track voltage. The newer locomotive probably runs at a lower track voltage than the 736 with the same train. Try adding extra cars to the Polar Express loco so you need to raise the track voltage to a level equal to that when running the 736 and see what happens.

Larry

[KRM]

Thanks again, Larry it seems the other way around. The newer Berk takes more power from the ZW to pull the same cars. I am pulling four Lighted  RMT  Norfolk Southern Streamlined Passenger Cars. Maybe I will try removing cars to see how it works. Weird?

[KRM]

So, Okay, I cleaned the track, took cars off of the train added cars to the train and the whistle still blows when it wants to when it is behind the 2013 Lionel Polar Express 1225 Berkshire, even in reverse.     Behind the postwar 736 Berkshire, the postwar 681 or the postwar  2065 Hudson the tender is just fine. Must be some sort of electrical thing with the Polar Express 1225 Berkshire????

I am stumped??? 

[TrainLarry]

If you are using the CW-80 transformer, try using a postwar transformer if you have one.

Larry

[KRM]

I am using a ZW Larry.

[TrainLarry]

If you have a voltmeter, set it to read DC volts and see if you get a DC voltage across the lockon when running the tender behind the Polar Express loco. Do the same when running the tender behind your other locos.

Some other things to try is reversing the leads at the lockon, and trying another transformer. An off the wall guess is that the Polar Express loco is somehow imparting a small DC voltage to the track, triggering the whistle relay.

Larry

[KRM]

I have 11 Lockons on this loop. All wired the same. I will have to see what I can do to test the voltage. I am going to build a set of track pliers so I can tighten the track conections. All track was new two years ago and is screwed in place. Lionel O27 track. The China stuff.

Short term. I am going to use some other tender.

[TrainLarry]

Take a DC voltage reading at the lockon nearest the incline, as you say that is where the whistle blows the most,then take a voltage reading where the whistle does not blow and compare readings.

Larry

[KRM]

TrainLarry

Take a DC voltage reading at the lockon nearest the incline, as you say that is where the whistle blows the most,then take a voltage reading where the whistle does not blow and compare readings.

Larry

 

Larry, Here is what I came up with. With the 2013 Polar Express Berkshire Jr. running on the loop pulling four lighted RMT passenger cars and the 6026W tender there is a 00.1 DC reading on the meter on the flats of the loop. On the incline it will climb as high as 00.5 DC voltage reading and the whistle will blow..  Is that enough DC voltage to set off the whistle in the tender?  This Loco requires full throttle on the ZW to pull the load up the incline and almost full throttle on the rest of the loop.  With the Postwar Berkshire 736 there is no DC voltage reading. Why,, I have no idea.
The 736 requires much less throttle on the ZW. 

 

[TrainLarry]

Kev,

It seems as though the .5 volt DC that you measure is the minimum voltage necessary to activate the whistle relay, so that answers the 'why'.

The 'how' is not so easy, and it seems, as I posted earlier, that (as an educated guess), the electronics in the newer locomotive are somehow 'backfeeding' or 'impressing' a DC voltage on the track. The 'how' will take someone more versed in electronics to answer.

It does seem surprising that the newer locomotive operates at a higher voltage than the older ones. I would guess it is the motor and gearing that needs the higher voltage to operate at a similar speed to that of the postwar locos.

Larry

[lionelsoni]

The locomotive probably has a bridge rectifier upstream of the motor electronics. A bridge with mismatched diodes would tend to create a DC voltage at the track, by loading the transformer asymmetrically on alternate voltage half-cycles to produce an asymmetric voltage drop across the transformer's output impedance or the track and wiring resistance. Replacing the rectifier may fix it if the asymmetry is actually due to a bad component and not normal for the part(s) involved.

[TrainLarry]

More than likely the only bridge rectifier in the loco is on the AC input side of the power supply/reverse unit board. Replacing the rectifier or board then should solve the problem.

Larry

 

 

 

[KRM]

The 2013 Polar Express Berkshire Jr. seems to run just fine as it is and I think it is built to run slower. Seems the same running on the CW80 controled loop. So I don't think I will mess with anything. Would be nice to know if someone else could try the same thing and see how their Polar Express Berkshire Jr. works in the same conditions. For now I will just not use the 6026W with it.

Been fun looking into it anyway.

 Thanks! 

[sir james I]

Did you try anyother PW tender?

ONLY a guess. could be feedback from the DC motors. It doesn't take much to trip the whistle relay.

 

 

[KRM]

 

 

sir james I

Did you try anyother PW tender?

ONLY a guess. could be feedback from the DC motors. It doesn't take much to trip the whistle relay.

 

 

 

I have not Jim but a good idea, I will try it tomorrow, I have a 671W and another 6026W also a 2046-50W. Thanks for the idea. Just weird to me. Still hope someone else can try the same thing to see if it is just what I have or just the way it is.

Tonight I have a house full of grand-kids on the way over. The furnace in their place went out and Katie and the kids are on their way here for the night. So won't get any time to try anything tonight.