electrical connections between loops of track

[quizshow904]

I have 3 loops of track and want to run 3 trains at a time. I also want to be able to move a train from one loop to the other. I am using Gargrave track and switches. I have put a 3" pc of track between each of the switch connections. I am using TMCC with a base and 3 powermasters. When I attempt to move a train between one loop and the other, it just shuts down. I have the power to the 3" pc of track hooked to the outer loop. All commons are connected together and all is in phase. So far I am just trying this with one train on the tracks, not while trying to operate 2 or more.

Paul

www.thewards.tv

[ADCX Rob]

You have three PowerMasters... how are you powering them?

[phillyreading]

Do you know that all rails in Gargraves are electrically insulated from each other? Gargraves switches can be a problem at times for beginners with Gargraves track, there is a plastic section on each Gargraves switch that I have and I had to supply power to the outside rails on both sides of the small section of track between two switches. Another problem that comes up in Gargraves switches is the center rail power stops at the switch, an 072 size switch problem mainly, and you must supply power to both of the out going sides of the switch; straight & curved.

[quizshow904]

I have 3 each 135 watt PowerMasters and running them through 3 ea  PH-1 TrainMasters.

[quizshow904]

Yes, I understand that all 3 rails are insulated from each other. I have run power to the center rail and common to both of the outside rails. They had a note with the switches that said they didn't power through the switch. I have a short 3" section of track between each switch. I have powered the center rail with track power but I didn't attach common to each of the side rails of the 3" pc. That could be my problem. I guess I should use insulating pins so that I have something to hold the small track piece in place??

I also want to connect the yellow and green wire from the Gargrave switch to an insulated piece of track out in from of the switch for Non-derailing functions. It all looks easy but for a beginner it is presenting some issues.

Paul

[ADCX Rob]

So when you say "shuts down", do you mean no power or short circuit?

[quizshow904]

It appears to be just no power. It doesn't sound like or act like a short.

[quizshow904]

as I have investigated this, i find that I have power from one transformer to all 3 loops of track. I have totally turned off the other 2 transformers but all 3 tracks show 7.5 volts. I must have a wire crossed somewhere. The 3 loops are attached through Gargrave switches and the power leg does not carry through the switch. My question is this... I have a short pc of track between the switches going from Loop 1 to loop 2 and to loop 3. Should the power to these short pieces be from loop 1or loop 2? Does it make a difference?? I still have some wiring that is off and I will have to figure a way to find that.

Thanks,

Paul

Any ideas on the search???

[CB&Q]

the short 3" section of track can be powered as loop 2 and so on just to keep things even.

as to the search for wrong wiring remove a wire at a time until you find the offending connection or connections.

are you sure all 3 loops are totally isolated both ground and hot from one loop to another?

as you stated with other 2 transformers disabled your getting power to them from loop 1 transformer.

hope this helps you.

[quizshow904]

No, I have not completely isolated all 3 loops at both the hot and common pts. I thought I only had to do the hot center rail since all the commons are connected anyway???

I have started the process and found 2 bad connections but still have an issue. I will have to go and isolated all the common connections between the loops now.

Thanks, I'll let you know how it goes.

Paul

[phillyreading]

A little help with mounting Gargraves track that I use; go with a smaller drill bit then what Gargraves says to use, they say 1/8inch I use 7/64ths. The reason I go down a drill size is to keep from splitting the wood ties that I have with my track when I use Gargraves screws. Also I mount a screw in the small track piece or nearby in the Gargraves switch. The Gargraves track is easy to cut with either a dremel tool with a cutting disk or by hand with a hacksaw. I highly recommend using the plastic insulating pins that Gargraves or Ross Custom switches sell for Gargraves track. You can cut a small one inch section of rail on the outside rail and insulate it to make a non-derailing switch with the DZ-1000 switch motors, just make sure to supply a common again where needed.

[quizshow904]

Thanks,

I have followed the help you guys have been giving and I now have all 3 loops of track running properly. I am using the TMCC system. Now I am down to getting the Gargrave switches with DZ-2500s working properly. 

On loop 3 the train sparks as it crosses all the switches. It doesn't do that on loop 1 & 2. Back to the electrical drawing board. What would make the switch spark?

Thanks again,

Paul

[nickelplater]

I would guess that you have a phasing problem between those two tracks.

[phillyreading]

I don't like to phase transformers so I try to use a multiple transformer like the postwar ZW for three tracks or KW for two tracks. When I phased two transformers the other year I used a # 12 AWG(20 amp capacity wire)size wire between the common terminals, I put a postwar ZW and a Z together.

[quizshow904]

I have double checked the phasing and it is correct. I notice that the center rail on the switches had no power which meant a 5" area was without center rail power. i have placed some jumpers but the problems seems to still exist. The engine doesn't stop like it would with a short, just sparks.

Paul

[phillyreading]

Sometimes things just happen on a layout. I had a switch loop that would lose power and I added at least three additional power connectors(both center and outside rails) to it and still it would lose power. Even replaced the track sections with newer track, the track was O gauge tubular with 022 post war switches. Some problems don't show up with a multimeter, some just have to be solved by trial and error.