People selling Postwar stuff at train shows

[Anonymous]

I can't put my finger on it,but something rubs me wrong about some of the postwar dealers at most shows.
I guess I'm the typical buyer,trying to get some of the stuff I had when I was little,that I do not have now.
The only stuff I will get is if it is in good shape, with a box in decent shape,and a better deal than all the other million ones selling the same thing.
Anybodt else feel the same way?
Like I said,I'm not sure what it is,but something about most of them rubs me wrong,like they're preying on us or something.

[Anonymous]

I really don't think that anyone is 'preying' on us. I think that it is a case of
folks are caught up in the "collector craze". Meaning that ..."if it's old, it must
be worth a lot of money"... What most people fail to realize is that just because
something is old it is not always worth a bunch. Also, I think it has to do with
us seeing our own mortality. We equate PostWar stuff as being new, and
ourselves young. We are getting older and so are our toys. The market will
shake itself out. How many checkbooks do you see open at train shows now
days? Not very many. Collectors are becoming more picky, and people are
driving harder bargains. Just be patient and you will get your trains. I have gone
for several years before making particular purchases because of prices, but
the bottom line is that as long as you have your money in your pocket, you have
the advantage.

Happy collecting...And don't forget to run those puppies! They are toys after all.
Enjoy 'em!

[brianel027]

The other thing too I have noticed over the years is that folks - especially with antique sellers and of the like. When they look at the price guides, their eyes head right to the highest book price listed, overlooking the condition of the piece and deducting the price for that. Some of these folks can't even define the difference between "good" and "like new." I've seen postwar pieces in MPC boxes with price tags that said "Mint." I can't tell you how many times I've had someone show me the book price for something and I say "but that's the like new price. This piece is good condition at best."

Prices the past few years have been down, but the past couple shows I've been to, the prices were much higher on older postwar items.

Here in NYS unemployment is very high - above national averages. Thousands in my area have lost their jobs in just the past 2 years... I think people are sincerely trying to make money where they can. This isn't just trains. I've noticed higher prices on all kinds of used stuff. There was an ad in the paper for three used Beatles LPs for $300!! Hmmmm... maybe... if they had all been signed by John Lennon!
This isn't the market speaking... it's financial need on the part of the sellers. I'm not defending it, but I can understand it. Unfortunately, some of these folks will never sell their stuff at the prices they hope to get... even if they do desperately need the money.

[Kooljock1]

There was an antiques dealer set up next to my table last weekend at the Essex Junction show. He asked why I was selling so much while he was selling so little. Most of his stuff was banged-up box-less Post War with a smattering of REALLY banged up Pre-War.

All at book prices.

'Nuff said.

Jon [8D]

[Anonymous]

When it comes to prewar and postwar I find that patience pays off. Determine what price you are willing to pay and wait. It will show up at the right price and some show or auction. Ebay is another good source. Just about anything Lionel has made will show up there, even the uncommon stuff. When the right item at the right price shows up buy it. Otherwise, wait a month or two and it will show up again at the price you want. The down side of Ebay is that a number of sellers are not TCA members so buyer beware.

[Anonymous]

I think the train dealers vs the antique dealer have a better handle on the prices. Everyone is there to make money so you have to educate yourself.

I wanted to sell some of my postwar stuff and all I hear now is "where's the box?" It seems if you do not have a box, your lucky to get half of the book price. I never set up a sellers table or went on ebay so I do not know if I would have better results.

I may just keep them and let my kids figure out what to do.(when the time comes)

Don

[SPFan]

There seem to be two groups of people selling trains. The full or part time dealers that buy and sell for a profit and the folks who occasionally show up to thin out or liquidate their collections. When a hobby becomes a business much of the fun goes out. These folks are entirely too serious.

Pete

[Anonymous]

I also think that there are dealers that got caught up in the 'Lionel will always make money' syndrome. Here's what I mean ~ dealers find their wares at flea markets and yard sales. Those yard salers have heard that Lionel trains are worth big bucks. Dealers see an item or two they know will make money, so they 'buy high'. And they carry them to shows, but there are no takers.
Now the market is glutted with trains, and those train dealers still want to recover the money they spent AND make a profit. Meanwhile the train market is a bit softer. More/better selection, AND new items now tempt the buyer. The dealer's trains become more and more shopworn as they traipse from show to show with no buyer for their ever increasingly 'less valuable' item. And THEN, you add into the mix, repro parts that have been added/used to make the original more appealing (buyer beware). Dealers, because an item works, claim it to be 'original', and stick that 'top dollar' value on it; yet the value is less because it is not 'pure' original. Very frustrating for a buyer to get a handle on the true value of an item.
On a personal note, I think there should be a category for 'reworked original' ~ somewhere between 'original' and 'restored' ~ an item that works exactly as the original; is MOSTLY original; but has repro parts.
I also think dealers at shows can get frustrated, too. I know I've heard this lament from BOTH sides ~ 'Same old dealers selling the same old stuff at the same old high prices at that show'... 'Same old faces at that show ~ nobody buys there. They just walk around with their hands in their pockets'. 'Dealers don't want to work with you at that show'.... 'Buyers want my stuff for nothing'.
And the games begin.....

[Anonymous]

I think Trainbud pretty well nailed it.

[Anonymous]

I started by buying postwar that didn't have boxes, and were a little worn, but were good runners. You can find these at reasonable prices, if you look around.

As soon as you add the boxes, you are moving into the "collectors" category. The collector's mentality, buyers and sellers, keeps the price of Lionel trains, both old and new, high. There's always the thought of making a profit or at least holding it's value.

Since I am not buying with the intention of selling, I'd rather pay less and not get the box. I don't buy toys, video games, computers, stereo equipment, tv's or much of anything with the thought that it might become a collectible. I buy them at the best price to use them. My trains are no different.

Al

[Anonymous]

All good points people,I have to decide what I want and stick to it.
I had the pickle car when I was little,I was deciding to buy it,then saw on the postwar library that the Libbys car in a aqua color was rare, and thought maybe i'll go for that ,then said,wait a minute,
I wanted the pickle car because that's what I had when I was little,so what am I going to get something different for just because somebody says its rare.
Like I said,I think I have to decide what I really want and stick to it.

[SPFan]

When I got back into Lionel few years I ago I thought I would only get original post war items. After all that's what I played with and they are supposedly "worth more". Then I discovered most of the post war stuff has been re released over the past ten years and they all have perfect paint jobs, boxes, operate better, and from three feet away look identical to originals for a lot less money. More importantly, none of the nostalgia factor is lost with a new item, at least for me.
Pete

[sulafool]

There is one guy who has attended the past few GATS shows in Denver with an awesome display of PW goodies--like he has one of everything from a '50s catalog. However, the prices he has are stratospheric, way beyond the price guides even, and though the condition of his pieces is decent, they are nowhere near "mint". I have begun to suspect that he (and similar others) really aren't interested in selling their stuff but instead just want to show it off.

Now there's a strange concept for a train "show"....