I have started working on a new layout ! I have limited space, so a 4 x 8 is about as big has I can get . In order to get the most track length I am considering going up and over. I have found a track plan I like, It calls for a elevation change. Are there any products out there that will make it easy to do. I have looked at Woodland Scenery . I like there incline sets ,but they are designed for HO. There answer is to double up. This brings the width to about 5 inchs, this is to wide for my needs. Not to mention the cost of all the parts need to get the height .With the size of my layout a 4% grade is going to be needed. Any help would be appriciated
Thanks Bob
Bob,
Lionel made a graduated trestle set a few years ago, don't know if they still make one. It might have been for use with 027 track, I think the number was 110 trestle set.
Or if you are good at using a saw, you can make something out of a hardwood product that should work as trestle. I suggest hardwood, like oak or cherry, because a soft wood may split a few weeks after you make holes in it, also use a pilot hole to keep the wood from splitting half as much.
Lee F.
Lionel still makes the graduated trestle which is the 110. The grade is more like a 5% so pretty steep. Magnatraction will be required and your train length may be pretty limited.
When I used the set. I had to use screws to hold the track on the trestle. I used #4x5/8 wood screws.
You may want to explore building something if you are modeling. The 110 graduated trestle can work of you just want a longer run.
I may be wrong here but I believe when Lionel made the trestle set it originally was made for O gauge track which is a little longer so it would give you probably closer to a 4% grade than 5 but when they adapted it to O-27 they didn't think of making it any smaller also so the grade went up to 5%
Life's hard, even harder if your stupid John Wayne
http://rtssite.shutterfly.com/
Also i believe they make a trestle set for fastrack too. not sure what the grade comes out to in that set.
Edit: found the stock number for fastrack tresetle set 6-12037
027_DanielLionel still makes the graduated trestle which is the 110. The grade is more like a 5% so pretty steep. Magnatraction will be required and your train length may be pretty limited.
Sorry to butt in, but You mentioned “Magnatraction” and it jogged my memory of a similar question I asked last year. I don’t know if this is spelled correctly because I can’t find it by searching, but anyway how would one know if a loco is setup for this? I have a small 1-2% grade with MTH RealTrax and my Loco slips and I think it might be because the RealTrax is not steel. I had totally forgot about the “Magnatraction”.
SleeperN06 027_Daniel: Lionel still makes the graduated trestle which is the 110. The grade is more like a 5% so pretty steep. Magnatraction will be required and your train length may be pretty limited. Sorry to butt in, but You mentioned “Magnatraction” and it jogged my memory of a similar question I asked last year. I don’t know if this is spelled correctly because I can’t find it by searching, but anyway how would one know if a loco is setup for this? I have a small 1-2% grade with MTH RealTrax and my Loco slips and I think it might be because the RealTrax is not steel. I had totally forgot about the “Magnatraction”.
027_Daniel: Lionel still makes the graduated trestle which is the 110. The grade is more like a 5% so pretty steep. Magnatraction will be required and your train length may be pretty limited.
If you have some old O or O-27 track put your engine to it if it grabs it has magna-traction if not it doesn't.
Also I don't believe MTH realtraxs or Lionel fas-track are steel so magna traction would grab to them.
Fastrack is steel. You can use a paper clip or screwdriver to test the loco to see if it has magnetraction. If you touch the wheel with a steel object, you should feel the magnetic force.
BB
I have supplied several types of custom graduated trestle systems in the last several years and have found that Poplar is most probably the best wood to use. It is rather economical and does not tend to split like some of the hardwoods. I think that most of the commercial sets made by the larger manufactures have too steep of a grade (about 4 degrees). I have made my new Elevated System at about 2.5 degrees which is very manageable.
jim r from bridgeboss.com
servoguy Fastrack is steel. You can use a paper clip or screwdriver to test the loco to see if it has magnetraction. If you touch the wheel with a steel object, you should feel the magnetic force. BB
I was told in the past that magna traction doesn't work as well on fastrack but I see my engine grabs fine on a piece i have so sorry I was wrong might of been thinking of gargraves stainless steel track. Not sure now lol
I have a grade on my home layout, using the Lionel graduated trestles, it's about 6 feet long, not sure about the grade %. One consideration you'll probably need to implement (if you're running long trains) is a way to either "boost" the track voltage going up your grade, or lower your voltage going down the grade. I chose to lower my voltage on the downside of my grade by isolating the center rail, giving it it's own power supply and wiring in a pair of 2W, 10-20 ohm resistors in parallel (you may have to experiment with the resistance rating depending on your transformer) to cut the voltage as the train goes down. I use two of them in parallel so that they "share" the job of cutting the voltage, as using one usually results in it burning out in a short time. I actually used a separate transformer output for my grades, and I used a DPDT switch so that either grade can be the "up" or "down" depending on train direction. You could also choose to use a relay and capacitor set up to activate a track "boost' for the upgrade--many people like to use this method instead. I'm sure Bob N can help you with the specifics of the boost set-up, as I haven't done that myself, but some guys in our club have done that on our layout--I just haven't examined it closely yet! :)
This is all assuming that you're running conventional locomotives with conventional wiring. If you're using TMCC, DCS, Legacy, etc, then you won't need to do any of this. Good luck!
JohnnyB mentioned the spelling of magnetraction. Magnet + traction = magnetraction.
As for changing the voltage on the grades, you can do that with a resistor; but I would advise against using more than one transformer output. It's safer to use a single transformer output, so that the current in the resistor is just that drawn by the train. With more than one voltage source, there will also be a current flowing between the transformers through the resistor. A Lionel rheostat makes a very suitable resistor for this sort of thing.
However, resistors have the problem that the track voltage drops in proportion to the current drawn by the train. I recommend instead using diodes to drop the voltage for the downgrade. You can use individual diodes; but a neater way is to modify bridge-rectifier modules (like this one: http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062580) by tying the + and - terminals together. This gives you two diode pairs that can each drop about .5 volt. A few of these wired in series should give you all the speed control that you need.
You might consider having three voltage steps instead of two, direct for the up-grades, a diode string for the down-grades, and a tap partway down the string for the level track.
Bob Nelson
Hey Bob,
Thanks for the advice on the diodes. When I first read about using diodes to accomplish the voltage reduction, I tried to undo all my resistor wiring and redo it with diodes, but the sections of track that were powered with the diode in series would make my Lionel locos blow their whistles or horns when they went over that section, even if the controller wasn't being pushed. It didn't matter which way the diode was facing, either. That got annoying quickly, so I went back to the resistors. But that was a simple diode, not a full wave bridge rectifier set-up as you suggested. Maybe I'll have to try that instead. Thanks!
I'm sure that was the problem. A lone diode would give you half-wave DC, which would really set off the whistle. You don't get as much drop with anti-parallel diode pairs (which is what you get two of with each rewired bridge rectifier), but the important thing is that the waveform is symmetrical, so it neither affects the whistle relay nor saturates the transformer as DC would do.
Do be sure not to use a separate transformer or transformer output with the diode scheme. The same feature that makes it immune to train current can also create very large fault currents from one voltage source to the other.
So, instead of using one of my KW's variable outputs for the upper and lower (flat) portions of my layout and the other variable output for the grades (as I have it wired now,) I should instead do as you suggested, use only one output, full power for the "up", low power for the down (at the end of the string of bridge rectifiers,) and use a tap somewhere in the middle for the flat sections? Is that what I should be doing? Sounds like some rewiring is in my near future. :) But thanks again for the advice.
That's the idea! The tend to be expensive; but, if you can get a couple of rotary switches, you can use them to select the taps for the level and downhill portions.
one place that you may want to look for ideas on good 4x8 or even 5x9 layouts is lionellines.com. it has an index of a number of dealer displays from the 50's of lionel dealers. these displays pack a lot of action in a small space and a number of them have graduated trestles in them. they are good to look at.
Pretty timely post, as I just checked out the Readers' Choice Railroad in the Feb '11 CTT (pg 44). I much prefer the original Blue Creek Ry (pg 46), as it has a better flow to it, and gives a tad more run to the rise. Asking trains to cross themselves at the end of an O-36 loop, 5 inches high ,on a 4x8, is asking a lot of an engine. My question goes to the potential builder: what kind of trains are you going to run? If it's starter-set caliber equipment, then my advice is to just have enough height to clear at the over-under. If on the other hand, you prefer double-stacks, Superliners, auto-racks, and GG1's, perhaps a level 90 or 45 degree crossing would be better.
I used 2" pink foam stood on its edge, and then glued the pieces together. It work s great.
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