Need help finding old Lionel display track plan.

[JEFF FOSTER]

Hello, I am hoping that someone can help me locate an old Lionel display track plan. I have seen it on Youtube and in some T M videos, Lionel Christmas and A Century of Legendary Lionel Trains. I think the layout was built in 1953 because the Youtube video has that catalog cover at the end. It is a three level with many accessories. It is rather large and is eight feet wide and up to sixteen feet long. I would appreciate any help to point me in the right direction. Thanks, you guys are awesome!

[ADCX Rob]

Can you post a link to the YouTube video?

[JEFF FOSTER]

Hey Rob, here is the link you requested. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDbdO0rYYVY Thanks!

[Rob412]

Hi Jeff, I couldn't open the video link however I have a book written by Roger Carp called "Lionel Display Layouts You Can Build" which may help. The largest layouts in the book are 8x8 and have 2 levels. These are D-132 from 1954, D-225 from1958, D-265 from1959, D-292 from 1960, and D-403 from 1962. The D-132 may be what your looking for. I never got around to being able to post links or pics but the other guys on here will ,I'm sure, be able to assist

Good luck
Rob

[Rob412]

If you google those display layouts you should get pics. Of them to see if it's what your after

[ADCX Rob]

[JEFF FOSTER]

Hey Rob, I'm glad to see that you found the video. Have you seen this one before? Do you know anything about it? I have been given some numbers of layouts that might be like this one (D-132,D-225,D-265, D-292,D-403), but they are not the same. I have never seen anything like this before. The D-132 is similar but not near as cool and the mountain is smaller. If you have any information that could help please let me know. I know that the layout is over eight feet because I set the track up for the upper loops and the second level extends to twelve feet. I am using Postwar 0-31. I think that is the track used in this video. Thanks again for your help.

[ADCX Rob]

I've seen this many times, it is not a D-xxx layout. It was probably purpose built for this production of the advertisement series.

[prrstation]

ADCX Rob

I've seen this many times, it is not a D-xxx layout. It was probably purpose built for this production of the advertisement series.

ADCX Rob is correct... Lionel "D" layouts were manufactured as "Dealer" (i.e. the "D" designation) displays that could be easily and inexpensively shipped to Lionel dealers anywhere in the USA or Canada...  AND  easily assembled. Consequently, the "size" of each D layout was quite small.

Except for large department stores (Macy's, Gimbel's, Sears Roebuck), very rarely did a simple hobby shop or retail store have room for a large layout that would be quickly dismantled a few days after Christmas and the area used for other merchandise.

The layout seen in the video is/was a specially built, one-of-a-kind display used for advertising purposes.

One of the most amusing of the "D" layouts is the D-27 that I had the opportunity to help construct several years ago.... and it still runs great.

http://www.agtta.com/anniversary/anniversary.html

[JEFF FOSTER]

Thanks for the info. I attempted to build the layout on your link last year for our Vacation Bible School kids. I used Fastrack instead of the PW 0-31. Needless to say it did not work well. The train would always crash inside the mountain at the curve at the bottom. I used a 2035 and four or five PW gondolas. I tried to regulate the speed on the descent but it never worked to my liking. This spring I am going to try the old track and hope for better results. Thanks again for your response.

[prrstation]

Jeff.... Yes, there was a lot of trial and error to make it work as Lionel described it.

It was also necessary to use a transformer (Lionel Type R) with two throttles to provide the two speed adjustments: (1) regular travel around the layout (2) a speed boost to get the locomotive up the steep incline inside the tunnel

We also found that it performed much better after the locomotive engine had warmed up.

We wanted to recreate the D-27 layout as true to Lionel's original design as possible and with only a few minor adjustments I believe we succeeded.

Creating the proper height of the helix supports to obtain the appropriate grade to exit the tunnel was the most difficult.  Lots of trial and error.  It was during this attempt that I realized there was another alternative in reducing the 6 percent grade to a much smaller one.

The layout cabinet has three sections with the center one used for the helix. By using the other 1/3rd of the cabinet we could entend the length of the helix and provide for a much more gradual height to exit the mountain.  This also allows the train to "disappear" inside the mountain for a much longer period.

http://www.agtta.com/anniversary/construction-photos-4.html

You might want to try the above suggestion on your next D-27 attempt.

Also, I would suggest using foamboard or other sound reducing material to reduce the noise.

[JEFF FOSTER]

Thanks for the info. I sure your suggestions will help. I used a CW 80 transformer the last time. I agree that the layout needs some sound proofing. I never did get it to the finished stage due to the problems mentioned above. When the layout is complete will it run on its own or will I have to man the throttle? Before, I had to dial the power back on the descent and power up to exit the tunnel. This would prove to be difficult when the tunnel is in place. When I get the mentioned layouts completed I will post some pics. I am more focused on the large layout at the moment. My biggest problem is space. I am going to try to build it in sections so that it can be easily moved. I am thinking about building it in layers with a hollow middle. This would keep the weight down and make easier to move. It would also offer easy access to any problems inside the tunnel. Thanks again.

[prrstation]

Jeff,

You will definetly need a transformer that provides two seperate power sources.

The first to transverse the regular layout... and the second to provide additional voltage to "boost" the train up the grade to exit the tunnel.

I strongly suggest that you consider my previous modification of extending the "helix" to the third cavity of the display allowing for a much more gradual gradient to exit the tunnel.

This is truly one of Lionel's most unique and spellbounding layouts.

It would be a most interesting article in Classic Toy Trains to expand on their previous review of the Lionel D-27 "Disappearing Train Layout" to enlighten the model railroading community of how this layout came about.

To my knowledge, the AGTTA design is the only "original" Lionel D-27 layout that fuctions as advertised by Lionel.

Although others have "modified" the original design to work more reliably, this is the most recent recreation of the Lionel D-27 "Disappearing Train Layout" that can be viewed by the model railroading public.

It is my understanding that there is a Lionel collector who has an original Lionel D-27 display.  I beleive Roger Carp, a Classic Toy Train editor has viewed this display.

Unfortunately, previous attempts to inquire from Mr. Carp information about this display, prior to the AGTTA's  D-27 reproduction, went unanswered.

??????????

Good luck on your reproduction of the Lionel D-27 "Disappearing Train Layout".

[Lionelking313]

I wish CTT would Re-Release Roger Carps book on Lionel Display layouts you can build. I cannot see paying almost 150.00 for that book on some website!