Gantry Cranes - Postwar 282R versus 6-12834: Your Opinions?

[hokie71]

David from Dearborn,

Have you posted any details on the project to add the magnet? Would be interesting to see how you did it.

[cwburfle]

I have never seen a 282R gantry crane with a red cab. It is listed on the Tandem Associates site. 

http://www.tandem-associates.com/lionel/lionel_trains_282_acc.htm

[PRESTON KNUTH]

does anyone know if the red postwar 282r gantry crane from the 50's exists??? cause i cant find anything about it online and i know that remake from 2001 is a thing but theres nothing about the original and is it worth $225????

[dsmith]

Greg,

I wrote the article in the November 2009 issue of Classic Toy Trains Magazine about how to move the crane back and forth using a small motor and threaded rod.  It has been im use for several years now and has been working flawlessly, so I guess I can say that it is a good solid design.  My crane is the modern 6-2316 design and has also been working well without any problems for at least the past 5 years.

Back issues of CTT magazine are available here:

http://trc.trains.com/Train%20Magazine%20Index.aspx?view=ViewIssue&issueId=6722

A video of my crane in operation is available here:

http://youtu.be/ZRTq1jivuw4

 

[GregE]

You have probably had dozens of posts since this was written a couple of years ago, but how did you set up the motor and threaded rod to move the crane back and forth?

Thanks,

Greg Engel

[e-mail]

[msacco]

While I'll agree that the 182 is more reliable there's something about the buttons that's not really cool. The levers on the 282s are just cooler as far as crane operation goes.

    Also, the whole straddling the tracks thing is pretty cool for loading and unloading. Can't do that with a 182.

 

Mike S.

[Back2Trains]

I have a 182 and wouldn't even consider any 282 or modern reproduction of it. The 182 has 2 solenoids and gearsets, one each for cab rotate and raise/lower. It also has the diecast magnet housing. It's solidly built, reliable and easily repairable.

[springoflife]

Thanks, Laz!

[laz 57]

I don't have the 282 version or have seen one work.  But with my PA crane I can pick up screws, nails, and I even slipped metal rings over the Lionel logs and pick up these to put in gondolas.  It works fine.  In CTT a few months ago aguy glued metals washers to vat loads for gondolas and was picking those up to place back in gondolas.

laz57

[springoflife]

How does the electromagnet's power from 282R compare to the modern 6-12834?

Is one version stronger than the other?

[laz 57]

I have to modern cranes.  The Bethlehem Clam bucket version, works great has some nice pick up power in the clam bucket and is a very smooth runner.  I can fill a ore car with coal in about five minutes with it.  Lots o fun.   I paid I think $160 for it.  I later won one off ebay a Pa. Magnetic crane.  Got it for $71.  Works as good as the clam bucket but doesn't have the pickup power as the other one.  I use it to pick up junk to fill up gandollas.  Get either one and have some fun.

laz57

[msacco]

I don't think you would want to mess with a 282or 282R clutch. It looks pretty complicated and I remember reading in CTT many years ago in the repair column that taking it to someone with experience is best.

    That said, mine was overly lubricated and the thick coating of lubricant caused more slippage with the clutch system. You'd have to see it work to understand why. I carefully cleaned it and I mean carefully because much of the gearing is nylon so you need to be careful with what you use.

    My 282R is easily in EX condition but with no box. I paid 250 about 7 years ago from a guy in town who was downscaling his collection and he opted to keep the prewar crane with the better clutch system. I was more than happy to take it off of his hands and it was one of the wisest of my train purchases.

 

Mike S.

[springoflife]

Do both versions (PW and modern) have plastic gears?

I believe there are differences in construction between the newer cranes

If I go modern, I want the PRR (#6-12834).  Any insights on that particular one?

[SPFan]

I believe there are differences in construction between the newer cranes. I have a TMCC version 24114 that I use on the club's modular layout. Its survived many shows and works like a champ. One nice thing about the modern cranes is various modes do not interact. You can rotate the crane continuously in either direction and it has no effect on magnet height. Its difficult to tell if a modern version will stand up without knowing how they made it. BTW the TMCC version comes with the standard 3 lever control box for conventional control.

Pete

[springoflife]

Just wondering why you would  need a mint example if opperation is the goal. A solid very good or excellent should do the trick at a much lower price. Not criticizing, just wondering.

 The simple answer, I have been a collector for many years, and have many really nice pieces (both PW and modern).  I have children now, and am slowly changing-over to "operator" for their sake, although I still have the "collector" mindset.  For me, mint pieces are more satisfying for me to watch.  (And for me, a BOX is a MUST which = $$$$)  So, I want the best of both worlds -- enjoyment as a collector, and fun for my kids playing with the crane.

I am willing to buy a modern version crane, but it will need to hold-up to my kids!

Are the PW clutches easy to service?  Are parts readily available?

Are the modern motors/linkage easy to repair or replace?  Are parts readily available?

[dsmith]

When I wanted to get a crane, I had the same questions that you do.  Not wanting to spend the money on a postwar version, I opted for the modern Lionel 2316 that didn't have an electromagnet.  After operating it for a time with just the hook, I thne built my own electromaget and have been having a lot of fun with it.  It is my favorite operating accessory, almost as much fun as operating the trains!!   I would guess that it is very similar to the 6-12834 although I have no personal experience to confirm this.  I have had mine for about 1 1/2 years and have had no problems with it.  It does have plastic gears and I assume that the postwar 282R has metal gears.  They look the same but the big mechanical difference between the two is that the 282R uses a single motor (that is very repairable) and a clutch system to switch between the rotation of the cab and the up and down movement of the hook or electromagnet.  The modern version uses 2 simple can motors (not repairable, but replaceable), one for each movement.  I have read in previous forum posts that the 282 and 282R can have some slippage of the clutch when shifting between the two movements although I have no personal experience with the 282.  Neither crane will remotely move the crane arm up or down, although you can turn the crank and adjust it manually.  Neither crane will move the crane platform back and forth although.  There are wheels on the bottom of the platform so that it would be possible to move it back and forth on 2 widely spaced rails.  On mine I built a simple motor and threaded rod attachment to move the crane platform back and forth.  You can accompish the same movement of course by moving the loaded train car back and forth with the train engine.

Whichever one you get, be sure to get one with the electromagnet as it makes it more fun and easy to operate.  You can pick up scrap metal or attach steel washers to containers, pipes or logs and pick them up with the magnet.  I have also seen a modern version that instead of an electromagnet, it uses a solenoid operated shovel to pick up coal or gravel.  The shovel looks like it would be fun too!

If you have a high speed internet connection, you might want to look at my video of my modern 2316 in action, loading and unloading containers, pipes and a crate.  The video is about 7 minutes long and the gantry crane operation starts at about 3 minutes,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXihu92pqME

[Anonymous]

Just wondering why you would  need a mint example if opperation is the goal. A solid very good or excellent should do the trick at a much lower price. Not criticizing, just wondering.

[3railguy]

I have a 282R. It is rugged and well made. It is rather noisy though. Noisy enough you might think something is wrong at first. Like the new one, the cab pops off easily. The new ones have seen improvements over the years and are much quieter and smoother running. If you get a new one, be sure to get one with a magnet as some versions come with just a hook. I don't know how strong the magnet is compared to the postwar version.

[msacco]

I remember in the early 90s I bought an LTI reissue. Right out of the box the cab was mounted improperly and it wouldn't rotate properly. Returned it and vowed to get a 282

   Found one a few years later (282R) and yes it's worth it. First of all there's the smell of ozone and the noise. A silent can motored crane just doesn't do it for me. You will get some slippage from the 282s (even the R although less) because of the clutch redesign but if it's cleaned and lubed well, it will be minimum.

    These things are built to last, no doubt there. I've heard of more than a few problems with the new ones, but I'm sure many out there are having no problems. It's just that with Postwar you no what you're getting, assuming of course you get one that's been taken care of.

   IMHO, this one's easy. POstwar Baby!!!!

 

Mike S.

[springoflife]

I'd like to buy a magnetic crane.  I will be running conventionally (no TMCC).  It seems that I can buy a new one for much less than a mint-condition postwar one with it's original box.  So my question is, is the postwar unit worth the extra money?  Or will the modern unit hold up OK?

 I want one that will work reliably for years, not need constant repairs or replacement.  It will be operated, not displayed.