Flyer LTI EP5 Horn

[azflyer]

Bob,

Don't take me wrong I love my AF 18B transformer. But I could not get use to the side to side motion of the control handles. I fished bass fishing tournaments for over twenty years, and your controls for your boat are back and forward just like the ZW. Trying to run two trains at a time was a real test......ran one train right off the end of the table...full speed ahead. Wish I could of had that on video. You Lionel guys would of loved it. The train landed right in a card board box on the floor. That American Flyer train still choo-choos along.

By the way you can run 4 trains with the ZW if you want. You can use the AF 18B for accessories, bells and whistles. That is the way I'm thinking at the present time.

Everyone have a good evening. I'm heading for the pool. The temp is dropping  below 100 degrees this next week. All my snowbird friends are starting to come back to Arizona.

AZ-Flyer

 

 

 

[aflyer]

Azflyer,

Well it sounds like the ZW has a lot more bells and whistles, pun intended, than my AF 18B.  Controls for two tracks, 2 accessory circuits and the bells and whistles.  Thank you for the education, I did a quick search on ebay, they aren't cheap, but I will keep a look out.

Bob,

Hi, and thanks for the confirmation.  I will probably pick up a 5906 and see how it works. Tthey are not expensive, and will be a good short term solution while a think about the ZW option.  Did, a AF guy really say that?

Thank you both again,

George 

[lionelsoni]

The 5906 should work as well with an American Flyer transformer as with a Lionel transformer.  It does however reduce the track voltage somewhat when operated, which could be a problem with a transformer with a lower output voltage, which is characteristic of American Flyer transformers.  But, if you're not using your transformer at full voltage, this may not be a problem for you.

[azflyer]

 

I found out by using the ZW transformer with the updated diode Model 1N1190AR, available from:  www.allelectronics.com is a 600V 40 Amp diode you don't have to have any added control whistle or horn button. It is already built into the transformer direction and whistle lever. See ZW Instruction Manual: http://www.lionellines.com/files/manuals/ZW_Manual.pdf

Rail Sound 5.0 is already in the 4-8-4 and the ZW transformer will support TMCC conventional mode.

Have a good evening, I'm heading to the pool. It was 108 degrees here in Arizona today. 

AZ-Flyer

 

[aflyer]

azflyer,

Hi, and thank you for the suggestions, I will look into a ZW transformer and do some reading.  Your videos are great, or should I say the Audio in your video's is great.  I tried to get to your tips, but couldn't find an explanation of how you married the Lionel railsounds to your AF locomotives.  Can you share how you did that?

Also I understand how going to the ZW transformer would solve my problem with the LTI EP-5, but does this mean that adding the 5906 sound generator to an AF transformer will not work? 

Thank you,

George

 

[azflyer]

I went thru the same problem. I hate to say it because I'm American Flyer guy! Go buy Lionel ZW-R transformer with the up-dated diodes and use AF 18b transformer for running switches, lights, and other action cars. All your problems will be solved. Check out my videos all using ZW transformer with Lionel/Flyer trains. 

American Flyer Silver Flash Diesel with Rail Sound 5.0
http://vimeo.com/15206366

You can view more of the videos by just going to the AZ-Flyer Blog.  http://az-flyer.blogspot.com/  

[aflyer]

Bob,

 Thanks for the informative response.  I found a couple of 5096 Sound buttons on eBay, so I will go ahead and buy one and give it a try.  I have a couple of whistles or horns in some AF locomotives and they really don't work very well.  I don't know what to expect with hte LTI reproduction EP-5, but worth a shot.

Thanks again,

George

[lionelsoni]

The American Flyer and Lionel horn concepts were very different.  American Flyer superimposed the horn or whistle sound waveform on the track voltage and passed it to a loudspeaker on the train through a crude high-pass filter that rejected the 60-hertz power-line frequency.

Lionel on the other hand superimposed a small DC voltage on the AC track voltage.  This operated a special relay in the locomotive that was sensitive only to DC voltage.  The relay then started the motor of an air whistle or connected a battery cell to a diesel's horn (more like a buzzer).  This is what you're dealing with.  Since you're using an American Flyer transformer, you don't have the circuitry built into many Lionel transformers to generate the horn-triggering DC voltage.  The 5906 connects between the transformer and the track, in series with one of the wires to supply the missing DC voltage.  Unfortunately, because of its external location, it must lose some of the AC voltage to do this; so you can expect the train to slow down when you blow the horn.

Another consideration is the polarity of the DC voltage.  For old trains with the relay, it didn't matter--the relay would operate with either polarity.  Modern locomotive electronics however are usually sensitive only to one polarity.  With three rails, it is easy to install the 5906 in the way that satisfies the locomotive.  If it is in wrong, you just swap the two 5906 connections.  A 5906, connected "backwards", can also be used to control a bell separately from the horn on 3-rail track.  I don't know for a fact how your locomotive is set up; but I think Lionel would have had to make the horn on a 2-rail locomotive sensitive to either polarity, since there is no way to predice which wheels are on which rails.  In this case, it wouldn't matter which way you installed the 5906.

[aflyer]

Hi guys,

I hate to reply to my own post, but need to let you know I was all wrong when I posted this question.

I went back and to the instructions for my  LTI EP-5.  First I have the 6-48008, not the 6-48075.  And then I re-read the instructions and sure enough I found what I need, right there in the instructions it states I need  a 5906 Sound  activation button. 

So two new questions; would the 5906 sound button usually come with this locomotive?  And  the instructions state, it will work with any Lionel transformer except the #6-4690 Type MW, what is the difference?  Or more easily stated will this work with my AF 18B AC transformer?

Thank you,

George

[aflyer]

Hi Guys,

I have a 6-48075 American Flyer EP-5 by Lionel.  It has a horn, but no instructions that I can find in the manual to tell me how to use it.  I am using an American Flyer 18b Transformer, all convential wiring no DCC etc.  Do you have one of these locamotives, and can you tell me what I need.

Thanks,

George