New smoke pellets!!

[Dr.Fu-Manchu]

The [}:)] Doctor Is in !!! To Answer your question Beer Man, you can buy complete units from dealers in Lionel repair parts. Look In the back of CTT magazine for dealers in repair & replacement parts. They also make conversion kits so you can use smoke fluid instead of pellets.
TIll My Next Missive, I Remain The Humble, Yet Strangly [}:)] Doctor !!!

[Anonymous]

Greetings all:

I've just unearthed five Lionel prairie steamers from my parents attic. 2026, 2037, etc from the early 1950's.

Two questions:

1) What are my odds of finding smoke unit parts, all the way down to the pumper rods ?

2) Any further info on the new generation of smoke tablets ? Corrosive ? Sources?
EDIT (found this info in other part of these forums - THX)
Thanks in advance

[Anonymous]

Just to share some info. It's great to hear that the old postwar smoke pellets are again available in the original formula. The price is a bit high though.
Just be advised that the SP type smoke pellets will not work in the older locomotives that used smoke bulbs as the heating elements. These engines used Lionel #96 smoke tablets which was essentially made from pure pelletized potassium nitrate. These pills made smoke and it was not very toxic, but it was corrosive and eroded the smoke chambers. That is why Lionel recommended coating the inside of the smoke chamber with grease lubricant. I believe that the original smoke units were made for only a year or two before the new coil heating elements were invented and used.
Due to the corrosive nature of Potassium Nitrate, Lionel offered a retro fit kit which when installed in the older engines , updated the system to the newer type.

[spankybird]

Hi Davie,

That’s great news.

BTW welcome to the CTT forum



tom

[Anonymous]

The smoke pellets work great in my 2020. Unfortunately I had to rebuild my smoke unit. But it only cost $8, so it was not that bad. Did it myself though. Smokes great now.

David

[spankybird]

Chief,

I think the real problem was I pack this before I moved last time and never unpacked it.

So it is somewhere.

tom

[ChiefEagles]

Ace Hardware had Dollar Days. Had clear plactic shoe boxes on sale. Guess who bought a batch? Now my train "stuff" is in those and they stack great. Did that a couple of years ago for my shop for parts, special nuts and bolts, glues and etc. and other odds and ins.

[Big_Boy_4005]

You got me Tom!!!!![(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D] I'll have to try that next time.[swg]

[spankybird]

You know Elliot , the other day, I look in two or three other places after I found what I was looking for, just so what I found wasn't in the last place I looked.[:D][:P][(-D][(-D][(-D]

[Big_Boy_4005]

QUOTE: Originally posted by jerrylovestrains

I cnat wait until I get a postwar loco to try these new pellets out. Quite frankly, I have NEVER smelled the smoke pellet scent![^] I too think the bottle looks nice.

Jerry, part of the mistique of the smoke pellets is nostalgic. It is an interesting smell, and brings back memories for those of us in the older crowd. There are actually companies that make scented liquids, that are really cool. I think you can get coal and diesel. There used to be pine and a bunch of others.

Tom, I've repaired one or two of those old smoke units myself. One of the worst parts is trying to solder that NiChrome wire into the little eyelets.

Speaking of memory tests, I went through one yesterday, and nearly failed. I was looking for the box that had all the old eunits. Why is it always in the last place you look?[swg]

[spankybird]

Well Ben,
It may well be that the one I have is a 1947. You got to give me a break here, it was bought before I was born (1949) and my brother is much help, he was born in 1945 and doesn't remember much from back then.

But like a said, I do recall that the smoke unit was repaired or replace when I was a kid.

tom

[Anonymous]

I cnat wait until I get a postwar loco to try these new pellets out. Quite frankly, I have NEVER smelled the smoke pellet scent![^] I too think the bottle looks nice.

[ben10ben]

Tom, based on the picture you posted last week in Sunday Night Photo Fun, your 671 originally came with an SP type smoke unit(meta-terphenyl pills). The 1946 version had other differenced besides just the smoke unit. Both the front and back drivers were worm geared to a drive shaft that ran the length of the engine which in turn was spur geared to the motor, rather than only the rear axle being directly worm geared to the motor. The other difference was that the 1946 version relied on a plug assembly to lockout the e-unit rather than the external lever used on the 1947 and later version. Both of these changes are true for the 671, 726, and 2020.

[ChiefEagles]

Just wanted to see the answers. I have been using smoke fluid since the 70's in post war steamers. Using it now. Had not had time to convert. No problem what so ever. You have even seen pictures of them smoking [the smoke came from fluid]. I do take my old steamers apart and do maintenance a lot compared to other users. Even the train repair guy at my train lady's shop said go ahead. seems you all passed the test. [:D]

[spankybird]

Well Elliot,

Just goes to show you that you aren’t the only one with failing memory. I went down to take a pic of the old smoke element and couldn’t find it. I know I have it somewhere [?] As I recall it had a heating element in it, but I also seem to recall that is was repaired many years ago, like 40 to 45 years. So it may have had a bulb in it at one time.

tom

[Big_Boy_4005]

Thanks Ben, I'm getting rusty in my old age. I quit doing post war a long time ago. As a matter of fact one of these days, I should sit down and put the smoke units back in all of my old engines. They all got pulled out for the mall layout, so did all of the eunits. In the end we stopped using the post war engines, they couldn't take the constant running.

Back in the early 80's K-line tried to make smoke pellets. What a stench!!!! I swear they had made them using mothballs. I still have some of those. The new packaging looks nice. The question is how long will they last? Others have tried and failed.

[ben10ben]

I was very glad to hear this news, as I much prefer the scent of pellets to the scent of liquid smoke, not to mention the fact that I can run pellet engines for extended lengths of time without getting a shout from my mother of "Quit running the trains, I'm getting a headache".

Elliot, the 1946 versions of the 671, 726, and 2020 all had the smoke bulb and were designed to use ammonium nitrate pellets. The next year, these three engines were all upgraded to the meta-terphenyl pellets that were used through the rest of the postwar period.

The 746, General, and a couple of other engines were all originally built with liquid smoke units.

[Big_Boy_4005]

Tom, was the 671the one with the odd light bulb? Wasn't there a post engine that took a liquid? My memory is getting so bad.

[spankybird]

I have to agree with those above. Only put in a few drops at a time and often. There is no wick to feed the heating element, therefore it can overheat very fast. As Elliot said, the pills would melt as they were heated.

One of the problems of the old units was not melting all the pill and then adding another one, or not running the engine for a long enough time, and then the half milted pill would cake up in the unit.

BTW, I had my 671 converted to fluid.

tom

[Big_Boy_4005]

I think the biggest problem with using liquid in a pellet type is that it tends to run out quickly. As far as I know American Flyer had that long floss wick in their units, which allowed them to use the liquid efficeintly. The pellets Lionel used were more of a slow release method, because if you watch them, they actually melt into a liquid too.

If you have ever taken a Lionel smoke unit apart, you'll find a small pan at the bottom. In the pan is a small pad. There is also a little cone with a hole in it sticking up from the bottom of the pan. This is where the air to make the unit puff comes from. The only function the pan and pad serve is to catch any runoff as the pellet melts.

By the way Jerry, I saw the ad in the new CTT.[;)]

[lionelsoni]

I have heard that it works okay (with just a few drops) but have never tried it myself.

[ChiefEagles]

Dumb question, what happens if you use a little liquid smoke fluid in postwar smoke units? I want to see the answers. [?]

[brianel027]

It was kind of a hoot that in the question and answer part of the new CTT: there was question on where to get smoke tablets, and the usual answer that they aren't made anymore. Then low and behold, under the new product announcements... SMOKE PILLS are finally available again.

Regardless of the laugh I had, this is very good news for all the Postwar operators out there... and they are out there!

[Anonymous]

That's great to hear! I was always hoping that somebody would do this. I'm definetly going to have to get some. I'm not into modern-era trains and I don't like the idea of altering my postwar steamers, so this is excellent news to hear.

[spankybird]

Jerry,

that is good news for those who have older engines[:D] [tup]

[Anonymous]

For those who dont go on the OGR board, here is some great news!!

Toy Trains Unlimited is making a copy of the OLD POSTWAR SMOKE PELLETS![:D]

For 15 bucks for 50 of them, you can enjoy the old smoke units without making a conversion! I have heard good reviews of them, they smell and perform like the original ones, but have a slightly yello color.