MPC Product line - Your experience / info - pls

[turbine682]

Hi,

I'm looking at an 8206 NYC 4-6-4. Supposedly, this is an MPC production. I have the pricing info - curious about performance. I think there's something recent in CTT... need to check

I'd appreciate any info, experience, etc. that you may have acquired with the MPC product line.

TIA [8D]

[Big_Boy_4005]

The 8206 is an interesting piece, and though I don't own one, I have a lot of print recources available to me, and did a little research.

General Mills started off slowly rebuilding the buisness in the after they took over production in 1970. The 8026 Great Northern Hudson was cataloged in 1970, but never made. One possible explanation for this is, they were working with leftover stock after the buyout, and didn't have all the parts to assemble enough complete units. The practice of using "inherited" parts was known to have been used with other offerings in the transition year.

The 1971 catalog was very thin, and no engines as large as a Hudson were even shown. 1972 was the first sign of a rebound, with the 8206 offered for seperate sale.

This was the first reissue of the 2055 type small Hudson. The photo in the catalog is actually of a 2055, you can read the number on the cab. They didn't even bother to try and cover it up. [#oops] This could be an indication that there were bigger problems to worry about at that time.

A study of the parts list found in a Greenberg's 3 ring modern era parts manual shows that many of the parts used in the 8206 still had the post war Lionel numbers, however the motor was not one of them. This is an indication that changes had been made, but the diagram doesn't reveal any major difference when compared to the post war version. Greenberg calls this a type III motor. It has no magnetraction, but instead has a rubber tire on one drive wheel.

This was the one of the first engines to feature electronics, and has whistle and sound of steam, though the sound quality was not very good. The description in a full sized verson of Greenberg's modern era guide from 1991 says that "many of these engines were assembled with off-centered drive wheels" which caused them to wobble when they ran.

[turbine682]

Thanks Big_Boy_4005, you really contribute alot to this forum![tup]

[Big_Boy_4005]

Thanks Turbine, I take that as a great compliment.[bow] And to think that up until a little over a month ago, I was wasting over 30 years of experience, by not sharing it. I enjoy helping people in this hobby, and used to do it for a living, it comes naturally to me. I may not always be right , but I always try to be helpful.

In answering your question, I actually learned a few new things, and gained some insight into those early years of MPC. The 1972 catalog was my original copy, from when I was 11 years old, and is well worn (from all of my dreaming). Its amazing how different things look after all those years, and how far this hobby has come in that time.

I'm not sure from your original post, if you are looking at buying that engine or you already own one. But, in either case, it is an interesting piece of Lionel history, and I hope it doesn't wobble too much.[swg]

Elliot

P.S. This is my 200th post.

[brianel027]

Just to add to what Big_Boy has said, I think that the MPC period gets a bit of a bum rap. There is a tendency to compare postwar Lionel to MPC Lionel. Which is natural, but so much in manufacturing changed between the 1940's and the 1970's. Lionel was by far not alone in some of the things being to cut costs. And one could wonder if MPC quality at times took a back seat to cost control... but that's no different from postwar Lionel as it isn't any different from Lionel today. People talk about how heavy and rugged postwar Lionel trains are. But many things made during that time were heavier and more rugged. Just compare any household appliance made then to one made now.
Lionel MPC certainly cheapened certain aspects of the lineup. But I think some good was also done. I've met many younger modelers now who got their start with an MPC train set... I've read that here too. As I said once before, the MPC period was the last time I recall seeing a wide selection of Lionel trains in a nationwide chain department store. I also remember seeing commercials for Lionel MPC on TV on several occasions. I've never seen one since.
There's little question that the trains made today certainly offer more features over older trains. And die-cast construction is still there if one wants to pay the premium price for it. But when I consulted the dictionary for the precise definition of "quality" I have to wonder if the high level of defective trains today still means quality. I've heard that the return rate has hovered near 40% in recent years. I would not call that quality. Even CTT and OGR have both had recent product reviews where the trains did not work at all straight out of the box, or didn't operate properly if they did work. More features via electronics and circuit boards does not necessarily equal better trains, unless you enjoy frequent visits to the UPS office.
I can't defend everything MPC did or made. And most MPC trains don't compare well to the detail level and operational options available on trains today - but neither do postwar Lionel trains. But the MPC trains I own still run, and when they don't, they're easily repaired* by me - without the shipping charges.

brianel, Agent 027
*I like the electronic "Sound of Steam" primitive as it may be compared to Railsounds, etc. But as far as I know those circuit boards are not available, so there's one repair that can't be made.

[mersenne6]

The 8206 is a good runner. I purchased mine as a present to myself after returning from an all expense paid tour of the world courtesy of Uncle Sam. As was mentioned, the SOS - sound of steam - is your basic white noise chuffing but it was, as far as I know, Lionel's first attempt at electronic steam sound effects and as such is an interesting piece to own and run.

Other MPC items that I've had good experience with include #8550 - the black GG1 in Penn Central markings - it does leak small amounts of oil from time to time but even all these years later it can still be counted on to run smoothly. The Little Joe electric, the Ontario Northland SD-18's, and any of the FM's also perform well. By todays standards they are "plain vanilla" but they run well and, if you have to have sound, it is easy to ad sound boards to them.

[mpzpw3]

I have a postwar 2055 and an MPC-era 8900 FARR#1 engine. They both seem to have the same performance. The SOS doesn't work, so can't comment on that. I assume that there probably is not much differance between 8206 and the 8900. Mine doesn't smoke as much as the 2055, but it is quieter. It also seems to get hot faster (warm to the touch), but since 1979 it has probably only been run for 2 hours, once broke in and relubricated, performance may improve. If the price is in your range, you probably won't be dissapointed.