MTH vs Lionel Heritage units

[fredswain]

I really like the MOPAC SD-70 Heritage unit but I'm not really sure which one is nicer. I know MTH has 2 versions with the Premier being the nicer one but does Lionel also have 2 different versions or only one? I saw the MTH and Lionel Katy units side by side and the Lionel paint was brighter and more vibrant and certain detail items were more accurate as opposed to the MTH but looking back on it I don't know which units I was looking at or what series assuming there is more than one from each company. I can't just go back to see them side by side again as that was in a different state a couple of months ago.

Does anyone have an opinion as to who has the nicest one? My primary concern is with the looks. As far as sounds go I really don't like all the add on crewsounds and just prefer to hear the engine, bell, horn, and have the smoke unit so any crewsounds that they come with are unimportant to me as far as determining which one to buy. Any opinions on these?

[jd-train]

I believe that MTH only has one version currently available.

The Railking Imperials were scheduled for delivery in September, but the date has been moved back to January.  Pre-order prices on the Railking Imperials were about $200 for the conventional engines and $260 for the PS-2 versions.

Size wise the Railking Imperial is suppose to be only about an inch shorter than the Premier version.  I have two of the Railking Imperials on pre-order.  If they look to be close to the right size they will still stay, otherwise it's off to eBay!

Jim 

 

 

[fredswain]

In doing a little searching online I found that Lionel's engines are 17-1/2" long whereas the MTH Railking versions are 17" long. I remember them being roughly the same size and since you are saying the Premier isn't out yet it would seem to be obvious that these were the 2 that I saw. comparing these engines side by side I would definitely say the Lionel engine was the nicer one. However the Premier engine is shown as being 18-1/2" long which in 1/48 scale puts it right at 74 ft long for the prototype. EMD states actual length at 74' 3". That's as good as it gets (as opposed to 68 or 70 ft prototype length for the Lionel and Railking respectively).  This is far more accurate than the others so it would seem that this will be the nicer unit to get. I guess I'll wait for it.

[jd-train]

I think there's a misunderstanding.

MTH's Premier Heritage engines were the first ones that came out in the market.  They were then followed by the Lionel Heritage engine.

So, if you compared the two brands physically side-by-side, it was a MTH Premiere versus a Lionel engine.

The MTH Railking Imperial engine is the one that was announced in the 2008 volume 2 catalog.  This one was to ship in September 2008, but has been pushed back to January 2009

One thing that I could never figure out before I pre-ordered the Railking was what MTH meant by 17" long.  I am hoping this is the body length of the engine, and not the length from one end of the coupler to the other. 

Jim

[lionelsoni]

The length that is used for prototype locomotives is "length inside knuckles" (Alco) or "length over coupler pulling faces" (EMD).  That's the length between the inside surfaces of the coupler knuckles.  It's a sensible way to measure both prototypes and models, since, being the distance between the points where adjacent units touch, it is the length that the locomotive (or car) occupies in the train.

[fredswain]

I think there's a misunderstanding.

MTH's Premier Heritage engines were the first ones that came out in the market.  They were then followed by the Lionel Heritage engine.

So, if you compared the two brands physically side-by-side, it was a MTH Premiere versus a Lionel engine.

The MTH Railking Imperial engine is the one that was announced in the 2008 volume 2 catalog.  This one was to ship in September 2008, but has been pushed back to January 2009

One thing that I could never figure out before I pre-ordered the Railking was what MTH meant by 17" long.  I am hoping this is the body length of the engine, and not the length from one end of the coupler to the other. 

Jim

 

Thanks for clearing that up. Now I need to find a way to go back at look at them both again. I really liked the paint on Lionel's engine better. It was very glossy and looked like fresh paint. The MTH engine was flat and not as vibrant. Lionel also had more accurate detail items. I really want to see them both again. I'm not for or against either company. I just want the one I think is nicer.

[Geno]

Both the MTH Premier and Lionel versions have strengths and weaknesses- but I would have to admit Lionel nails the overall look and sound of the Heritage Aces, and despite the questionable wheel sizes and setup is probably the more realistic-appearing model. MTH does deserve honorable mention for offering a scale- wheel, scale coupler, fixed pilot version, which goes a long way towards realistic appearance as well. The MTH version could be modified to appear correct, but why should you chop into a $400 diesel to make it look right? It should be perfect out of the box.

Geno

[fredswain]

I do like the options such as scale wheels that MTH is offering but realistically I'm not going to need them. My min curve is going to be O-42 and it's handlaid track using O-27 tubular rail. How do scale wheels perform on tubular track?

[SchemerBob]

In my opinion, the Lionel version is MUCH better. Here's some links to some YouTube videos of both types of engines:

MTH version:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6y2vBNPD9M

Lionel version:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVYYb_QVIkc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwS0LOXpHwU&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFmew6eifFA

[truckertrainman]

I have both the Katy and the MP Lionel units that are both excellant preformers in every way. I highly recommend them. I run them either Legacy or TMCC and they are excellant. Ron

[Geno]

fredswain,

The scale wheel MTH diesels will actually run on tubular track, but I doubt they will be able to negotiate any curve less than 072 since the chassis- mounted Kadees will cause any car coupled to it to derail the engine. Many hirailers have bought scale-wheeled MTH diesels for the fixed pilot and scale couplers, but most have had to switch to 3-rail wheels to run 3-rail track. Fortunately, the wheelsets on MTH 3/2 diesels can be swapped out in minutes.

Geno

 

[BadACe Trainmaster]

The Lionel has inaccurate sound sets, the MTH has the real recorded sound and the MTH is much Heavier and better a puller. I recommend the MTH. The MTH also has better details.

[fredswain]

Since I posted this question I've acquired 3 units. A Lionel, a 3 rail MTH with scale wheels, and a 2 rail MTH. I like them all for different reasons. Honestly I can't stand the sound from the MTH engines. It might be the speaker but in the fidelity department I give it a solid F. It sounds like it is playing through a plastic cup. The Lionel wins hands down in this area even if the actual engine tones aren't correct. The downside is that my Lionel sound board has given up and no longer works.

I am actually pulling the sound boards out. I'm replacing the electronics with DCC and am going to run these engines battery powered through CVP Products' Airwire 9000 system on 2 rail track. The hardest thing at this point will be converting the Lionel engine over to scale wheels and fixing the pilots but the good news is that I don't need to concern myself with insulating wheels.