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What type of plastic is used to make toy trains?

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What type of plastic is used to make toy trains?
Posted by Boyd on Monday, August 2, 2010 2:20 AM

Is it PVC plastic or another type of plastic?

Modeling the "Fargo Area Rapid Transit" in O scale 3 rail.

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Posted by dwiemer on Monday, August 2, 2010 6:36 AM

ABS, had to look it up:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acrylonitrile_butadiene_styrene

Hope this helps.
Dennis

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Posted by Plankowner110 on Tuesday, August 3, 2010 12:05 AM

 ABS- commonly known as "breakable!"

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Posted by cwburfle on Tuesday, August 3, 2010 5:38 AM

It's been a while since I watched the video: "The Making of the Scale Hudson". It covers a lot more than just the Hudson itself, and is a must-see for anybody who is interested in how trains were made cira 1992. I beleive they mention that several types of plastics are used.

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Posted by DMUinCT on Tuesday, August 3, 2010 9:36 AM

    Pre-War, "plastic" to Lionel was Molded Bakelite.  The simi-scale Box Cars and Manhattan Pullmans are good examples.  Lots of great detail but only good for one drop.

   Styrene was used for models right after the war but was heat sensitive.   Enter "ABS" plastic.  You best know it as in "Football Helmets" or used for high pressure steam and water pipes.   Drop a modern model train car, the wheels may fall off but it seldom breaks.

Don U. TCA 73-5735

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Posted by webenda on Wednesday, August 4, 2010 7:50 PM

Don U.

You were doing fine until you got to "Football Helmets." Materials used for the production of football helmets have evolved from leather, to harder leather, to molded polycarbonate shells.

Reference: http://www.answers.com/topic/football-helmet

The following indicates relative impact strength of ABS vs Polycarbonate. 

Izod Impact Test (notched)
ABS  7.7 ft-lbs/in of notch
POLYCARBONATE 12.0-16.0 ft-lbs/in of notch

The Izod test is a precision way to whack things with a hammer.

Reference: http://www.curbellplastics.com/

Steam and water pipes you mention are polyethylene.

Reference: http://www.oxfordplasticsinc.com/applications.htm

 ..........Wayne..........

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Posted by DMUinCT on Thursday, August 5, 2010 11:07 AM

webenda

Don U.

You were doing fine until you got to "Football Helmets." Materials used for the production of football helmets have evolved from leather, to harder leather, to molded polycarbonate shells.

Reference: http://www.answers.com/topic/football-helmet

The following indicates relative impact strength of ABS vs Polycarbonate. 

Izod Impact Test (notched)
ABS  7.7 ft-lbs/in of notch
POLYCARBONATE 12.0-16.0 ft-lbs/in of notch

The Izod test is a precision way to whack things with a hammer.

Reference: http://www.curbellplastics.com/

Steam and water pipes you mention are polyethylene.

Reference: http://www.oxfordplasticsinc.com/applications.htm

   Right you are on Football Helmets, they are "poly", the ABS list only mentions head protection hats, however, ABS is used in house plumbing.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_pressure_pipe_systems

  Also of interest, MTH does use "Polycarbonate" in place of ABS in there "G Gauge" trains, engines and cars, as they are designed for indoor & outdoor use.

Don U. TCA 73-5735

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Posted by webenda on Thursday, August 5, 2010 2:06 PM

That is interesting about MTH using "Polycarbonate" for toy trains. Kids could take a hammer to them with no damage.

ABS is used for home plumbing. It is rated from 100 psi to 200 psi (depending on size.) I was thinking "High Pressure" for which Polycarbonate tubing is rated around 1,600 psi (depending on size and temperature.)

Pressure ratings are not useful for model train discussion, but temperature is. ABS is rated useful up to 180 deg F. That means I can run my ABS trains outdoors in the Arizona summer sun. Also, my storage shed gets up to 113 F inside, which is OK for storage of model trains. (I was worried about the ABS equipment melting like some vinyl records did when I first moved here.)

 ..........Wayne..........

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Posted by DMUinCT on Friday, August 6, 2010 9:09 AM

This could start a whole new subject.

The use of, and advertised as by MTH, ABS diesel and car bodies in "O" gauge. A primarily indoor train system.  In the MTH "Gauge One" (G Gauge) catalog proclaiming "All locomotives and rolling stock bodies are molded in Polycarbonate".  G gauge is primarily run outdoors.

Does ABS have problems outdoors?   Does size and weight enter into the thinking? -----

Don U. TCA 73-5735

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Posted by RockIsland52 on Friday, August 6, 2010 9:35 AM

A good example of heat sensitivity in some of the postwar Lionel and mentioned by Don:  the single-motored postwar Alco FA1s.  The "susceptible" were those produced from 1950 through 1952.

Union Pacific (2023), the Rock Island (2031), the Erie (2032), and then the Union Pacific (2033).  In the earlier versions (1950-1952) a dime-sized area just above the motor was susceptible to deforming, leaving a noticeable depression on the flat roofs.  In Lionel's inimitable style, they forsook the easy approach of adding a small heat shield and changed the molds to include a small "round raised dimple" (Postwarlionel.com) in the same spot for production years 1953 and 1954.  I suppose that just thickened the plastic in that spot.

Those plastics back then for the most part could really take a beating, however, from a cracking standpoint.  Some of the old Alcos sold on ebay look like the shells were attacked with a hammer and then dragged behind a car for a few miles.    

Jack.

IF IT WON'T COME LOOSE BY TAPPING ON IT, DON'T TRY TO FORCE IT. USE A BIGGER HAMMER.

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Posted by webenda on Friday, August 6, 2010 5:54 PM

Yes, ABS has problems if left outdoors for an extended period. ABS has very poor resistance to degradation from exposure to the sun. Paint can slow this process, but even paint fades in the sun. The main visible effects are a chalky appearance, a color shift on the surface of the material, and the car becomes brittle.
Reference: http://www.coleparmer.com/techinfo/techinfo.asp?htmlfile=Zeus_UV_Properties.htm&ID=834

Polycarbonate offers excellent Sun exposure resistance, but it costs more (+7%) than ABS and toxic chemicals (Bisphenol A ) are used to produce it. If it is painted, the paint can degrade just as it does on ABS products.
Reference: http://www.bisphenol-a.org/about/index.html
http://www.professionalplastics.com/ABSSHEETFORMINGGRADE
http://www.professionalplastics.com/POLYCARBONATESHEET

ABS is strong enough for G scale size trains. 

So why us ABS?
1) Lower cost.
2) ABS might be easier to mold. Polycarbonate injection molding requires careful attention to temperature and time of each step.
Reference: http://www.matrixtooling.com/blog/possibilities-of-why-a-polycarbonate-pc-part-is-cracking/

Anyone else have an idea of why ABS is so popular for model trains?

 ..........Wayne..........

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Posted by webenda on Friday, August 6, 2010 7:00 PM

The Lionel Platinum Ghost F-3 shells were molded in clear polycarbonate as were the set of clear-shelled Madison cars available for separate sale.

 ..........Wayne..........

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Posted by Kooljock1 on Saturday, August 7, 2010 8:57 PM

 Delrin is also widely used for trucks and couplers.

Jon Cool

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